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Pneuma i know there is balance to it somewhere . I just can't bring myself to say with enough conviction it's one or the other.
I don't want to be flippant about it and say it means this when there seems(it only seems to be) to be a conflict with it.
Jesus said learn of me for i am meek and humble in heart. He also said i am the way, reality and the life , He also said He's the good shepherd.
I do not think we can intrepet the I AM's any other way in which it is written of Him, maybe we are misinterpreting the OT in the light that the word tells us Jesus is the exact representation of His being
My opinion (and that's all it is) is to have the same attitude as Jesus , if we act out how we perceive(perceiving through our carnal minds) God through the OT we are building on sinking sand.
Yes, if we look through carnal eyes - we can't see God.
Yes that's true , that is why i said i do not have enough conviction to plainly state one way or the other , to do otherwise would be foolish of me.
Scriptures tell us that Jesus is a stumbling-stone. I believe that is what happens when we interpret His words literally and the things that He did in by impression. Consider when Jesus tells His disciples to bring a sword and Peter replies that he has two. Jesus then says that is "enough". Peter makes the mistake of interpreting Jesus' words literally and then carries a sword and uses it. This is the problem the Israelites had in that they followed the image of the Spiritual that was created to communicate the Spiritual. They gave reverence to tables of stone instead of what those were to communicate which was the Spirit written in fleshy tables of the heart. Many "churches" are making this mistake today when they denounce those that do not partake of water baptisms and such. They think you can't be saved unless you do - hence they make the same mistake the pharisees did by making carnal observances a necessity to salvation.
Scriptures tell us that Jesus is a stumbling-stone. I believe that is what happens when we interpret His words literally and the things that He did in by impression. Consider when Jesus tells His disciples to bring a sword and Peter replies that he has two. Jesus then says that is "enough". Peter makes the mistake of interpreting Jesus' words literally and then carries a sword and uses it. This is the problem the Israelites had in that they followed the image of the Spiritual that was created to communicate the Spiritual. They gave reverence to tables of stone instead of what those were to communicate which was the Spirit written in fleshy tables of the heart. Many "churches" are making this mistake today when they denounce those that do not partake of water baptisms and such. They think you can't be saved unless you do - hence they make the same mistake the pharisees did by making carnal observances a necessity to salvation.
Paul
trepp i do not want to get into you with it .
But if Jesus says He is life , that is exactly what He means . Of cause there are scriptures that are not to be taken literal like your example. If Jesus says He will draw all men unto Him i believe it literally just in the same way i would that He desires all to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth.
Please do not try and talk down to me as if i do not know what the carnal mind is .
Pneuma i know there is balance to it somewhere . I just can't bring myself to say with enough conviction it's one or the other.
I don't want to be flippant about it and say it means this when there seems(it only seems to be) to be a conflict with it.
Jesus said learn of me for i am meek and humble in heart. He also said i am the way, reality and the life , He also said He's the good shepherd.
I do not think we can intrepet the I AM's any other way in which it is written of Him, maybe we are misinterpreting the OT in the light that the word tells us Jesus is the exact representation of His being
My opinion (and that's all it is) is to have the same attitude as Jesus , if we act out how we perceive(perceiving through our carnal minds) God through the OT we are building on sinking sand.
I know how you feel brother, I to am searching, whether other beleive it or not, iron sharpens iron as the scriptures say.
I posted this in another thread about viewing the OT.
Israel of old could not see to the end of their salvation, thus they wrote in shadow, believed in shadow, and knew in shadow, but Christ came and did away with the shadow because He is the light and what He said of the Father shows the Father in a different light then what the scribes wrote of the Father. Therefore I stand on the light Christ gave of the Father and any other view then His(Christs) is nothing but a shadow of the truth.
[SIZE=3] [/SIZE]
What they were told to do by God they took literally and dashed the little ones against the stones, then wrote in the scriptures the reason they did this was because God TOLD THEM TO DO IT.
But that was not what God was really saying to them.
They took what was spiritually spoken then went out and killed in the NAME of God thinking to do God a service.
And people reading the scriptures still do this today, seeing God says something in the scriptures that is contrary to His nature and saying see GOD DID IT or THIS IS OF GOD. Thus attributing any EVIL or SIN to God in any fashion or by way of IMPLICATION as so many do imo is understanding things still after the shadow.
But if Jesus says He is life , that is exactly what He means . Of cause there are scriptures that are not to be taken literal like your example. If Jesus says He will draw all men unto Him i believe it literally just in the same way i would that He desires all to be saved and to come to a knowledge of the truth.
Please do not try and talk down to me as if i do not know what the carnal mind is .
I was not attempting in any manner to talk down to you as if you didn't know what the carnal mind was. Sorry you were offended. I do NOT literally believe that Jesus is drawing all men to Him - Literally but believe He meant it Spiritually.
I was not attempting in any manner to talk down to you as if you didn't know what the carnal mind was. Sorry you were offended. I do NOT literally believe that Jesus is drawing all men to Him - Literally but believe He meant it Spiritually.
Paul
So what is not literal about Jesus saying He is the way,reality and the life ?.
But he meant it literally spiritually ? The whole revelation of God is spiritual.
I know how you feel brother, I to am searching, whether other beleive it or not, iron sharpens iron as the scriptures say.
I posted this in another thread about viewing the OT.
Israel of old could not see to the end of their salvation, thus they wrote in shadow, believed in shadow, and knew in shadow, but Christ came and did away with the shadow because He is the light and what He said of the Father shows the Father in a different light then what the scribes wrote of the Father. Therefore I stand on the light Christ gave of the Father and any other view then His(Christs) is nothing but a shadow of the truth.
[SIZE=3] [/SIZE]
What they were told to do by God they took literally and dashed the little ones against the stones, then wrote in the scriptures the reason they did this was because God TOLD THEM TO DO IT.
But that was not what God was really saying to them.
They took what was spiritually spoken then went out and killed in the NAME of God thinking to do God a service.
And people reading the scriptures still do this today, seeing God says something in the scriptures that is contrary to His nature and saying see GOD DID IT or THIS IS OF GOD. Thus attributing any EVIL or SIN to God in any fashion or by way of IMPLICATION as so many do imo is understanding things still after the shadow.
So what is not literal about Jesus saying He is the way,reality and the life ?.
But he meant it literally spiritually ? The whole revelation of God is spiritual.
No that is because it speaks to spiritual things. It is when He speaks to physical things that we should have concern - like the example, I gave where He speaks concerning a "sword".
No that is because it speaks to spiritual things. It is when He speaks to physical things that we should have concern - like the example, I gave where He speaks concerning a "sword".
Paul
Well trettep Rebuking James and John for asking top call for fire from heaven and telling them they know not what spirit they are of , Is this physical ?
How do you reconcile this with Elijah doing the same thing Jesus rebuked James and John for ?.
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