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Improving racism has nothing to do with guilt. It's all about educating people about others different from them.
The best way is to have different groups together, getting used to each other, and finding what is in common with us all (what unifies us). Whenever folks run off somewhere else to escape the races, or put up road blocks to keep others down, they just aggravate the situation.
Reducing racism is doable, but not when people focus on irrelevant factors. Also, instead of singling out any group for blame, we should see that we are all part of the problem and solution. The blame game is childish. We're all responsible for making things better.
Noble thoughts but the various "I'd like to buy the world a Coke" approaches never work. They never work because they're Pollyannaish and unspecific. And because there are real differences between groups and between people.
If the blame game is childish why do adults play it so much? It's true, we're all parts of solutions and problems but of different ones. Racism already has been reduced and is asymptotically approaching it's lower limit.
The road blocks you see could just as easily be stepping stones for those to climb who can. No worthwhile achievement is ever easy. Blaming others for our failures just ensures we'll keep making them.
It amazes me that the racial group in control thinks they are suffering so badly.
Did it ever occur to you that your beliefs about "the racial group in control" might be seen as patronizing, and therefore offensive, by an accomplished non-white person (such as, say, Dr Ben Carson)?
Did it ever occur to you that your beliefs about "the racial group in control" might be seen as patronizing, and therefore offensive, by an accomplished non-white person (such as, say, Dr Ben Carson)?
I could care less what Ben Carson thinks about anything.
We tried to get him to come an speak at our middle school, and he wouldn't come because there weren't "enough" Black students.
There are such things as brilliant fools.
And I have worked with many African-American educators up to the level of superintendent who would not agree with your viewpoint at all.
Noble thoughts but the various "I'd like to buy the world a Coke" approaches never work. They never work because they're Pollyannaish and unspecific. And because there are real differences between groups and between people.
If the blame game is childish why do adults play it so much? It's true, we're all parts of solutions and problems but of different ones. Racism already has been reduced and is asymptotically approaching it's lower limit.
The road blocks you see could just as easily be stepping stones for those to climb who can. No worthwhile achievement is ever easy. Blaming others for our failures just ensures we'll keep making them.
How could these "road blacks" just as easily be "stepping stones"
Be specific.
Quote:
Today, we announce the outcome of the Department of Justice’s investigation of the
Baltimore City Police Department (BPD).1 After engaging in a thorough investigation, initiated at
the request of the City of Baltimore and BPD, the Department of Justice concludes that there is
reasonable cause to believe that BPD engages in a pattern or practice of conduct that violates the
Constitution or federal law. BPD engages in a pattern or practice of:
(1) making unconstitutional stops, searches, and arrests;
(2) using enforcement strategies that produce severe and unjustified disparities in the rates of
stops, searches and arrests of African Americans
Ferguson’s law enforcement practices are shaped by the City’s focus on revenue rather
than by public safety needs. This emphasis on revenue has compromised the institutional
character of Ferguson’s police department, contributing to a pattern of unconstitutional policing,
and has also shaped its municipal court, leading to procedures that raise due process concerns
and inflict unnecessary harm on members of the Ferguson community. Further, Ferguson’s
police and municipal court practices both reflect and exacerbate existing racial bias, including
racial stereotypes. Ferguson’s own data establish clear racial disparities that adversely impact
African Americans. The evidence shows that discriminatory intent is part of the reason for these
disparities. Over time, Ferguson’s police and municipal court practices have sown deep mistrust
between parts of the community and the police department, undermining law enforcement
legitimacy among African Americans in particular.
I could care less what Ben Carson thinks about anything.
I took him as an example of a non-white neurosurgeon (not as a politician), since he happens to be widely known so would probably be known to you as well; however, I know one other black neurosurgeon, and multiple black general surgeons - ALL of them would be offended by anybody's patronizing attitude. But I guess you could care less what they think about anything; it's more self-gratifying to see black people as "underprivileged" and forever dependent upon charity from the whites.
I took him as an example of a non-white neurosurgeon (not as a politician), since he happens to be widely known so would probably be known to you as well; however, I know one other black neurosurgeon, and multiple black general surgeons - ALL of them would be offended by anybody's patronizing attitude. But I guess you could care less what they think about anything; it's more self-gratifying to see black people as "underprivileged" and forever dependent upon charity from the whites.
I'm sure there are people like those that you point out, but I wouldn't say they are in the mainstream of Black culture.
