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I saw that on the news. I'm wondering if it would have been better to treat the Covid19 patients on the ships and leave the hospitals open to treat heart and stroke patients. I'm also still confused why we had to shut down the economy over this when there have been other viruses that killed hundreds of thousands in this country but barely made the news. This virus is a news constant. 24/7. I'm starting to believe the government wants us to be in fear so we'll depend on them more. (sorry, just thinking outloud)
I think that initially they'd used data from China - and it was very sick people who were getting tested, those who got so sick that required hospital admission or a medical visit. So, mortality rate was shown to be very high because tests were administered to those who were more vulnerable to the virus to begin with. I agree, the virus is a new constant and isn't going anywhere, will be there along with other respiratory illnesses (until vaccine is found). There used to be epidemics of diphtheria (with mortality rate in the lines of 20%) and pertussis, in the past, before vaccines were invented for them - but life went on. Scarlet fever was bad, measles, mumps, rubella. There used to be widespread pulmonary tuberculosis. All this is very recent but life went on. I think the lockdowns are simply meant to flatten the curve due to unpreparedness of the medical system... fair game, but they have to learn to scale epidemics responses, as new one can be starting any time - plenty of mutating pathogens both in nature and in the labs. One can't stop living life and leaving the house because of small mortality rate disease.
Neurological (and cardiovascular) consequences aren't unheard of in general in infectious illnesses accompanied by high fever... various kinds of organ damage happen sometimes, it's called complications from the disease. Flu increases the risk of stroke by 40% and this lasts for about a year, this is official data. Same for pneumonias of various origin, this is standard pneumonia added risk.
Neurological (and cardiovascular) consequences aren't unheard of in general in infectious illnesses accompanied by high fever... various kinds of organ damage happen sometimes, it's called complications from the disease. Flu increases the risk of stroke by 40% and this lasts for about a year, this is official data. Same for pneumonias of various origin, this is standard pneumonia added risk.
So, do you disagree with the neurologists from the Post article who report that what they are witnessing in young and middle-aged people is unusual?
I never thought I'd ever walk into a bank with a bandanna and a KN95 mask on and not be treated as a criminal. I washed and repurposed my late dog's yellow bandanna for yesterday's visit to my local bank branch. I need it because the mask won't get any type of seal over my Saddam Hussein "when-he-emerged-from-the hole" beard. The teller seemed a bit unsure at first from behind her thick bulletproof barrier, but the teller a few windows down, who has been there for the 15 years I've been banking there, recognized my voice and broke the ice with an "Oh, that's Jack!"
EDIT: Later that day I learned that a local branch of some other bank had recently been held up by a man wearing a bandanna.
Here's that very bandanna on someone much more attractive than I:
I recall you talking about Nanners years ago. She was a real cutie. It's good that her bandana served her papa well.
I think that initially they'd used data from China - and it was very sick people who were getting tested, those who got so sick that required hospital admission or a medical visit. So, mortality rate was shown to be very high because tests were administered to those who were more vulnerable to the virus to begin with. I agree, the virus is a new constant and isn't going anywhere, will be there along with other respiratory illnesses (until vaccine is found). There used to be epidemics of diphtheria (with mortality rate in the lines of 20%) and pertussis, in the past, before vaccines were invented for them - but life went on. Scarlet fever was bad, measles, mumps, rubella. There used to be widespread pulmonary tuberculosis. All this is very recent but life went on. I think the lockdowns are simply meant to flatten the curve due to unpreparedness of the medical system... fair game, but they have to learn to scale epidemics responses, as new one can be starting any time - plenty of mutating pathogens both in nature and in the labs. One can't stop living life and leaving the house because of small mortality rate disease.
Good post. Good observations. But the issue with THIS virus at THIS time is as you touched as bolded above: this virus doesn’t replace other viruses ... it’s in addition to ... at a time where the system isn’t structured for a new virus with no treatment / vaccine. It has the potential to crash the system that deals with many other conditions as well.
Good post. Good observations. But the issue with THIS virus at THIS time is as you touched as bolded above: this virus doesn’t replace other viruses ... it’s in addition to ... at a time where the system isn’t structured for a new virus with no treatment / vaccine. It has the potential to crash the system that deals with many other conditions as well.
Yes, it is added to the load from existing infections, primarily flu. If covid mortality rate is 0.4% (what it's looking like so far based on NYC data), then it results in related load on medical system multiplied 5 times (0.1% flu rate + 0.4).
Quote:
Originally Posted by pacific2
So, do you disagree with the neurologists from the Post article who report that what they are witnessing in young and middle-aged people is unusual?
Is there any study or concrete info, numbers? Anything that shows that stroke risk is higher than with flu, which was proven to increase its risk by 40%.
I can not access Post articles due to running adblock (and I won't bother bypassing, even though one can do it).
Why unusual incidence of strokes did not come up earlier, with Asia, Italy, etc being hit by covid even earlier than the States?
Is there underlying stroke risk factor that is present in the States and not so much in these other countries - obesity, or use of birth control pills (sources say that extra strokes were seen mainly in young female patients, which may point to the link with certain birth control methods...these pills do increase stroke risk by themselves, it's a known fact)?
Yes, it is added to the load from existing infections, primarily flu. If covid mortality rate is 0.4% (what it's looking like so far based on NYC data), then it results in related load on medical system multiplied 5 times (0.1% flu rate + 0.4).
