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Location: RI, MA, VT, WI, IL, CA, IN (that one sucked), KY
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SteelCityRising
since the mainstream Democratic Party is now catering more to social issues and less to economic issues
I understand what you're saying, and in general I agree. It is right wingers that are making this an issue, in reality. Using it as a divider. It should be a non issue, but isn't due to conservative for profit media outlets and the right using it as a divisive tool.
But yes, since Clinton the mainstream Democratic party has gone much further to the right. They need to get back to left of center and promote things that really impact working class middle america, such as promoting organized labor.
I work for the police, and the "ACAB/Defund the Police" shift within the Democrat Party has truly troubled me.
There is no party named the democrat party. If you're referring to the Democratic party, yes some made the push for that, but the vast majority of Democrats did not and even rejected the push.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteelCityRising
I suppose I'm a moderate Democrat, and I feel like I have no place anymore. OH used to be a purple state and is now solidly red. PA used to be a blue state and is now solidly purple. The white working-class is a large voting bloc, and since the mainstream Democratic Party is now catering more to social issues and less to economic issues (while many I know are suffering with paltry wage increases that are still not outpacing inflation) I can't honestly blame some white working-class voters from shifting towards the Republican Party, who at least attempt to pander to their economic concerns, even if it means holding their noses to vote for someone who is antithetic to their social values.
Democrats have failed to message well and the GOP has made its mission since Nixon to win based on its Southern Strategy which really appeals to the worst among struggling whites rather than give them hope and policies to help. It seems to have gotten worse each decade. I think that Democrats focus on economic issue more than you believe, but it's drowned out by social issues.
Unfortunately. The GOP controls Ohio and I'm not seeing much of what they are doing to address the issues facing working class residents.
Ohio is a legacy state. The only non legacy city in the state is Columbus. The only reason Ohio isn’t the worst state in the country for growth is because of the Columbus metro. I read an article somewhere that the rest of Ohio outside of Columbus lost 100,000. That is mind bogglingly bad, yikes. I love my WV but we are well known for the population losses. The GOP has been a failure for Ohio and West Virginia.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SteelCityRising
I am really tiring of "group think" and "echo chambers". I have always been a registered Democrat since turning 18 on Election Day 2004 and casting my vote for John Kerry for president. With that being said I have voted for Republicans in the past and will continue to do so in the future.
I work for the police, and the "ACAB/Defund the Police" shift within the Democrat Party has truly troubled me. I live in a city that is budgeted for 900 police officers, but we are currently at just over 800 and are losing more each week to retirements or suburban departments that pay better for lower stress. I live in a violent part of the city and worry about our city's ability to protect me while conducting "stealth defunding" (keeping the police budget identical on paper while not replacing any officers as they retire or resign). Most of my militantly Democratic friends are in favor of defunding the police. I am not. That makes me a pariah in their eyes. Our mayor is clueless on how to ebb violent crime, and at a recent meeting he was quoted as saying "guns is the problem" (showing he can't even speak English despite having grown up in Pittsburgh).
Conversely even though I am cisgender I am pro-transgender equality and am puzzled by the willingness of the Republican Party to slant in a progressively greater anti-LGBTQ+ direction. I can't vote for an otherwise solid Republican candidate who espouses anti-LGBTQ+ ideologies. I thought Republicans were those who wanted to expand personal freedoms and liberties---not inhibit them via discrimination?
I suppose I'm a moderate Democrat, and I feel like I have no place anymore. OH used to be a purple state and is now solidly red. PA used to be a blue state and is now solidly purple. The white working-class is a large voting bloc, and since the mainstream Democratic Party is now catering more to social issues and less to economic issues (while many I know are suffering with paltry wage increases that are still not outpacing inflation) I can't honestly blame some white working-class voters from shifting towards the Republican Party, who at least attempt to pander to their economic concerns, even if it means holding their noses to vote for someone who is antithetic to their social values.
PA is a legacy old school state. Pa has more in common with Ohio, WV, KY and Indiana with its culture than it does the northeast or southeast. It isn’t a shock that it’s purple. PA isn’t like MD or VA either. Not shocking it is falling more in line with Ohio on the political front. Probably the only reason PA isn’t red like Ohio is because of the Philly suburban counties. That’s really the biggest difference that keeps pa purple and Ohio is red. Ohio suburban counties are all red.
I don’t know why people get so hung up on the police officer count. The goal for any livable society should not have the need for more law enforcement. What you are saying tells me that Pittsburgh is crime ridden and not very livable.
