Cleveland Development Discussions (Columbus, Cincinnati, Lorain: organic, statistics, rankings)

[RaisedRustbelt]

Here is the full article for the convention center hotel with more renderings and floor plans:

Convention hotel design has the potential to contribute to Cleveland skyline, but still needs refinement | cleveland.com

[bjimmy24]

Petition against the "Opportunity" Corridor (with a name like that, you know it has to be BS, in my opinion), if anyone is interested.

http://www.change.org/petitions/ne-o...-gets-it-wrong

[Cleverfield]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

It's designing a city for people that don't live there (suburban dwelling commuters/occasional urban tourists). Cleveland needs to be walkable, public transit friendly, and that sum of money could be much better used on something else that will actually benefit the people that live in those poor areas. Yes, there are lots of abandonded homes, but that doesn't mean they are actually abandonded neighborhoods. I don't understand what the people for the corridor think will happen... we build a mini, slightly lower speed highway to appease the 50+, car-addicted crowd and somehow, by speeding up their journey from the highway to the places at University Circle that will......... make them want to explore the ghetto and set up businesses there? Convince me I'm mistaken. I'd love to agree with this project since it looks like it's gonna go through but it just seems like wishful thinking and unwise spending.

I agree. Why not invest that money in the neighborhoods surrounding the Clinic to make it a place where doctors and nurses will want to live, rather than easing their commute from the suburbs. As it stands, the Clinic and UC in general are fortresses in a sea of crime and abandonment. I don't understand why the city doesn't work with the institutions to improve the neighborhoods that surround them. Everyone would benefit. $331 million can do a lot of good.

[costello_musicman]

Originally Posted by RaisedRustbelt

Here is the full article for the convention center hotel with more renderings and floor plans:

Convention hotel design has the potential to contribute to Cleveland skyline, but still needs refinement | cleveland.com

4-story podium + 26-story tower = 30-story new hotel. I'll take it. Design is different and interesting.

I'm bummed about the lack of rooftop bar/restaurant...especially as it was in the discussion very early on.

[1watertiger]

I like the design of the hotel. its a nice change from all the grey and stone buildings Cleveland has.. second, yes it would be nice to see money spent on the devastated neighborhoods where the proposed corridor is planned. HOWEVER, the corridor would do that much faster then fixing these areas block by block.. just too many square miles of devastation (think Detroit). lets be honest, its taken decades just to fix a few blocks around ohio city.

[Cleverfield]

Originally Posted by 1watertiger

I like the design of the hotel. its a nice change from all the grey and stone buildings Cleveland has.. second, yes it would be nice to see money spent on the devastated neighborhoods where the proposed corridor is planned. HOWEVER, the corridor would do that much faster then fixing these areas block by block.. just too many square miles of devastation (think Detroit). lets be honest, its taken decades just to fix a few blocks around ohio city.

How exactly will building a new road from the freeway to University Circle help revive these neighborhoods?

[1watertiger]

imo business love locations along new freeway exits or along new streets/corridors.. same goes for business to want to be near new public transit(health line,etc). do you really think the eastside can be rebuilt block by block? how long will that take ? 50 yrs? those areas are so bad and crime ridden , who wants to spend their money on the hope it will somehow change.

[Cleverfield]

Originally Posted by 1watertiger

imo business love locations along new freeway exits or along new streets/corridors.. same goes for business to want to be near new public transit(health line,etc). do you really think the eastside can be rebuilt block by block? how long will that take ? 50 yrs? those areas are so bad and crime ridden , who wants to spend their money on the hope it will somehow change.

New York has done it with some of its bad neighborhoods, without building expensive new roads. Seriously, I could think of about 10 projects that would instantly help make their neighborhoods a much better place for a fraction of the cost of this road. Not to mention, adding much needed police, upgrading police cars (most are not even equipped with computers), etc. should take precedence over building this commuter centric road. Imagine if that money was invested in Larchmere, Buckeye, North Collinwood; places that have the potential, but not the resources. Those places could instantly become attractive places for people to live, locate businesses, and spend money, benefitting the city much more than a road connecting UC to the southwest suburbs.

[1watertiger]

how long has it taken for a handful of blocks of ohio city to get new life? most of ohio city is still crime ridden, yes? and you suggest the eastside neighborhoods would be fixed sooner, even though they are in far worse shape? look at the few new houses they built along quincy ave/E.60th., prostitutes are on the sidewalks at 630am with school children waiting at bus stops. sorry but I don't agree with you.. we have spent millions on new schools and programs to fix the Cleveland school system with no real results.. until the parents get involved with their kids and their schools, the csd will never improve.. same goes for these neighborhoods. a bulldozer is a better idea.

[that412]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

It's designing a city for people that don't live there (suburban dwelling commuters/occasional urban tourists). Cleveland needs to be walkable, public transit friendly,
...
we build a mini, slightly lower speed highway

I agree 100% that walkability and transit are paramount, but any major city can't just completely ignore its driving infrastructure. This doesn't appear to me to be just pouring concrete all over yourselves just for the sake of it, this is a pretty painfully obvious gap in the region's O/D network.

Furthermore, are you overstating what the built environment of this thing is actually going to be a bit? I would hope that it's going to be more like a 35-mph, landscaped boulevard, which is what the plans seem to imply. Hardly the Lower-Manhattan Expressway.

Though speaking of the plans (I'm using this, for reference), I definitely would agree that some things could be done better. For one thing, I would definitely question the need for it to be five-plus lanes the entire way, and part of me would want to insist on a protected cyclotrack or something, though I have no idea who, if anyone, would even have the need or desire to bike this route.

and that sum of money could be much better used on something else that will actually benefit the people that live in those poor areas.

At the end of the day, I can't argue with that notion (although I probably am not quite as pessimistic as you are regarding the potential of further development along this corridor). I guess, though, I wasn't ever looking at this project as a panacea for all these blighted neighborhoods, but rather just a fairly obvious and relatively simple (albeit not cheap) solution that would have a positive effect on the transportation network for the whole region. Whether it's worth the outlay is another question, and I'm certainly not in a position to make a claim one way or the other. I really just wanted to get the whole story from the locals.