Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Yet you seem to believe God is subject to the culture of 2000 years ago, which, as I've pointed out here several times, obviously influenced the author of most of the epistles.
This is an unfair misrepresentation.
Quote:
I know, I know, you think God whispered in his ear what to write, and of course we heartily disagree on that point, but I have to say it for others who might be reading here.
So, do you believe that it is subject to our culture? Will you answer that question?
I actually mean no offense to Paul when I say, "I don't care." It's your persistent 'in-your-face' bleating that Paul's words are God's words and that 'God' (through Paul) hates the gay community as well as the churches that accept (YOUR words) "this demonic practice." It's not Paul's fault that you have deified him and exalted his writings to that of divine status.
Sorry Paul if you're listening.
That said. Yes, on THIS topic anyway, I AM better educated than Paul.
Hmmm ...just a tad overly dramatic, don't you think?
No. I really don't. Our culture thinks we know better than what God has already said.
Quote:
Again, on this topic anyway, we do know better than the Bible authors' God. We know that homosexuality is just another facet of human sexuality. The Bible authors (and their God) would not have known that.
And.....you validate my point.
At no point do you actually address the actual context of 1 Cor 6, but instead lift up a strawman argument to reframe what it says.
Quote:
You know that too, but you must continue to dig in your heels in order to curry favor with your version of a judgmental and cruel God. Let it go, BF.
This is an unfair, inaccurate misrepresentation. I want to believe you are not intentionally being dishonest.
So, do you believe that it is subject to our culture? Will you answer that question?
Do I think what is subject to our culture? God? Of course not. Christianity and how we perceive it is to be lived? Definitely. It always has been throughout the history of the religion since its inception.
BF, all I am doing here is presenting the facts concerning this topic as we now know them to be ...that homosexuality has been determined to be yet another facet of human sexuality and that there is NOTHING WRONG with this. Your persistent insistence that homosexuality is 'a sin' and that the Bible authors were educated enough to know what modern medical science is still grappling with (nothing is 100%) is CLEARLY flawed. You MUST know this! But yet you continually harp on with this "sin" nonsense and pick out this Bible text or that Bible text as if this is going to change reality or, indeed, that anyone really cares what these ancient authors wrote.
It's my educated (as in 'study') understanding that all references to same gender sexual practices as witnessed by the Bible authors, or otherwise relayed to them by others, pertained to the ritualistic sexual practices of idolatry within the Pagan temples. Prostitutes were hired to participate in these practices that were seen to appease the idols that were worshiped. Why so? Well, our friend 'Google' is just a click away for those who care to find out why this was seen to be a necessary practice. Moreover, to the Pagans, there was nothing 'wrong' in this practice. In fact, the temple prostitutes (sodomites?) were deemed to be 'sacred'.
'Adam and Steve', the gay couple from the neighboring tribe, would have been of little interest to the God-fearing Bible authors. Why would they even bother reporting on this? They wouldn't. What they WOULD report would be the blatant 'thumbing of the nose to their genuine God' going on within the Pagan temples. In Romans 1, Paul even tells us without a shred of doubt that 'those who once knew God' had now turned to idolatry! Yep, it appears that these folks had turned away from 'the one true God' and had instead teamed up with the Pagans and were now participating in idol worship. This, according to Romans 1, appears to include dalliances with temple prostitutes.
If one reads between the lines with an open mind of each of the two or three New Testament references to same gender sexual practices, idolatry (shrine temple prostitution, etc) will jump out at them. They will see that Paul IS NOT referring to 'Adam and Steve'. Nor should we!
Of course. I attended the gay chorus in Richmond at St. Paul's Episcopal Church. Known as the Cathedral of the Confederacy Jefferson Davis and Robert E. Lee worshiped there. Times have changed.
BF, all I am doing here is presenting the facts concerning this topic as we now know them to be ...that homosexuality has been determined to be yet another facet of human sexuality and that there is NOTHING WRONG with this. Your persistent insistence that homosexuality is 'a sin' and that the Bible authors were educated enough to know what modern medical science is still grappling with (nothing is 100%) is CLEARLY flawed. You MUST know this! But yet you continually harp on with this "sin" nonsense and pick out this Bible text or that Bible text as if this is going to change reality or, indeed, that anyone really cares what these ancient authors wrote.
Suggesting that it is "another facet of human sexuality" is not the same as saying it is not sinful. If you wish to consider it good and moral, that's your prerogative. But when you make misstatements and misrepresent what the Bible says about it to unsuspecting people, I feel the need to speak up.
Quote:
It's my educated (as in 'study') understanding that all references to same gender sexual practices as witnessed by the Bible authors, or otherwise relayed to them by others, pertained to the ritualistic sexual practices of idolatry within the Pagan temples. Prostitutes were hired to participate in these practices that were seen to appease the idols that were worshiped. Why so? Well, our friend 'Google' is just a click away for those who care to find out why this was seen to be a necessary practice. Moreover, to the Pagans, there was nothing 'wrong' in this practice. In fact, the temple prostitutes (sodomites?) were deemed to be 'sacred'.
And it is my educated (as in 'study') understanding that you are completely mistaken. And the context of 1 Cor 6 and Romans 1 clearly state my understanding of it. But if you want to continue to hold to that idea despite being informed otherwise, then have at it.
Quote:
'Adam and Steve', the gay couple from the neighboring tribe, would have been of little interest to the God-fearing Bible authors. Why would they even bother reporting on this? They wouldn't. What they WOULD report would be the blatant 'thumbing of the nose to their genuine God' going on within the Pagan temples. In Romans 1, Paul even tells us without a shred of doubt that 'those who once knew God' had now turned to idolatry! Yep, it appears that these folks had turned away from 'the one true God' and had instead teamed up with the Pagans and were now participating in idol worship. This, according to Romans 1, appears to include dalliances with temple prostitutes.
Yes. It's clear that those that did not care to follow God's rules simply turned away and did their own thing.
Quote:
If one reads between the lines with an open mind of each of the two or three New Testament references to same gender sexual practices, idolatry (shrine temple prostitution, etc) will jump out at them. They will see that Paul IS NOT referring to 'Adam and Steve'. Nor should we!
Actually, Paul never mentioned the temple prostitutes in 1 Corinthians 6. You are reading your presuppositions into it.
I get it. I really do. You've probably read Matthew Vine's book, and you trust him more than virtually every reputable scholar because...well....you feel sorry for him. But that does not change the facts.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