Is there any study or concrete info, numbers? Anything that shows that stroke risk is higher than with flu, which was proven to increase its risk by 40%.
I can not access Post articles due to running adblock (and I won't bother bypassing, even though one can do it).
Why unusual incidence of strokes did not come up earlier, with Asia, Italy, etc being hit by covid even earlier than the States?
Is there underlying stroke risk factor that is present in the States and not so much in these other countries - obesity, or use of birth control pills (sources say that extra strokes were seen mainly in young female patients, which may point to the link with certain birth control methods...these pills do increase stroke risk by themselves, it's a known fact)?
While there may be a genetic / racial connection, I’d guess more likely it just hasn’t yet been identified and reported in Asia yet to same realized extent as here now.
Yes, it is added to the load from existing infections, primarily flu. If covid mortality rate is 0.4% (what it's looking like so far based on NYC data), then it results in the load on medical system multiplied 5 times (0.1% flu rate + 0.4).
Is there any study or concrete info, numbers? Anything that shows that stroke risk is higher than with flu, which was proven to increase its risk by 40%.
I can not access Post articles due to running adblock (and I won't bother bypassing, even though one can do it).
Why unusual incidence of strokes did not come up earlier, with Asia, Italy, etc being hit by covid even earlier than the States?
I'm sorry that you can't access the Post article, but here are a few snippets: Young and middle-aged people, barely sick with covid-19, are dying from strokes
Doctors sound alarm about patients in their 30s and 40s left debilitated or dead. Some didn’t even know they were infected. https://www.washingtonpost.com/healt...oung-patients/
Quote:
The man was among several recent stroke patients in their 30s to 40s who were all infected with the coronavirus. The median age for that type of severe stroke is 74.
As Oxley, an interventional neurologist, began the procedure to remove the clot, he observed something he had never seen before. On the monitors, the brain typically shows up as a tangle of black squiggles — “like a can of spaghetti,” he said — that provide a map of blood vessels. A clot shows up as a blank spot. As he used a needlelike device to pull out the clot, he saw new clots forming in real-time around it.
“This is crazy,” he remembers telling his boss.
Quote:
Reports of strokes in the young and middle-aged — not just at Mount Sinai, but also in many other hospitals in communities hit hard by the novel coronavirus — are the latest twist in our evolving understanding of the disease it causes. The numbers of those affected are small but nonetheless remarkable because they challenge how doctors understand the virus.
Quote:
There was one report out of Wuhan, China, that showed that some hospitalized patients had experienced strokes, with many being seriously ill and elderly. But the linkage was considered more of “a clinical hunch by a lot of really smart people,” said Sherry H-Y Chou, a University of Pittsburgh Medical Center neurologist and critical care doctor.
Now for the first time, three large U.S. medical centers are preparing to publish data on the stroke phenomenon. There are only a few dozen cases per location, but they provide new insights into what the virus does to our bodies.
Quote:
The analyses suggest coronavirus patients are mostly experiencing the deadliest type of stroke. Known as large vessel occlusions, or LVOs, they can obliterate large parts of the brain responsible for movement, speech and decision-making in one blow because they are in the main blood-supplying arteries.
Many researchers suspect strokes in covid-19 patients may be a direct consequence of blood problems that are producing clots all over some people’s bodies.
Quote:
Many doctors expressed worry that as the New York City Fire Department was picking up four times as many people who died at home as normal during the peak of infection that some of the dead had suffered sudden strokes. The truth may never be known because few autopsies were conducted.
Chou said one question is whether the clotting is because of a direct attack on the blood vessels, or a “friendly-fire problem” caused by the patient’s immune response.
Cute Lab, Fontucky You should check out a YT channel called Life with Labradors. Better yet, show them to your Lab and see what he thinks. He might fall in love with Daisy. ♥
Yes, it is added to the load from existing infections, primarily flu. If covid mortality rate is 0.4% (what it's looking like so far based on NYC data), then it results in related load on medical system multiplied 5 times (0.1% flu rate + 0.4).
Is there any study or concrete info, numbers? Anything that shows that stroke risk is higher than with flu, which was proven to increase its risk by 40%.
I can not access Post articles due to running adblock (and I won't bother bypassing, even though one can do it).
Why unusual incidence of strokes did not come up earlier, with Asia, Italy, etc being hit by covid even earlier than the States?
Is there underlying stroke risk factor that is present in the States and not so much in these other countries - obesity, or use of birth control pills (sources say that extra strokes were seen mainly in young female patients, which may point to the link with certain birth control methods...these pills do increase stroke risk by themselves, it's a known fact)?
Also, even during a "normal" flu season, of the young and middle-aged patients on the neurology ward, aren't you more likely to see head trauma 2nd to MVA, a rare glioblastoma, maybe a MS patient, maybe an epilepsy patient, a very rare HIV+ or other infectious illness pt., and very rarely, a CVA not due to substance abuse? Just guessing.
Last edited by pacific2; 04-25-2020 at 02:13 PM..
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I'm also still confused why we had to shut down the economy over this when there have been other viruses that killed hundreds of thousands in this country but barely made the news. This virus is a news constant. 24/7. I'm starting to believe the government wants us to be in fear so we'll depend on them more. (sorry, just thinking outloud) 
You should check out a YT channel called Life with Labradors. Better yet, show them to your Lab and see what he thinks. He might fall in love with Daisy. ♥
