Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
The Wagner guy is complaining that the promised weapons and ammo never showed up (who could have seen that coming?), and that soldiers in the Russian 77th abandoned their positions leaving Wagner soldiers exposed on that flank.
Video also showed tanks moving along at a good clip through some rough terrain. Videos of tanks bogged down in the mud were on Twitter yesterday. So, looks like things are drying out, in some areas at least.
When you sign a contract with Wagner, you are literally signing with the Devil. You sign your life and rights away, which is an insane concept for a civilized country. They can murder you whenever they like, however they like. Shot in the back in the field, or sledge hammer to the head for the amusement of the company. No court, no judge, your rights and soul have been given to the devil.
See, "former Warsaw pact states" and Ukraine are not one and the same thing.
That's where you are getting confused.
Former Warsaw pact states don't share in the legacy of Russian history, Russian art/music/military/traditions and so on. Ukraine however does - the South-East of the country in particular.
And that's why what you contemptuously call "paid Russian collaborators" - that's your own vision of "black and white," your own projections.
However your opinion does not correspond with reality of things, and of course plenty of Ukrainians didn't want to be second sort of people in the "Western paradise," - the role that many of the listed by you countries accepted, while becoming part of the cheap labor market in EU.
Plenty of South-East Ukrainians wanted to stick with their own culture and traditions, and that's why they took arms, to defend them.
That you want to call them "paid Russian collaborators"- it's on you, not on them.
And the fact that Putin initially betrayed them, most likely means that there will be political changes in Moscow as the direct result of this war.
Will be wasted effort, as it all falls on deaf ears anyway - not yours, erasure - but maybe we should try, for discussion like this, to stop using words Ukrainians and Russians and use word Slavs, or Slavinians. As it drastically changes the understanding of the conflict and why who did what.
Divide et impera. What was done, a major wedge was driven into the Slavs body, to divide and conquer them and let them devour each other. Which is nothing new. Why, do you think, for the last observable thousands of years. "west" was always attacking "east"? Do you even know, that about 5 thousand years ago, there was a catastrophic battle between two genotypes, one being Eastern and one being "western", with boneyard running north to south across the entire modern Europe, roughly west of Beskydy range? Nope, don't teach this in schools, don't write it in "history" textbooks.
s of the devastating argument, why PreBaltic republics went with the West. Quite simple, really. When USSR was destroyed by the 5th column and paid traitor, the previous buffer between Russia and West was up for grabbing by the same forces, that caused that process. Pre Baltic republics, along with Moldova, are DIRT POOR. No significant industrial potential, no natural resources. So, whoever replaced the USSR welfare with grants and loans, bought them for penny on a dime. OF COURSE, now they are paying back their interest on investment. Not to mention, how much collaboration was between the said Balts and Nazi Germany. Plus, the original Balts are not Slavs. So why would they side with Russia?
But, the kicker is - you just wait, till EU faLLS APART AND nato CRUMBLES. Damn the darn caps button. Same "bastion of the West" will run back to the "eternal; enemy" in heartbeat.
No, ukr is saying stupid things? Well, do your due diligence and research, what was GDP and other country metrics for ex Warsaw Pact republics before they joined West and IMF and WTB - and after. Leave Poland alone. It has always been a powerful country. I am talking about the small republics with overgrown ambitions of their leaders.
Pre Baltic republics, along with Moldova, are DIRT POOR. No significant industrial potential, no natural resources.
The Baltics are strong in human resources and have repositioned themselves as IT and scientific development hubs. And are doing very nicely with that pathway instead of leaning on commodity export.
When you sign a contract with Wagner, you are literally signing with the Devil. You sign your life and rights away, which is an insane concept for a civilized country. They can murder you whenever they like, however they like. Shot in the back in the field, or sledge hammer to the head for the amusement of the company. No court, no judge, your rights and soul have been given to the devil.
Will be wasted effort, as it all falls on deaf ears anyway - not yours, erasure - but maybe we should try, for discussion like this, to stop using words Ukrainians and Russians and use word Slavs, or Slavinians. As it drastically changes the understanding of the conflict and why who did what.
[…]
You forgot to add that Russia thinks it is the Slavic master race to rule all other Slavs.
Good question:
It is because there are men who have experience with war and crave more of it. Wagner gives Russia the ability to make murderous mischief in countries like Mali, Syria and Central African Republic. Gaining military control of those places is central to Russia's desire to expand the fortunes of their various oligarchs, one of whom own Wagner.
Wagner soldiers can do anything they please, because officially their jobs do not exist. After all, if women are violated and prisoners are shot by Wagner, how can Russia be held accountable?
Read the story of Marat Gabidullin, who was a Wagner soldier. He fought in Syria and was asked to fight in Ukraine. LINK!
There will never be real security in the world until Russia with its Wagner army are impoverished. The lack of munitions and support supplied to Wagner indicates the demise or even collapse of Russia is coming.
Quote:
"In Syria, one goal was to quickly achieve victory," he says. "But the second goal that was just as important, was to hide the number of losses that the Russian military had in that campaign. Because we wanted to create an image of a strong Russian military that achieved victory at a small cost."
But it was all deception, he says. The cost was huge, but no one will ever know the real numbers. In fact, experts say, often it's Wagner Group soldiers on the front lines — so their losses are higher than the regular army's, and private armies go uncounted.
Good question:
It is because there are men who have experience with war and crave more of it. Wagner gives Russia the ability to make murderous mischief in countries like Mali, Syria and Central African Republic. Gaining military control of those places is central to Russia's desire to expand the fortunes of their various oligarchs, one of whom own Wagner.
Wagner soldiers can do anything they please, because officially their jobs do not exist. After all, if women are violated and prisoners are shot by Wagner, how can Russia be held accountable?
Read the story of Marat Gabidullin, who was a Wagner soldier. He fought in Syria and was asked to fight in Ukraine. LINK!
There will never be real security in the world until Russia with its Wagner army are impoverished. The lack of munitions and support supplied to Wagner indicates the demise or even collapse of Russia is coming.
The other thing to remember about Wagner is they typically get a cut of the resources they conquer. So they get a cut of gas/oil wells, mines, etc. like the Mob. They will send their mercenaries to get your oil field or mine back, but now they are part owners too.
Man....Russian lines are simply collapsing. The video of those soldiers retreating/running away speaks volumes of their morale. Apparently all Ukraine has to do is make it look like an offensive and these guys are going to bolt.
Good question:.. The lack of munitions and support supplied to Wagner indicates the demise or even collapse of Russia is coming.
Sure looks that way.
Read something earlier on about how chasing soldiers from the front lines back through the rest of the soldiers creates a panic in which everyone is ready to surrender at the first sign they are under attack.
Last edited by GotHereQuickAsICould; 05-10-2023 at 09:39 AM..
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
