Atheism As A REJECTION OF--Not Disbelief In--An Evil God (salvation, satanic, origin)
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There is a another thread titled "Atheist Forum Joke Thread" I would recommend for you, but this isn't even funny. Doesn't make sense. Just kind of goofy is all...
I'm interested to know how many atheists on R&S would convert to Christianity if they were somehow convinced it's true. Thoughts?
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I’m not an atheist, just a former life-long Christian, but I like the question and have asked it of myself.
First, the answer depends on what version. I would be fairly at ease embracing some version of Christian Universalism if I was again to become convinced it was true. It’s the version of Christianity I came to believe towards the end of my time as a Christian. The thing I eventually came to have issues with was that there was still a measure of exclusivity to it (thinking that Christians were somehow “chosen” and special) that didn’t seem congruent with the overall message. But, I could have let go of that belief and still retained a belief in the rest of the overall message... until I couldn’t believe the literal Jesus narrative anymore, but that’s a long story.
However, the eternal torment or annihilation versions of Christianity are much more problematic. My conclusion is that if I became convinced it was true, I doubt I would have the courage to openly defy such a cruel, irrational and terrifying God. I’m not proud of that, in the least. I would much rather say that I would stand against such a God and stand with my fellow humans. And if it meant I would merely be annihilated*, I do hope I would have the fortitude to do so. But in the face of “eternal hell”, I simply don’t think I would.
*Honestly, annihilation would be a welcome alternative to an eternity living with such a God.
Far from the Ten Truths being "the only viable and reasonable way to view our reality," they are talking points! Simple subject of possible discussion. To be expanded upon, condemned or crapped upon as anyone may like. Is it at all possible to consider the merit of any view different from yours without all this angst and disdain and all the rest you forever want to throw into the air? You are becoming nothing but an intellectual wet blanket!
Self-awareness is definitely NOT one of your strong points! My irony meter is broken yet again by one of your posts. Make the effort to expand the scope of your understanding of what we already DO know about the composition of our Reality on the fringes of science so you can free yourself from the quicksand of reductionism.
I would be very interested to see you list these 'blind spots' that atheists supposedly have. Start a thread on it. We goddless hellspawn welcome what Shostakovich called 'Just criticism'. Rather more than just saying we are as bad as Theists and leaving it at that.
I like your idea about a thread to discuss 'blind spots.'
I have a related idea for a thread on 'R&S realities' as observed by people of different worldviews.
Things that one might include on a list of "I wish [theists/atheists/anti-theists] would stop doing this..."
It could be an observed behavior, tactic, phrase, or a misunderstanding that continues to be repeated. It could be thought of as a "F.O.R." (frequently observed "realities") for R&S.
I'll start it off with an example of something I would include on a list of things I wish atheists and anti-theists would stop doing:
I wish atheists and anti-theists would stop...
1. calling themselves "goddless hellspawn" and the like. I realize that some think that's how theists view atheists or anti-theists but it's not how I view them, and I don't get that impression of other, so when I see terms like that being used, I think to myself, 'where did that come from?'. I honestly think that is more likely your own baggage you're carrying around and not the reality of the situation, in general.
2.
-----
I wish theists (or a specific religion) would stop...
Don't you just love it when theist apologists misrepresent you so grossly that you couldn't live on the difference between that and blatant smearing?
I've grown accustomed to it.
Sidebar--not worth it's own thread: Nones (23%) are now in parity with Evangelicals (22%) and Catholics (23%). We're catching up. In 30 years Christianity will be a distant memory.
I’m not an atheist, just a former life-long Christian, but I like the question and have asked it of myself.
First, the answer depends on what version. I would be fairly at ease embracing some version of Christian Universalism if I was again to become convinced it was true. It’s the version of Christianity I came to believe towards the end of my time as a Christian. The thing I eventually came to have issues with was that there was still a measure of exclusivity to it (thinking that Christians were somehow “chosen” and special) that didn’t seem congruent with the overall message. But, I could have let go of that belief and still retained a belief in the rest of the overall message... until I couldn’t believe the literal Jesus narrative anymore, but that’s a long story.
However, the eternal torment or annihilation versions of Christianity are much more problematic. My conclusion is that if I became convinced it was true, I doubt I would have the courage to openly defy such a cruel, irrational and terrifying God. I’m not proud of that, in the least. I would much rather say that I would stand against such a God and stand with my fellow humans. And if it meant I would merely be annihilated*, I do hope I would have the fortitude to do so. But in the face of “eternal hell”, I simply don’t think I would.
*Honestly, annihilation would be a welcome alternative to an eternity living with such a God.
" The thing I eventually came to have issues with was that there was still a measure of exclusivity to it (thinking that Christians were somehow “chosen” and special) that didn’t seem congruent with the overall message."
