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"Older workers with a strong work ethic" = desperate middle aged - seniors with financial issues.
Those seniors with financial issues probably are the ones who have to keep working on to support the lazy young 20s, 30s who still stay at home to just play games on the PC and don't care to look for a job, as long as they have their parents to support them financially. It's a tough choice. Being parents, you feel guilt in your heart to kick them out because there are so many bad things out there. And your children could be worse too. Damn if you do. Damn if you don't (kick them out). Others or even you blame yourself that it's your fault to enable them to be lazy.
Not all young people are like that though. I have two children. They are so opposite. I feel very happy and proud to see the one who works hard and is successful. He's independent, living on his own and comes to visit me every weekend. I feel so sad and worried about the one who had/has jobs off and on and still stays home at his 30s. When he works, has some money, he spends extravagantly on clothes, shoes, perfumes and gadgets ... (for what? to show off?) He has a big loan and debts in his credit cards. He asked me to help to pay for his credit cards, I told him: "I helped you before. You need to find a job, work hard, save, be frugal a bit and pay your debts. I can only help you by letting you to live at home; you don't have to pay for rent and food. That's a big help already." And now he has a good job. I hope he will work hard and to become mature and pay his debts and have better life. All I can do is to learn to be patient, firm, to pray and wish him all the best.
Quote:
Originally Posted by banksock
My years of working various jobs i worked with some of the laziest older folks ever.
Younger people will quit a job in flash if they are not feeling it.
There are always hard-working and lazy employees among the old and young.
About the younger people would/will quit a job in flash if they are not feeling it, that is because they have their parents to support them financially. They don't care. If they did not have food to eat, a roof above their head, they would have to keep their job and look for a different job at the same time. They would have to learn to be patient, to have good work ethics and to be humble. Nowadays, many young adults think they are entitled for all the goods from parents and employers to offer to their faces without being working hard.
Here's a novel concept - try paying competitive wages/salaries. Shocking, I know.
I started giving less of a crap about my job when it stopped paying decently. For the first 7 or so years, it paid reasonably well. Enough for me to buy a house. I stayed late, went the extra mile, all that.
Then covid and inflation happened. They made our lives suck in response to covid and refuse to acknowledge inflation is happenning.
Now even my mid career salary barely quaifies for a 1br apartment. I care less now, and am entertaining 2nd and 3rd job ideas. I need time and energy to do that so I give less to my main employer.
I know what the hiring pools look like so I know they can't easily replace me. It's so bad they have cut off all retirememet incentives because they don't think they can replace retirements (there used to be a "buyout" one time payment to encourage retirement).
Here's a novel concept - try paying competitive wages/salaries. Shocking, I know.
I started giving less of a crap about my job when it stopped paying decently. For the first 7 or so years, it paid reasonably well. Enough for me to buy a house. I stayed late, went the extra mile, all that.
Then covid and inflation happened. They made our lives suck in response to covid and refuse to acknowledge inflation is happenning.
Now even my mid career salary barely quaifies for a 1br apartment. I care less now, and am entertaining 2nd and 3rd job ideas. I need time and energy to do that so I give less to my main employer.
I know what the hiring pools look like so I know they can't easily replace me. It's so bad they have cut off all retirememet incentives because they don't think they can replace retirements (there used to be a "buyout" one time payment to encourage retirement).
Are you still in the same position? What have you done to change the scenario in your favor?
Are you still in the same position? What have you done to change the scenario in your favor?
Why is it on him to change the dynamic? Why can't the company offer raises in accordance with inflation and extra work? If you're going to pay the minimum, expect the minimum.
I would love to be able to work if I could. Fifteen dollars an hour is more than I ever made in my life. But I'm with the millennials. As much as I know I'm a hard worker, I won't stay at a job where I'm undermined, sworn at, taken advantage of, or otherwise abused no matter how much they pay me.
I loved my boss when I worked at 7-11. All of us did. We kept that store clean and worked triple shifts sometimes when we had to so she wouldn't have to close and lose money. The most I ever made there was $8/hr.
I will go to the wall for a decent manager, but I'm not ruining my health and sanity with a bad one. It's just that so many managers are jerks and if they're not, the company requires them to be.