That said this region of the country isn’t known for bustling wages. I know a lot of people that make low wages are are happy with their lives and money isn’t everything. Why wait for the government to raise wages? I’d go out and find a new job. I’ve read Pittsburgh is one of the best places to find a job lately. Why not find a new job with better pay and move to a safer area of town?
Ohio is a legacy state. The only non legacy city in the state is Columbus. The only reason Ohio isn’t the worst state in the country for growth is because of the Columbus metro. I read an article somewhere that the rest of Ohio outside of Columbus lost 100,000. That is mind bogglingly bad, yikes. I love my WV but we are well known for the population losses. The GOP has been a failure for Ohio and West Virginia.
PA is a legacy old school state. Pa has more in common with Ohio, WV, KY and Indiana with its culture than it does the northeast or southeast. It isn’t a shock that it’s purple. PA isn’t like MD or VA either. Not shocking it is falling more in line with Ohio on the political front. Probably the only reason PA isn’t red like Ohio is because of the Philly suburban counties. That’s really the biggest difference that keeps pa purple and Ohio is red. Ohio suburban counties are all red.
I don’t know why people get so hung up on the police officer count. The goal for any livable society should not have the need for more law enforcement. What you are saying tells me that Pittsburgh is crime ridden and not very livable.
That said this region of the country isn’t known for bustling wages. I know a lot of people that make low wages are are happy with their lives and money isn’t everything. Why wait for the government to raise wages? I’d go out and find a new job. I’ve read Pittsburgh is one of the best places to find a job lately. Why not find a new job with better pay and move to a safer area of town?
Another way to think about this is that people like Ohio and want to stay, but Columbus has the most jobs, so they move to Columbus instead of moving out of state. Am I wrong?
Another way to think about this is that people like Ohio and want to stay, but Columbus has the most jobs, so they move to Columbus instead of moving out of state. Am I wrong?
Columbus really just concentrates white collar jobs that otherwise could have been distributed throughout the state.
PA is a legacy old school state. Pa has more in common with Ohio, WV, KY and Indiana with its culture than it does the northeast or southeast. It isn’t a shock that it’s purple. PA isn’t like MD or VA either. Not shocking it is falling more in line with Ohio on the political front. Probably the only reason PA isn’t red like Ohio is because of the Philly suburban counties. That’s really the biggest difference that keeps pa purple and Ohio is red. Ohio suburban counties are all red.
I don’t know why people get so hung up on the police officer count. The goal for any livable society should not have the need for more law enforcement. What you are saying tells me that Pittsburgh is crime ridden and not very livable.
That said this region of the country isn’t known for bustling wages. I know a lot of people that make low wages are are happy with their lives and money isn’t everything. Why wait for the government to raise wages? I’d go out and find a new job. I’ve read Pittsburgh is one of the best places to find a job lately. Why not find a new job with better pay and move to a safer area of town?
Western and Central Pennsylvania are about as conservative as West Virginia these days. Reading the Pittsburgh sub-forum is enough to keep most sane people looking to relocate far away from the metro area. I think Pittsburgh has made some huge strides in reinventing itself, but so much of the local population keeps it from really flourishing. It is one of my top contenders for relocation, but I think it is because I know the city and neighborhoods and only live an hour away.
If it wasn't for Philadelphia, Pennsylvania would be another Indiana or Kentucky.
Ohio is a legacy state. The only non legacy city in the state is Columbus. The only reason Ohio isn’t the worst state in the country for growth is because of the Columbus metro.
There are numerous "legacy states"... most of the Midwest and the Plains would qualify. Ohio, for all of its manifest faults, doesn't deserve to be singled out as "the worst", or even say in the bottom quartile.
Ohio's main problem is that it didn't innovate past 1950 or so. It was content to coast, from the progress and innovation of the late 19th century and the early 20th. But that is true for vast swaths of America. Other parts of the country never amounted to much. Ohio did. Its tragedy lies precisely in the fact that it's regressed so much.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Nailerman9192
Probably the only reason PA isn’t red like Ohio is because of the Philly suburban counties. That’s really the biggest difference that keeps pa purple and Ohio is red.
Ohio lacks a city with the magnitude of a Philadelphia or a Chicago. Philadelphia is PA's toehold into the I-95 corridor, the wealth and power of the Eastern Seaboard. With the decline of the Ohio-Mississippi rivers, Ohio's Philadelphia-like city - namely, Cincinnati - couldn't compete.
