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If by 'social Justice' you mean becoming Christians and following their rules, I agree. The agenda of the church of the time was their agenda too.
The fact that the NT mentions antichrists is proof to me that there was another church forming alongside of it which was missing the true message. This second church became the traditional one.
I wouldn't exactly call the major prophets stories. Or any of the wisdom books.
The Psalms. Proverbs. Job. Ezekiel. These are books. I read them as independent books.
Have you ever even read the Song of Solomon?
Books are also stories. Thanks for trying to explain however I am none the wiser if what you mean as a mixture of literature. Poems, short stories, books ,Ballard's all tell stories.
The fact that the NT mentions antichrists is proof to me that there was another church forming alongside of it which was missing the true message. This second church became the traditional one.
Sometimes Jesus to me sounds like an atheist.
The early Christians were regarded (by the Roman state religion) much as atheists are regarded by American Christianity now. We are in the same position they were, though thankfully the Church is not the political power. Otherwise Atheists would be in a far worse position than they are. They are regarded much as Tacitus described Christians - a thing from which all evil flows, but atheism isn't actually illegal. Which a Christian theocracy would certainly decide it had to be - for the good of our Souls, of course!
I have seen a bit of argument about the idea of the Antichrist, and \i seem to recall it's pretty a figure of Revelation. I will admit that I regard it as almost useless in understanding the Bible and have not studied it much. I will also admit that people who want to preach to me about what's in revelation will get as much attention from me as those who want to argue a flat earth or a 6,000 year -old earth.
The early Christians were regarded (by the Roman state religion) much as atheists are regarded by American Christianity now. We are in the same position they were, though thankfully the Church is not the political power. Otherwise Atheists would be in a far worse position than they are. They are regarded much as Tacitus described Christians - a thing from which all evil flows, but atheism isn't actually illegal. Which a Christian theocracy would certainly decide it had to be - for the good of our Souls, of course!
I have seen a bit of argument about the idea of the Antichrist, and \i seem to recall it's pretty a figure of Revelation. I will admit that I regard it as almost useless in understanding the Bible and have not studied it much. I will also admit that people who want to preach to me about what's in revelation will get as much attention from me as those who want to argue a flat earth or a 6,000 year -old earth.
Revelation was exactly that. Dreams and visions from an early Christian. Someone who had a gift with words and was able to describe his own thoughts. I don't think it can analyzed in literal word for word translation, as if each symbol means one thing. I have heard the best way to read it is just not try to analyze it, but just get an impression of how it feels. The writer might not have even understood everything he wrote down. Like many poets today. Most people can't interpret their own dreams much less someone else's from thousands of years ago.
But I do think that the lake of fire is the burning temple which their God ideally wants to disappear from their minds, at least physically. Hebrews talks about the temple of heaven, which to me is the temple in the mind. Physical temples are good, but they are not holy in themselves.
But I don't think that fundamentalists are worse than the non-literal theists. So even if we did understand the original intent of the Bible it wasn't necessarily the best one. Maybe the fundamentalists have their own knowledge. (And I'm not talking about the ones who want to convert others.)
Lake of fire fire -burning temple..interesting idea, but I'm not convinced. A 'feel' for it is one way of approaching it, and understanding perhaps how the writer felt, but understanding where he go the stuff from is another matter. I don't believe that he just dreamed it all up (far less it was divinely revealed to him ) I have an idea that the symbolism of Daniel and some Dead sea scrolls might give us some clues.
Lake of fire fire -burning temple..interesting idea, but I'm not convinced. A 'feel' for it is one way of approaching it, and understanding perhaps how the writer felt, but understanding where he go the stuff from is another matter. I don't believe that he just dreamed it all up (far less it was divinely revealed to him ) I have an idea that the symbolism of Daniel and some Dead sea scrolls might give us some clues.
Yes, it was definitely more than just his original ideas. I think it was always 100% political. Read the final chapters of Daniel for a good laugh, though I do like Daniel otherwise. The god of all creation was obviously involved in their politics back then, just like today. But maybe even more so back then. lol
It's a story. What do the same kinds of things in your own dreams represent?
Mainstream Bible scholars have already identified the New Testament as being inspired by the 2nd temple destruction. Just like the 1st temple inspired much of the Old Testament. This is decades or centuries old theology, not something I invented.
To me, it's the only possible thing that even makes sense.
Yes, the Christians believed the destruction of the temple was a sign that the end of time begins. And if Matthews theology is anything like that of the Dead Sea scrolls, then there is a period of several years of strife before the final end. Which is why 2 Peter was written, as an excuse for why this had not occurred.
And Matthew is saying even though the destruction of the temple had occurred, you still need to follow the Jewish laws. Whereas Mark is following the Pauline line.
I'm just saying that 'my words will not pass away' is Synoptic and 'the law will not pass away'; is not in Mark and only common to Luke and Matthew and is a different 'origin', whether as i claim, it's Q, or as you claim, Luke is copying an individual idea of Matthew.
Isaiah 40:8 The grass withers and the flowers fall, but the word of our God endures forever.”
Isaiah 51:6 Lift up your eyes to the heavens, look at the earth beneath; the heavens will vanish like smoke, the earth will wear out like a garment and its inhabitants die like flies. But my salvation will last forever, my righteousness will never fail.
Mark uses the OT frequently for his invention, I can only see him doing the same here rather than using some common hypothetical source.
Yes, it was definitely more than just his original ideas. I think it was always 100% political. Read the final chapters of Daniel for a good laugh, though I do like Daniel otherwise. The god of all creation was obviously involved in their politics back then, just like today. But maybe even more so back then. lol
I would certainly agree that the religious delision was more involved in politics back then.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Harry Diogenes
Indeed. You also have various letters, laws, plus the histories (although told by the winning side).
More often the losing side, though even losing battles (if the couldn't claim they'd won) proved their God was the only real one because he was punishing them for not being faithful enough or having a foreign wife, or eating crisps on the wrong day or something.
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) I have an idea that the symbolism of Daniel and some Dead sea scrolls might give us some clues.
