Coronavirus in Massachusetts (Boston: how much, live, costs)

[porterhouse]

Originally Posted by redplum33

Yes, because you're the expert who just yesterday said all 3 options are excellent choices.

and they still are. you've been a chicken little through this entire thread, and wrong much more often than not.

[GeoffD]

Originally Posted by redplum33

Geoff, when the CDC and the FDA recommend pausing the use of the J&J vaccine, it should be taken seriously.

You already know the outcome. They'll restrict J&J to men and menopausal women and keep collecting safety data while they closely examine the half dozen blood clot cases in younger women.

[yesmaybe]

Originally Posted by GeoffD

You already know the outcome. They'll restrict J&J to men and menopausal women and keep collecting safety data while they closely examine the half dozen blood clot cases in younger women.

Given how fat Americans are, if there's a legit blood clot issue it's probably worth actually taking their time on investigating. Especially after the Baltimore mishap there's probably not a lot of supply left of J&J for the time being.

May as well just roll with Pfizer and Moderna and just hope nothing happens there.

[msRB311]

The vaccines were absolutely rushed.

[GeoffD]

Originally Posted by porterhouse

and they still are. you've been a chicken little through this entire thread, and wrong much more often than not.

I'm not sure which is worse. The "COVID-19 is certain death as is vaccination with a drug that doesn't have a decade of safety history" or "It's just the flu".


For me, I look at the odds. I'm 62. The odds of me dying or getting really sick from COVID-19 are far higher than the odds of having any kind of severe vaccine side effect. I've been slammed for writing this here before but if I were 20 and healthy, the odds are different and I might have a different opinion. I'd get vaccinated mostly to protect the geezer Boomer grandparents and my older Gen-X parents. We live in a country where individual rights often supersede the common good. People are empowered to make poor decisions that harm society as a whole. I may not agree with those poor decisions but we now have a Supreme Court stacked with judges who pick poor individual decisions over the public good.

[OutdoorLover]

Originally Posted by GeoffD

It's fortunate that the two primary mRNA vaccines the United States has been using since December haven't shown these kinds of safety issues.



The Oxford-AstraZeneca blood clot issues have been known for months. The J&J issue with blood clots in pre-menopausal women also appear to be very rare. We've vaccinated over 120 million with at least one jab. As of the first week of April, there were 2,794 deaths among vaccinated people and they were all investigated. There was no evidence that vaccination contributed to any of those deaths. J&J has seen four clotting cases and one death. They've all been women under 45. That's out of 5 million vaccinations. You're more likely to die in a car crash in the 2 weeks after vaccination than to die of blood clots.

Yes. I am not dismissing the need for post-approval vigilance or investigating adverse events, and if it's warranted, modifying the guidelines for use or even withdrawing a product - if it's warranted. But with any vaccine, drug treatment, or surgery, there are risks, and the right way to think about it is what are the risks of getting the vaccine, drug treatment, or surgery, and what are the risks of *not* getting it? Every drug has side effects, every surgery carries risks up to and including death (e.g. from infection or anesthesia), and yet we use all these modalities because they are appropriate when the risk of having the medical treatment is smaller than the risk of not having it. You're not going to find fully risk-free treatments, so one needs to be more nuanced in how they think about this.

[msRB311]

I just think it's crappy that people who are doubtful about the efficacy of this vaccine and the side effects are basically viewed as stupid. People have different reactions to medications and vaccines. Overall I don't feel particularly nervous about the vaccine. I also don't feel that nervous about getting covid.

[GeoffD]

Originally Posted by msRB311

I just think it's crappy that people who are doubtful about the efficacy of this vaccine and the side effects are basically viewed as stupid. People have different reactions to medications and vaccines. Overall I don't feel particularly nervous about the vaccine. I also don't feel that nervous about getting covid.

Yep. I view people who can't analyze data and draw rational conclusions from it as being stupid. Professionally, I certainly would never hire someone who lacked that basic skill.

[msRB311]

No one here cares who you who would or would not hire. You also don't get the privilege of knowing every last thing about the people you hire.

[GeoffD]

Originally Posted by msRB311

No one here cares who you who would or would not hire. You also don't get the privilege of knowing every last thing about the people you hire.

Right, which is why some of them get marched out the door within 90 days after you hire them. I recall doing reference checks on someone once and got glowing "works long hours" and "really diligent". I neglected to ask if they were competent. The guy worked hard but anything he touched was a disaster. Other people had to clean up after him so he was actually producing negative work. He lasted 60 days. You can usually tell in an interview by asking probing questions about what they worked on but that one slipped past me. That happens occasionally. You learn from your mistake and try to screen better the next time.