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1. Why did this not bother you until Obama was elected? Why did you not LOVE Clinton for creating a surplus? I mean, I know why, but how do you rationalize it to yourself? Personally I think it sucks that Obama has to increase the debt. If Bush hadn't squandered the Clinton surplus Obama would be able to spend without any worry.
2. Slavery is having to have another job once you retire because you have no family/your family can't/won't support you. Having a weak body barely able to work yet forced to do so in order to make money is slavery. Social security is a godsend essential to the survival of our Republic. And the majority of Republicans support keeping it lol.
I know that you want the OP to answer but to put it simply, Obama is not a Republican. Republicans have literally gotten away with murder with no complaints from their right. Partisanism before morality, justice or rationality...that's the American way.
remember it was NEVER designed to be a retirement program anyhow. it was designed to SUPPLEMENT your retirement
lets get rid of it....not all at once..let the people currently on it continue..but people who haven't hit 62 yet.. lets stop it
Social Security was never designed to supplement retirement. Most were not suppose to live long enough to collect it - thus one of the largest government and big business scams on American taxpayers in history.
When Social Security began in the 1930's, it was never intended for most working men to even get benefits since the average life span at the time for a male was 56.
It was designed to be a retirement program for women. Put in place because of increased poor widows, mostly as a result of mining. Women were not covered by pensions or unemployment insurance even when they did work.
Its funny, the example given about the first woman, May Fuller, who received Social Security benefits totaling $22,000 only after putting into the system $24.75 because she lived to be a 100. She was not the norm.
How do you think they arrived at the age a widow could collect (60) - just out of thin air? No - the average life expectancy of a woman in the 1930's was 60.
AT the time the joke was really on the American worker - most men would be paying into something they probably would never collect on and their spouses only for a very short time, if at all.
I don't think anyone is laughing now.
They did not know we all would start living to the age of 80 and beyond and that there would be more May Fuller's than the system was intended for - let alone Mike Fuller's
Yes, it was much better when we didn't have Social Security or Medicare and senior citizens starved or went without health care. Ah, the good old days.
As for the debt, it costs money to run a civilized country. Are rich people about to run out of money? If so, that's news to me. Besides, Reagan and Bush didn't worry about the debt, so why should liberals?
That's a cop out answer. Someone elese created the problem, and I bitched about it the entire time, but now that my side is doing the exact same thing, making the problem even bigger, I'm not going to ***** any more. Really? Somehow, I had thought better of you.
Last edited by Bill Keegan; 04-20-2010 at 08:17 AM..
Reason: typos
so pretty much people want people to work until they are ready for the grave or just kill you off as you are leaching off the 'system'--
Without Medicaid my mother would be dead. It is the only thing allowing her to get the care she needs. (she makes $2700 monthly ($1000 in ss and $1700 retirement)--$900 goes to private insurance and the rest (except for her $52 she is allowed a month) goes to the facility she is in.
Life is sure depressing isn't it? Maybe the government should just put something in the water to off us when we're 60....
so pretty much people want people to work until they are ready for the grave or just kill you off as you are leaching off the 'system'--
Without Medicaid my mother would be dead. It is the only thing allowing her to get the care she needs. (she makes $2700 monthly ($1000 in ss and $1700 retirement)--$900 goes to private insurance and the rest (except for her $52 she is allowed a month) goes to the facility she is in.
Life is sure depressing isn't it? Maybe the government should just put something in the water to off us when we're 60....
Maybe the government should stop siphoning off our wealth during our productive years, so that we can afford to put away enough money to see us through our retirement. That way, the responsibility of caring for us when we are older will be ours and our family's, and not "the government's."
Are you under the impression that Republicans repeal Social Security when they're in office, and the Democrats put it back in place when they're in office?
Or do you just think that Social Security policy is written and vetted by political partisans?
Very, very strange.
No, but look when Bush stated the idea of privatizing just a wee portion of it, met with stiff resistance from the Dems. SS is the darling of liberals, no matter if it is broken, grown beyond a emergency fund to a perpetual welfare scam.
Can we agree that a small step would be to make SS non taxable when one starts drawing it? Is it right for the government to with hold your money for 20, 30, 40 years then tax you on it on top when they finally start giving it back to you?
[quote=Factsplease;13818146. Republicans have literally gotten away with murder with no complaints from their right.[/quote]
Lets not deflect criticism and questions being posed here to liberals by saying "well the Repubs......" There are things to criticize Republicans on too but this thread is about posing questions to liberals to answer and give a straight opportunity to them to explain just what and why.
I know that you want the OP to answer but to put it simply, Obama is not a Republican. Republicans have literally gotten away with murder with no complaints from their right. Partisanism before morality, justice or rationality...that's the American way.
gets the facts right, the problem is as broad as it is long. quit pointing fingers and talk about a solution
1. Why did this not bother you until Obama was elected? Why did you not LOVE Clinton for creating a surplus? I mean, I know why, but how do you rationalize it to yourself? Personally I think it sucks that Obama has to increase the debt. If Bush hadn't squandered the Clinton surplus Obama would be able to spend without any worry.
These links- one from a dem and one from a rep / conservative source, both agree that the "surplus" was a myth. The conservative source explained one way they played with numbers.
National Debt = public debt + intragovernmental debt. The public debt is paid down by borrowing money from other gov $$ (SS), increasing the intragov debt. So they chose which numbers to report, leaving out the ones that actually increased the Nationat Debt totals.
So, Bush did not inherit a surplus, he inherited debt. Phew, so now I'm off the hook about the whole loving Clinton thing....
The reason I wasn't concerned before about skyrocketing debt, which over the past year rose to about 1/2 the GDP (not inherited, created under this administration) was because this, at least to my knowledge, has never happened before. I'm just dying to hear the insights you can give me as to what I was thinking...... on second thought, spare me.
Quote:
Originally Posted by juppiter
2. Slavery is having to have another job once you retire because you have no family/your family can't/won't support you. Having a weak body barely able to work yet forced to do so in order to make money is slavery. Social security is a godsend essential to the survival of our Republic. And the majority of Republicans support keeping it lol.
If you had read subsequent posts you'd have discovered we are in agreement on this.
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