I don't understand the concept of white guilt. I guess it is because I grew up in an area of the country where white people are a minority. I was lower middle class, living in South Florida. My parents couldn't afford private school, so I attended public schools where the ratio was 30 percent white. All of my friends were black. I never saw the systemic racism that the left raves about. What I saw was gangs and thug culture destroying families. Once I got older, I joined the Navy. Again, there wasn't any shred of racism there. Because I was raised in a low income part of the country, I could clearly see the problems faced by Blacks. It seems that the rest of the country is unable to separate the culture, from the people, and have lumped black people into the same group as thugs and gang bangers. This couldn't be further from the truth. Instead of isolating, and fixing this problem, media has glorified it, and it has gotten worse. It is to the point that young black kids are fighting police officers now, brainwashed that fighting the "man" is something to be proud of. Ignorant of the fact that they are ruining there future adult lives.
Until we as a country are strong enough to face the real demons that need to be fought, we won't improve anything. White guilt is just another excuse to shift the blame.
We need to legalize marijuana across the U.S. (How many are locked up for simple drug possession.)
We need to recognize that individuals have an inherent right to self defense. (In many states, carry a baseball bat in your car is illegal.)
We need to change the educational culture, from one of acquiring degrees, to one that tailors education to the individuals strengths, and to a jobs actual requirements. (How many kids drop out because they are weak in one subject, like math, and are then barred from further education because they didn't finish high school.)
I never saw the systemic racism that the left raves about.
Quote:
Originally Posted by CBeisbol
Quote:
Today, we announce the outcome of the Department of Justice’s investigation of the
Baltimore City Police Department (BPD).1 After engaging in a thorough investigation, initiated at
the request of the City of Baltimore and BPD, the Department of Justice concludes that there is
reasonable cause to believe that BPD engages in a pattern or practice of conduct that violates the
Constitution or federal law. BPD engages in a pattern or practice of:
(1) making unconstitutional stops, searches, and arrests;
(2) using enforcement strategies that produce severe and unjustified disparities in the rates of
stops, searches and arrests of African Americans
Ferguson’s law enforcement practices are shaped by the City’s focus on revenue rather
than by public safety needs. This emphasis on revenue has compromised the institutional
character of Ferguson’s police department, contributing to a pattern of unconstitutional policing,
and has also shaped its municipal court, leading to procedures that raise due process concerns
and inflict unnecessary harm on members of the Ferguson community. Further, Ferguson’s
police and municipal court practices both reflect and exacerbate existing racial bias, including
racial stereotypes. Ferguson’s own data establish clear racial disparities that adversely impact
African Americans. The evidence shows that discriminatory intent is part of the reason for these
disparities. Over time, Ferguson’s police and municipal court practices have sown deep mistrust
between parts of the community and the police department, undermining law enforcement
legitimacy among African Americans in particular.
Camping in the Southwest a few years ago, a Native American guy came by asking for money, and kept talking about "my people" and "your people". I was rather annoyed, since his complaints were about things that happened long before any of my relatives arrived in this country. I guess I'm to be held responsible for anything any white person has done, ever.
Quote:
Originally Posted by chiluvr1228
I am white, my family came here from Italy in the early 1900's. They never owned slaves or had anything to do with slavery. I have no "white guilt" and I think it's a ridiculous premise. Even if I was the daughter of previous slave owners I am not responsible for what they did.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 509
White guilt??
I immigrated to this country in the 1950's. I have no guilt, as a Latino of European origin. I suspect most Americans have a family history that starts AFTER the period of slavery.
Why should I accept guilt?.
Okay. Well, I actually do know that one of my ancestors owned slaves.
Yup ... In Virginia; late 1700’s - early 1800’s. A guy by the name of Garth. He was my great-great-great-great-grandfather. One of the 64, 4th great-grandparents that I have. So; 1.56% of my DNA came from a slave owner.
Do I owe more guilt than those posters quoted above me, who’s ancestors did NOT own slaves?
Do I owe ... something else? These are not rhetorical questions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by phetaroi
You have a responsibility toward today's America.
Everyone who carries US citizenship has a responsibility towards today’s America. And blacks. Hispanics. Gay. WASP. Whatever & whoever. If you are afforded due process in court, you are responsible. If you have a job, you are responsible. If you are on welfare, you are responsible. I have no problem being responsible towards today’s & tomorrow’s America.
Will somebody please tell me what that means, within the context of “white privilege”?
I’m not a landlord; I have no influence over who gets to live in what neighborhood.
I’m not a school administrator; I have no influence over who gets to attend what schools.
I’m not a hiring manager nor am I an employer; I have no influence over who gets what job.