In an alternative history, Cincinnati would have burgeoned post-WW2, instead of Atlanta or even Chicago. It would have become the regional commercial capital and tech-hub. Didn't happen! Instead we have Chicago as the capital of the Midwest, Atlanta as the capital of the mid-South, DFW as the capital of the west-South, and Miami as the capital of the far-South. Ohio can't compete.
If it wasn't for Philadelphia, Pennsylvania would be another Indiana or Kentucky.
The same can be said of most states outside of their major urban areas. What do you think Illinois would be without Chicago? What do you think Michigan would be without Detroit? What do you think Minnesota would be without Minneapolis and St. Paul? What do you think Colorado would be without Denver? What do you think Washington would be without Seattle? What do you think Oregon would be without Portland? What do you think Virginia would be without the suburbs of Washington D.C.?
As for Ohio, remove Columbus and you get Missouri.
So the hinterlands are conservative and the big cities are liberal. What else is new.
The suburbs in the midwest were swinging right because the Democratic Party was too focused on keeping the coasts happy and not talking jobs/taxes/schools. You have to sell to the suburbs - in middle America.
I used to be proud of Ohio's politics, now I just have to wait for it to turn back around, it will. Pretty much divorced myself from the nonsense anyway - bores the hell out of me.
Another way to think about this is that people like Ohio and want to stay, but Columbus has the most jobs, so they move to Columbus instead of moving out of state. Am I wrong?
Maybe? Are there facts to back that up? Columbus has plenty of jobs but not enough workers to fill them. It’s a great city and Ohio is a great state. I just was referring to the utter failure the GOP has been outside of the Columbus metro. The rest of the state losing 100K is a failure. Aside from a few pockets in other cities the state is in dire straights and falling apart.
Quote:
Originally Posted by bjimmy24
Columbus really just concentrates white collar jobs that otherwise could have been distributed throughout the state.
Maybe, but why aren’t they being concentrated elsewhere? Again the rest of the state is struggling mightily other than Franklin County and the counties that surround. Even Newark, a far east Columbus suburb has been teetering for quite some time.
Quote:
Originally Posted by BRNorth
Western and Central Pennsylvania are about as conservative as West Virginia these days. Reading the Pittsburgh sub-forum is enough to keep most sane people looking to relocate far away from the metro area. I think Pittsburgh has made some huge strides in reinventing itself, but so much of the local population keeps it from really flourishing. It is one of my top contenders for relocation, but I think it is because I know the city and neighborhoods and only live an hour away.
If it wasn't for Philadelphia, Pennsylvania would be another Indiana or Kentucky.
You pretty much nailed exactly how I see it. What’s interesting Licking County (east) legacy residents have much in common with those in WV and western pa. I read the little city of Johnstown, Ohio legacy residents are opposed to this intel plant and are upset. We moved here because we wanted it to stay as it always has been. The liberals are coming and things are gonna change. It’s been well documented in the Columbus media outlets, the local legacy residents opposing it. Sounds like West Virginia and western pa thinking to me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Craziaskowboi
The same can be said of most states outside of their major urban areas. What do you think Illinois would be without Chicago? What do you think Michigan would be without Detroit? What do you think Minnesota would be without Minneapolis and St. Paul? What do you think Colorado would be without Denver? What do you think Washington would be without Seattle? What do you think Oregon would be without Portland? What do you think Virginia would be without the suburbs of Washington D.C.?
As for Ohio, remove Columbus and you get Missouri.
And remove Philly and end up with a weird combo of WV, KY, IN and Ohio minus Columbus. What’s the point?
So the hinterlands are conservative and the big cities are liberal. What else is new.
The suburbs in the midwest were swinging right because the Democratic Party was too focused on keeping the coasts happy and not talking jobs/taxes/schools. You have to sell to the suburbs - in middle America.
I used to be proud of Ohio's politics, now I just have to wait for it to turn back around, it will. Pretty much divorced myself from the nonsense anyway - bores the hell out of me.
It will change. You can see cracks in the GOP voting bloc in Ohio. A year where the GOP should’ve run the table, experts predict that Ohio would only have 3 dem Congress seats. Guess what the dems ended up with 5. The lady in Toledo won re-election and Chabot who has been the GOP Cincinnati rep since 1994 lost. Ohio is really losing population and COVID has killed 10-15% more republicans in Ohio since 2021 when the vaccines came out. Likely you saw that in thr 2022 election. COVID has wiped out many in these rural Ohio areas. Even the Senate election wasn’t called till after midnite. Just shows you nothing lasts forever
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