Are you still in the same position? What have you done to change the scenario in your favor?
Everything I'm supposed to and more.
I'm in a public sector position and what they tell us is "this is all we can give."
I am on the negotiations team. My response to that is, "then don't expect us to give you as much effort because we have to get 2nd jobs to make it. Also we'll leave for better jobs at the first opportunity. Plan around that."
Everyone on the negotiations team is actively searching for jobs and the rectuitment has been crashing and burning, embarassingly bad. Our hiring pools are absurdly small AND unqualified.
They say "this will be the largest raise we've ever given." No. It's barely 4%. That is a pay CUT in this inflationary environment.
I explained to them what freaking inflation means - since the last contract was written in 2019 our dollars are worth 19% less officially according to the gov't and in COL terms less than that because of housing (more like 30% less). They looked at me incredulously. Although the HR director and budget director seemed to get it, not everybody on their team did.
Last edited by redguard57; 04-16-2023 at 01:07 PM..
Why is it on him to change the dynamic? Why can't the company offer raises in accordance with inflation and extra work? If you're going to pay the minimum, expect the minimum.
Why would they pay more if they don't need to. And if the workers are not going to stand up and do something about it, then they don't need to. We also have no idea what they are actually paying or if it is anywhere near the minimum. He simply said it used to pay "reasonably well" which could mean anything depending on the person and the industry.
They say "this will be the largest raise we've ever given." No. It's barely 4%. That is a pay CUT in this inflationary environment.
I explained to them what freaking inflation means - since the last contract was written in 2019 our dollars are worth 19% less officially according to the gov't and in COL terms less than that because of housing (more like 30% less). They looked at me incredulously. Although the HR director and budget director seemed to get it, not everybody on their team did.
It sucks for you but pegging pay increases to inflation continues the cycle of inflation. Everybody thinks they are REACTING to inflation but the reaction becomes PART of inflation.
But as for you specifically, your choice is simply what it always is when an employer will not give you what you want - either accept what they give or find another employer who will give it. If you're not willing to do the latter then you have no leverage.
I'm in a public sector position and what they tell us is "this is all we can give."
I am on the negotiations team. My response to that is, "then don't expect us to give you as much effort because we have to get 2nd jobs to make it. Also we'll leave for better jobs at the first opportunity. Plan around that."
Everyone on the negotiations team is actively searching for jobs and the rectuitment has been crashing and burning, embarassingly bad. Our hiring pools are absurdly small AND unqualified.
They say "this will be the largest raise we've ever given." No. It's barely 4%. That is a pay CUT in this inflationary environment.
I explained to them what freaking inflation means - since the last contract was written in 2019 our dollars are worth 19% less officially according to the gov't and in COL terms less than that because of housing (more like 30% less). They looked at me incredulously. Although the HR director and budget director seemed to get it, not everybody on their team did.
Back to my question - what have you done for yourself? Getting out of the public sector takes effort.
Why is it on him to change the dynamic? Why can't the company offer raises in accordance with inflation and extra work? If you're going to pay the minimum, expect the minimum.
I would love to be able to work if I could. Fifteen dollars an hour is more than I ever made in my life. But I'm with the millennials. As much as I know I'm a hard worker, I won't stay at a job where I'm undermined, sworn at, taken advantage of, or otherwise abused no matter how much they pay me.
I loved my boss when I worked at 7-11. All of us did. We kept that store clean and worked triple shifts sometimes when we had to so she wouldn't have to close and lose money. The most I ever made there was $8/hr.
I will go to the wall for a decent manager, but I'm not ruining my health and sanity with a bad one. It's just that so many managers are jerks and if they're not, the company requires them to be.
OP is in public sector.
The real world is a different ball game.
A company purpose is generally to create revenue.
It sucks for you but pegging pay increases to inflation continues the cycle of inflation. Everybody thinks they are REACTING to inflation but the reaction becomes PART of inflation.
But as for you specifically, your choice is simply what it always is when an employer will not give you what you want - either accept what they give or find another employer who will give it. If you're not willing to do the latter then you have no leverage.
The place is falling apart for lack of recruitment amd retention. Those who don't leave are going to turn the lights out.
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