I’m not a law enforcement officer, not a judge & not a lawmaker; I have no influence over who gets arrested, shot, convicted, sentenced or executed... for a crime.
I AM a voter. And I have never voted against civil rights. I have voted against welfare reform measures that would have affected minorities. I’ve voted against criminal justice measures that would have affected minorities. I’ve voted against white candidates in local elections in favor of the black candidate because the black guy was the best guy for the job. And guilt did not motivate any of this. Who I am did.
And I AM a mother. Who’s children will tell you that I “walk my talk”. They know I am the same person behind closed doors that I am in public. And that person is not a bigot. I won’t tolerate a bigot under my roof & hopefully haven’t raised any. And guilt did not motivate any of this, either. Who I am did.
What would you have from me that has not been given? Am I “holding out” on somebody? An entire race? Again; not rhetorical questions.
Okay. Well, I actually do know that one of my ancestors owned slaves.
Yup ... In Virginia; late 1700’s - early 1800’s. A guy by the name of Garth. He was my great-great-great-great-grandfather. One of the 64, 4th great-grandparents that I have. So; 1.56% of my DNA came from a slave owner.
Do I owe more guilt than those posters quoted above me, who’s ancestors did NOT own slaves?
Do I owe ... something else? These are not rhetorical questions.
Everyone who carries US citizenship has a responsibility towards today’s America. And blacks. Hispanics. Gay. WASP. Whatever & whoever. If you are afforded due process in court, you are responsible. If you have a job, you are responsible. If you are on welfare, you are responsible. I have no problem being responsible towards today’s & tomorrow’s America.
Will somebody please tell me what that means, within the context of “white privilege”?
I’m not a landlord; I have no influence over who gets to live in what neighborhood.
I’m not a school administrator; I have no influence over who gets to attend what schools.
I’m not a hiring manager nor am I an employer; I have no influence over who gets what job.
I’m not a law enforcement officer, not a judge & not a lawmaker; I have no influence over who gets arrested, shot, convicted, sentenced or executed... for a crime.
I AM a voter. And I have never voted against civil rights. I have voted against welfare reform measures that would have affected minorities. I’ve voted against criminal justice measures that would have affected minorities. I’ve voted against white candidates in local elections in favor of the black candidate because the black guy was the best guy for the job. And guilt did not motivate any of this. Who I am did.
And I AM a mother. Who’s children will tell you that I “walk my talk”. They know I am the same person behind closed doors that I am in public. And that person is not a bigot. I won’t tolerate a bigot under my roof & hopefully haven’t raised any. And guilt did not motivate any of this, either. Who I am did.
What would you have from me that has not been given? Am I “holding out” on somebody? An entire race? Again; not rhetorical questions.
That's one of the better posts in this threads, and I'll tell you why I think so: it shows you are actually thinking.
I'm not going to try to answer it in any way that is about you personally. But I am going to give you a very broad answer.
Yesterday when I was going into a grocery store, a couple of men were handing out little candy bars and raising money for some children's' charity that dealt with special needs. I wasn't paying much attention until one of the men called me by name. We chatted for a bit, and I went on my way. I was impressed because this man was involved in raising funds to help children he would never know, and he and his wife don't have any special needs kids. I also happen to know that this same man delivers meals on wheels to people, none of whom he knows. And he works other charities as well. The point is that he works for these charities which in no way benefits him or his relatives. It is totally selfless. Compare that to mothers at my school (before I retired) who raised funds for gifted children...because their children were gifted. I wouldn't go so far as to say they were selfish, but their charity was not selfless.
None of us can give of ourselves for every good cause. And improving race relations may not be a particular person's "thing", but they do other selfless things for people. That's fine. But there are way too many people who moan and groan (on forums like this, on one side or the other) about race relations that have never done and will never do anything to improve race relationships. They care enough to run their mouths, but they don't care enough to do anything.
I've told this little story in the education sub-forum, but I'll tell it again here. One day I called a teacher in and asked why, when I would look into her math classroom after school, the only kids in that classroom were White kids, even though reviewing her grades showed that those white kids were mostly getting C's and above. Meanwhile a number of Black and Latino students were getting D's and F's, but they never stayed after school. Her response was that for the kids who are staying after she had called their parents and told them they needed to stay for extra help. "Did you call the parents of the Black and Latino kids who are getting D's and F's?" "Well, no, because you know they won't stay." And this was not an isolated incident. You don't make much of a difference if you raise a C student to a B, but you make a heck of a difference if you raise a failing student to a C.
Again, I'm not answering this about you personally.
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