[Corrie22]

Originally Posted by Travelassie

Notice the graphic comes from newspaper opinion piece. I'd have to look at the original study to be anything other than skeptical about what's presented. And see how old it is.

dates are important....

"A few years ago, just before COVID hit, a Stanford University study of state-level standardized tests showed that Florida’s “learning rate” was the worst in the country"

"Florida students learned 12 percent less each year from third to eighth grade than the national average from 2009 to 2018."

Originally Posted by vaughanwilliams

From the same Florida newspaper.
https://www.tampabay.com/news/2023/0...-ranking-no-1/

US News ranks Florida No. 1 for education

"Florida has held the No. 1 ranking for higher education from U.S. News since 2017."

"The distinction draws praise from state officials and criticism from those opposed to this year’s controversial legislation on schools."

"After an acrimonious legislative session with a spate of education bills that saw fierce pushback from students and faculty, Florida was deemed the No. 1 state for education in U.S. News & World Report’s annual ranking."

"The ranking, announced this week, was largely based on Florida’s public higher education system, which scored above other states on metrics including graduation rates, cost of degrees and student debt. The state’s pre-K-12 system ranked No. 14, based on high school graduation rates, preschool enrollment rates and results of the National Assessment of Educational Progress, among other measurements."

"The report stated that the average Floridian graduated from college with around $5,000 less in student debt and the high school graduation rate was about 4 percentage points higher than the national average."

[bluskyz]

IMHO many of the the posts concerning Fla. have more or less accurate content.
I understand why some point to the phycological reasons for the very different civic atmosphere of Fla. residence. It is not just imagined--it imo is very real. For example, many living here have relocated to escape issues they think will improve by moving to their conceived "paradise." We tolerate them nearly daily in some way or another.

Via the powers that be, Fla. is not noted for being a law and order type of place. It could be somewhat improved if law enforcement did the job it is paid to do--enforce the law. Seems like the police are stymied by their own Fla. culture. They are pretty good at picking up after the fact pieces---but are failures at prevention of many obvious calamities. Motor vehicle law enforcement is a glaring example.

Yes, incivility is alive and well in Fla. Other places have their share as well. However, I think they may get away with it a bit more frequently and easier in the "Sunshine state."

[vaughanwilliams]

Originally Posted by bluskyz

IMHO many of the the posts concerning Fla. have more or less accurate content.
I understand why some point to the phycological reasons for the very different civic atmosphere of Fla. residence. It is not just imagined--it imo is very real. For example, many living here have relocated to escape issues they think will improve by moving to their conceived "paradise." We tolerate them nearly daily in some way or another.

Via the powers that be, Fla. is not noted for being a law and order type of place. It could be somewhat improved if law enforcement did the job it is paid to do--enforce the law. Seems like the police are stymied by their own Fla. culture. They are pretty good at picking up after the fact pieces---but are failures at prevention of many obvious calamities. Motor vehicle law enforcement is a glaring example.

Yes, incivility is alive and well in Fla. Other places have their share as well. However, I think they may get away with it a bit more frequently and easier in the "Sunshine state."

I agree about the law and order issues. Some of it may be tied to the hospitality industries (don't hassle the tourists or else) and drunk driving/driving with a suspended license and every other moving infraction is almost treated like a sporting event. From what I read, this is happening all over, though. Not only are there staffing shortages but police are cautions about enforcing the law for fear of losing their job or actually being prosecuted for doing their job. There's a lot of DAs and judges and politicians out there that hate law enforcement. Just look at New York and California.

[achtung baby]

Part of it is the beach culture.

Beach culture generally tends to attract slackers, party people, people who are on shady side, predators ( when you have tourism-driven and hedonistic pleasure as a selling point.) and people who escape from their problems because they think tropical island culture is end-all/be-all “happy ending” as the pop culture made us believe.

Florida is kind of a poor man’s Bahamas/Cayman Island/Bora Bora. For those who can’t afford and can’t move to these islands, Florida is the domestic answer to their escapism. I’m sure there are many down-to-earth, grounded and intelligent people, native and otherwise, in Florida but unfortunately the obnoxious and shady ones seem to be making the most noise, and that’s what most people recall and form the opinion from.

I know a couple in FL. Husband is a lawyer and was thrown in jail once for the “contempt” at court. He filed for bankruptcy, twice. Wife is a nurse practitioner, also filed bankruptcy (before she met the husband.)-both appeared to be well-educated and gainfully-employed on paper, but I can’t help but made the association of them moving to FL with their 3 bankruptcies.

In my one year living in FL, we also felt we had to be “vigilant” around certain vendors (HVAC, moving companies, contractors….etc.) and have everything documented in writing. Our house was 2 yrs old but somehow the central air was shut down in the middle of August. Technicians came, advised us paying up to $3000 for the UV light installed inside the a/c, claimed it would be life time warranty and could be uninstalled when/if we moved.-when we were moving and contacting the company for the procedure as was “advised”, they came back and said it must have been a misunderstanding “on the dispatcher’s part”.-We had $3000 UV light for less than 2.5 months.

