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So in relation to the topic of this thread, those who believe in Universal Salvation understand that God's judgements are for correction.
Those who believe in eternal torment believe God's judgments are for eternal torture.
Yes; for the Bible speaks of everlasting punishment (in everlasting fire; where there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth) for those who will be at Jesus' left hand in that judgment.
Those who have not been born again have not had their sin nature dealt with.
So, they will be sinning throughout eternity (see, for example, Revelation 16:9-11).
And so, God, being just, must punish them throughout eternity.
It's not like He didn't give them every opportunity to repent and receive His only provision for forgiveness and sanctification.
Yes; for the Bible speaks of everlasting punishment (in everlasting fire; where there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth) for those who will be at Jesus' left hand in that judgment.
Those who have not been born again have not had their sin nature dealt with.
So, they will be sinning throughout eternity (see, for example, Revelation 16:9-11).
And so, God, being just, must punish them throughout eternity.
It's not like He didn't give them every opportunity to repent and receive His only provision for forgiveness and sanctification.
Where do you get this idea that to be just you need not only to punish a sinner but do so for eternity? Do you actually realize that your bible tells us that God's eyes are that pure He cannot look upon evil and iniquity? Do you know what that means ? He's got the ability to look beyond appearances to see only how things ought to be.
Thou art of purer eyes than to behold evil, and canst not look on iniquity: wherefore lookest thou upon them that deal treacherously, and holdest thy tongue when the wicked devoureth the man that is more righteous than he? king James version
Yes; for the Bible speaks of everlasting punishment (in everlasting fire; where there shall be wailing and gnashing of teeth) for those who will be at Jesus' left hand in that judgment.
Those who have not been born again have not had their sin nature dealt with.
So, they will be sinning throughout eternity (see, for example, Revelation 16:9-11).
And so, God, being just, must punish them throughout eternity.
It's not like He didn't give them every opportunity to repent and receive His only provision for forgiveness and sanctification.
They will not sinning forever. You are adding to His word by implying they will sin forever. Ultimately sin and death are destroyed.
Rev 16
9 They were seared by the intense heat and they cursed the name of God, who had control over these plagues, but they refused to repent and glorify him.
10 The fifth angel poured out his bowl on the throne of the beast, and its kingdom was plunged into darkness. People gnawed their tongues in agony
11 and cursed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, but they refused to repent of what they had done.
This is talking about the seven judgments. With them God's wrath is completed and finished. Read Rev 15:1
I saw in heaven another great and marvelous sign: seven angels with the seven last plagues—last, because with them God’s wrath is completed.
So the seven judgments end and so does God's wrath.
Where do you get this idea that to be just you need not only to punish a sinner but do so for eternity? Do you actually realize that your bible tells us that God's eyes are that pure He cannot look upon evil and iniquity? Do you know what that means ? He's got the ability to look beyond appearances to see only how things ought to be.
Thou art of purer eyes than to behold evil, and canst not look on iniquity: wherefore lookest thou upon them that deal treacherously, and holdest thy tongue when the wicked devoureth the man that is more righteous than he? king James version
justbyfaith and many others think that punishment has no purpose other than to punish. Its a very low understanding.
Punishment is always for correction. Just as God's judgements are so the people will learn righteousness.
But in justbyfaith's view, sin prevails forever. What a failed victory!
justbyfaith and many others think that punishment has no purpose other than to punish. Its a very low understanding.
Punishment is always for correction. Just as God's judgements are so the people will learn righteousness.
But in justbyfaith's view, sin prevails forever. What a failed victory!
In my opinion, he's still overwhelmed by the power of sin and death that has been destroyed.
For I know my transgressions, and my sin is always before me. Beliefs about the bible cannot blot sin out. That was Jesus' job and He did it victoriously.
They will not sinning forever. You are adding to His word by implying they will sin forever. Ultimately sin and death are destroyed.
Rev 16
9 They were seared by the intense heat and they cursed the name of God, who had control over these plagues, but they refused to repent and glorify him.
10 The fifth angel poured out his bowl on the throne of the beast, and its kingdom was plunged into darkness. People gnawed their tongues in agony
11 and cursed the God of heaven because of their pains and their sores, but they refused to repent of what they had done.
This is talking about the seven judgments. With them God's wrath is completed and finished. Read Rev 15:1
I saw in heaven another great and marvelous sign: seven angels with the seven last plagues—last, because with them God’s wrath is completed.
So the seven judgments end and so does God's wrath.
They do not repent with the judgments that God throws on them at that time; what makes you think they will repent after having been cast into the lake of fire?
Quote:
Originally Posted by legoman
justbyfaith and many others think that punishment has no purpose other than to punish. Its a very low understanding.
Punishment is always for correction. Just as God's judgments <fify> are so the people will learn righteousness.
But in justbyfaith's view, sin prevails forever. What a failed victory!
There are those who make their rejection of Jesus Christ and His provision for forgiveness and sanctification a permanent thing.
But, even if you have all of eternity to repent, better to do it sooner rather than later.
Because there is no guarantee that you have all of eternity to repent.
It is called the second death (Revelation 20:15); and it is meted out to those whose names are not written in the Lamb's Book of Life.
If you are dead, how do you have any kind of ability to be able to respond to the Lord and repent while you are burning in the lake of fire?
If a man pays all he has for an entire flock of sheep, how many do you think he would take with him?
And how would he take possession of them? Let's say that they are held inside a corral, would he open the gate and let them scatter over the pastures and hills as they all pleased?
Or would he back his truck and trailer to the loading ramp to guide and drive them out of the corral and into the cattle trailer?
If need be, I believe he would take hold of the reluctant ones and drag or carry them inside the trailer until there would not be one sheep left in the corral.
With patience and understanding, he would work with them until he was 100% successful in taking possession of all that he paid for. Not one would be lost or left behind.
If a man pays all he has for an entire flock of sheep, how many do you think he would take with him?
And how would he take possession of them? Let's say that they are held inside a corral, would he open the gate and let them scatter over the pastures and hills as they all pleased?
Or would he back his truck and trailer to the loading ramp to guide and drive them out of the corral and into the cattle trailer?
If need be, I believe he would take hold of the reluctant ones and drag or carry them inside the trailer until there would not be one sheep left in the corral.
With patience and understanding, he would work with them until he was 100% successful in taking possession of all that he paid for. Not one would be lost or left behind.
That is a powerful metaphor.
It makes one question how much the fundamentalist version of god actually values what it has supposedly bought and paid for. Back up the trailer, put down the ramp, wait a little while, and drive off with about 5% of the flock. And this despite knowing that the rest will remain in the pen, starving to death. Taking satisfaction in it even.
Some are unrighteous, and shall not inherit Salvation, the Kingdom 1 Cor 6:9
Know ye not that the unrighteous shall not inherit the kingdom of God? Be not deceived: neither fornicators, nor idolaters, nor adulterers, nor effeminate, nor abusers of themselves with mankind,
So i believe you arew deceived my friend.
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