Are you referring to Jesus being the only way to the Father, or the behavior of particular Christians acting "special"?
"I couldn’t believe the literal Jesus narrative anymore."
I know you said it's a long story, but if you feel like explaining this in any more detail, I'm interested.
"the eternal torment or annihilation versions of Christianity are much more problematic"
"if I became convinced it was true, I doubt I would have the courage to openly defy such a cruel, irrational and terrifying God"
"I would much rather say that I would stand against such a God and stand with my fellow humans."
"Honestly, annihilation would be a welcome alternative to an eternity living with such a God"
To what extent are you rejecting the validity of biblical Christianity because of emotional reasons related to your negative view of the Christian God, versus an objective assessment of the evidence? It seems as though you are only willing to accept a God that meets your criteria.
What would it take to convince you that biblical Christianity is true? If you were somehow convinced, would you accept God (and Jesus), repent and live the life God wants you to live?
" The thing I eventually came to have issues with was that there was still a measure of exclusivity to it (thinking that Christians were somehow “chosen” and special) that didn’t seem congruent with the overall message."
Are you referring to Jesus being the only way to the Father, or the behavior of particular Christians acting "special"?
"I couldn’t believe the literal Jesus narrative anymore."
I know you said it's a long story, but if you feel like explaining this in any more detail, I'm interested.
"the eternal torment or annihilation versions of Christianity are much more problematic"
"if I became convinced it was true, I doubt I would have the courage to openly defy such a cruel, irrational and terrifying God"
"I would much rather say that I would stand against such a God and stand with my fellow humans."
"Honestly, annihilation would be a welcome alternative to an eternity living with such a God"
To what extent are you rejecting the validity of biblical Christianity because of emotional reasons related to your negative view of the Christian God, versus an objective assessment of the evidence? It seems as though you are only willing to accept a God that meets your criteria.
What would it take to convince you that biblical Christianity is true? If you were somehow convinced, would you accept God (and Jesus), repent and live the life God wants you to live?
a person literally dying and rising because his father made us sinners has zero objective evidence.
Sidebar--not worth it's own thread: Nones (23%) are now in parity with Evangelicals (22%) and Catholics (23%). We're catching up. In 30 years Christianity will be a distant memory.
I hope you know thrill that he and his ilk will not stop when they are through with the religious.
" The thing I eventually came to have issues with was that there was still a measure of exclusivity to it (thinking that Christians were somehow “chosen” and special) that didn’t seem congruent with the overall message."
Are you referring to Jesus being the only way to the Father, or the behavior of particular Christians acting "special"?
Pleroo is very capable of speaking for herself, so my observations in this post should be taken as my interpretations only. I suspect it is their belief that she must believe what Christians believe about God "or else" that puts her off.
Quote:
"I couldn’t believe the literal Jesus narrative anymore."
I know you said it's a long story, but if you feel like explaining this in any more detail, I'm interested.
I also would like to know more, but again I suspect it is the irrational scapegoat motive attributed to God for the very existence of Jesus that puts her off.
Quote:
"the eternal torment or annihilation versions of Christianity are much more problematic"
"if I became convinced it was true, I doubt I would have the courage to openly defy such a cruel, irrational and terrifying God"
"I would much rather say that I would stand against such a God and stand with my fellow humans."
"Honestly, annihilation would be a welcome alternative to an eternity living with such a God"
To what extent are you rejecting the validity of biblical Christianity because of emotional reasons related to your negative view of the Christian God, versus an objective assessment of the evidence? It seems as though you are only willing to accept a God that meets your criteria.
It seems clear she does not consider the objective attributes and motives assigned to God to be very Godly or worthy of acceptance. Your question seems predicated on the idea that "so what God is a narcissistic megalomaniacal tyrant you are just being emotional by not accepting Him."
Quote:
What would it take to convince you that biblical Christianity is true? If you were somehow convinced, would you accept God (and Jesus), repent, and live the life God wants you to live?
She has been very clear and honest about the lack of courage in the face of such an evil God and her preference for annihilation. But, I would point out that I believe she is more than living the way God wants her to live.
Sidebar--not worth it's own thread: Nones (23%) are now in parity with Evangelicals (22%) and Catholics (23%). We're catching up. In 30 years Christianity will be a distant memory.
Yes, this is very exciting! We'll be in the end-times soon. That will be a very exciting time to be alive. There will never be a dull moment with all the calamities and whatnot.
MATForce™ for the win!
"This is the most important and worthwhile thing I have ever done in my life!"
"If we fail, we fall, but if we succeed, I will feel justified in knowing that i played a small part in it."
"I am not 100% sure that there is no 'God' in the sense of a creator. There may be a god of some kind."
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