We were in a very good position financially but it was still a bummer. Mostly it made you suspicious of the words of whoever you crossed path with in FL, you sometimes thought of the worst in people and became concerned if it was a scam/fraud/lie from others. If we felt that way, I can’t imagine people who were struggling or very frugal or couldn’t afford dropping $3000 extra cash.-Things like this will make you cranky, frustrated and snappy.

You’d think a beach-y, tropical, resort-y, nautical, maritime and sunny state will make people more relaxed and open, and while I came across many nice and kind people, I did sense a general detachment and indifference (if not rudeness) shown in many people in FL.

[firmbizzle]

Because most Floridians move to escape their problems. Problems they bring with them to Florida. Change happens from within, not by moving to Florida.

[jmellc]

[quote=ainsley1999;65533061]Part of it is the beach culture.

Beach culture generally tends to attract slackers, party people, people who are on shady side, predators ( when you have tourism-driven and hedonistic pleasure as a selling point.) and people who escape from their problems because they think tropical island culture is end-all/be-all “happy ending” as the pop culture made us believe.

Florida is kind of a poor man’s Bahamas/Cayman Island/Bora Bora. For those who can’t afford and can’t move to these islands, Florida is the domestic answer to their escapism. I’m sure there are many down-to-earth, grounded and intelligent people, native and otherwise, in Florida but unfortunately the obnoxious and shady ones seem to be making the most noise, and that’s what most people recall and form the opinion from.



See my earlier post about my cousin who lived in Newport Richey for several years. I had forgotten a lot of details but your first 2 paragraphs sound very similar. I think she said some lowlife people went there to escape the law and hide out. She may have seen her ex as one of them. Her son lives in Kissimmee and said he never heard that from her or anyone else. But yes, party life/culture tends to bring out the seamy side of people. Lots of drinking and drugs, etc. What could go wrong? A couple of other cousins live somewhere in the state but I have been long out of touch with them.

My one trip to Florida was with the family to visit Disney some years back. Orlando and Kissimmee seemed like OK towns but we were only short term visitors too. Not making a living or raising a family there.

[Corrie22]

don't over think it....

most people in Florida are from somewhere else....they don't have the network.... roots, family, and friends to ground them

they are still firmly attached to where ever it is they are from

[MOforthewin]

[quote=jmellc;65536723]

Originally Posted by ainsley1999

Part of it is the beach culture.

Beach culture generally tends to attract slackers, party people, people who are on shady side, predators ( when you have tourism-driven and hedonistic pleasure as a selling point.) and people who escape from their problems because they think tropical island culture is end-all/be-all “happy ending” as the pop culture made us believe.

Florida is kind of a poor man’s Bahamas/Cayman Island/Bora Bora. For those who can’t afford and can’t move to these islands, Florida is the domestic answer to their escapism. I’m sure there are many down-to-earth, grounded and intelligent people, native and otherwise, in Florida but unfortunately the obnoxious and shady ones seem to be making the most noise, and that’s what most people recall and form the opinion from.



See my earlier post about my cousin who lived in Newport Richey for several years. I had forgotten a lot of details but your first 2 paragraphs sound very similar. I think she said some lowlife people went there to escape the law and hide out. She may have seen her ex as one of them. Her son lives in Kissimmee and said he never heard that from her or anyone else. But yes, party life/culture tends to bring out the seamy side of people. Lots of drinking and drugs, etc. What could go wrong? A couple of other cousins live somewhere in the state but I have been long out of touch with them.

My one trip to Florida was with the family to visit Disney some years back. Orlando and Kissimmee seemed like OK towns but we were only short term visitors too. Not making a living or raising a family there.

New Port Richey has a lot of shady places. Live PD has it on a lot. I see them down here in Punta Gorda and Southwest FL too. Drifters.

Think about it. Places like Florida (Orlando on south), southern California have a lot of home people, drifters. It's warm most of the year in these places. So at worst if you're a druggy bouncing around from place to place and such then it's not so bad living outside versus 10 degrees.

I see lots of addicts here in Southwest Florida. Again, warm. If you're stuck sleeping outside it isn't as bad.

[LKJ1988]

Originally Posted by Corrie22

don't over think it....

most people in Florida are from somewhere else....they don't have the network.... roots, family, and friends to ground them

they are still firmly attached to where ever it is they are from

Not me. I was born in this dry hell hole nicole. I stay upset with all the BS that goes on here.

[gatorlyn]

A lot of loonies think they can hide-out and/or operate under the radar within Florida's sunny and beach communities. My assumption has always been is that they like to prey on the gobs and gobs of tourons, new arrivals, seniors, that appear to be in vacation-mode in FL

It's not limited to poor and broke loonies too. Some rich oddballs and eccentrics, the unsavory kind, also see FL as a hiding spot, for the exact same reasons