Why do Afrocentists try to relate themselves to Egypt rather than claim their real history? (westerners, country)
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This guy is a nut job.
Pure and simple.
IGNORE HIM. He thrives on creating drama and turmoil over all this anti-AFROCENTRIST this or that.
You'll never prove anything to him because his aim is simply to seek attention, controversy, and divisiveness. He's thoroughly brainwashed and calls himself a scholar... but has the utter gall and racist audacity to insult and dismiss every black intellectual and historian who has ever lived.
He discounts and rebukes known science and pulls out the same old tired made up slave-master garbage "science" he can copy and paste and calls it, "proof."
IGNORE THIS NUT JOB.
At the very least, this guy is a classic, poster boy for Borderline Personality Disorder.
(... has anyone ever asked him about his online name? We're all supposed to KNOW that it's a "joke" between he and his "Peruvian girlfriend" ... because it's ... "misspelled"!
That's supposed to be so special and funny, right?
The same way "this scholar" misspells English words ... )
Jesus Christ will you read the thread? This has already been debunked.
DNA TRIBES is based on data ADMITTEDLY FALSIFIED.
Besides, this, even taken at face value, relates to ONE DYNASTY OF THE NEW KINGDOM.
You second "evidence" clearly states that the results are that the mummy is WEST ASIANS. Good job! You have added to post 529, and from now on, I will be citing your study.
You can't pull anything because you don't know anything.
IGNORE HIM. He thrives on creating drama and turmoil over all this anti-AFROCENTRIST this or that.
You'll never prove anything to him because his aim is simply to seek attention, controversy, and divisiveness. He's thoroughly brainwashed and calls himself a scholar... but has the utter gall and racist audacity to insult and dismiss every black intellectual and historian who has ever lived.
He discounts and rebukes known science and pulls out the same old tired made up slave-master garbage "science" he can copy and paste and calls it, "proof."
IGNORE THIS NUT JOB.
At the very least, this guy is a classic, poster boy for Borderline Personality Disorder.
(... has anyone ever asked him about his online name? We're all supposed to KNOW that it's a "joke" between he and his "Peruvian girlfriend" ... because it's ... "misspelled"!
That's supposed to be so special and funny, right?
The same way "this scholar" misspells English words ... )
Who ever questioned the influence of Greece and Rome on "European civilization"? I'm fully aware of the Roman conquests of Europe. What does that have to do with the statement I made? .
Egypt had no effect on Africa other than the Sudanese.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkc2j
So I guess I can claim Greek and Roman culture as well since my ancestors were conquered by Europeans and I have some European DNA lol. .
You go right ahead.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkc2j
Egypt had no effect of the rest of Africa? Egypt was the apex of many cultures in Africa. .
Other than Sudan, name them and the SPECIFIC instances of hieroglyphic writing, pyramid building, and Maat found throughout the rest of Africa. Name on country that continued to be influenced by Ancient Egypt.
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkc2j
Arkell, A. J. The Prehistory of the Nile Valley. Vol. 1. Leiden: Brill, 1975.
Arkell, A. J., and Peter J. Ucko. "A Review of Predynastic Development in the Nile Valley." Current Anthropology 6, no. 2 (1965): 145-66.
Bard, Kathryn A. "The Egyptian Predynastic: A Review of the Evidence." Journal of Field Archaeology 21, no. 3 (1994): 265-88.
Barnard, M. M. "The secular variations of skull characters in four series of Egyptian skulls." Annals of Human Genetics 6, no. 4 (December 1935): 352–71.
Bell, Lanny. "Ancestor Worship and Divine Kingship in the Ancient Nile Valley." In Egypt in Africa, compiled by Theodore Celenko, 56-8. Indianapolis: Indianapolis Museum of Art and Indiana University Press, 1996.
Berry, A. C., and R. J. Berry. "Genetical change in ancient Egypt." Man 2 (1967): 551-68.
Brace, C. Loring. "Clines and Clusters Versus "Race: A Test in Ancient Egypt and the Case of a Death on the Nile." Yearbook of Physical Anthropology 36 (1993): 1-31.
These books barely scratch the surface.
Dear lord, the ones I recognize support my position. I quoted Brace.
ThePredynastic of Upper Egypt and the Late Dynastic of Lower Egypt are moreclosely related to each other than to any other population. As a whole, theyshow ties with the European Neolithic, North Africa, modern Europe, and, moreremotely, India, but not at all with sub-Saharan Africa, eastern Asia... ...Oceania,or the New World. Adjacent people in the Nile valley show similarities intrivial traits in an unbroken series from the delta in the north southwardthrough Nubia and all the way to Somalia at the equator. At the same time, thegradient in skin color and body proportions suggests long-term adaptiveresponse to selective forces appropriate to the latitude where they occur...
...We conclude thatthe Egyptians have been in place since back in the Pleistocene and have beenlargely unaffected by either invasions or migrations. As others have noted,Egyptians are Egyptians, and they were so in the past as well
So why don't you go ahead and explain how these random "sources" you posted in any way support your absurd position?
"Perhaps the oldest evidence for a settled culture along the Nile Valley was uncovered in the 1940s by Anthony J. Arkell not in Egypt itself but in central Sudan near modern Khartoum. This culture, dubbed the Khartoum Mesolithic, is regarded as sedentary or at least semi-sedentary because it left behind the oldest pottery found anywhere in Africa, dated to approximately 7300 BC (archaeologists consider pottery a trademark of sedentary and semi-sedentary cultures because it is too fragile to be carried around by constantly moving nomads). The Khartoum Mesolithic culture has also left behind bone harpoons, grain-grinding stones, and burials of the dead (Byrnes 2009), but most significant of all is a piece of rock art depicting a boat. As Usai and Salvatori (2007) show, the boat's design shows close architectural parallels with later Egyptian ships well into the Pharaonic period, indicating that the Khartoum Mesolithic culture evolved into or at least influenced Egyptian culture."
"Around 6000 BC the earliest sign of a settlement appear in Egypt proper, specifically in the area of Nabta Playa in the country's far southeast (Wendorf and Schild 1998). The ruins of stone houses built in straight rows, wells, a circle of small megaliths, and stone tumuli (burial mounds) containing cattle bones have all been found here, in an area that is now desert but was savanna then; the Nabta Playan people appear to have had an economy based on herding cattle which were probably domesticated from a North African subspecies of aurochs different from cattle used in the Near East and Europe (Wendorf 1994, Hanotte et al 2002). J´ordeczka et al (2011) report similarities between the Nabta Playan pottery and older Sudanese pottery, again showing a southern origin or influence for the proto-Egyptians."
"The next significant culture to appear in Egypt is the Fayum Neolithic culture further north, which goes back to 5200 BC and provides the oldest evidence for agriculture in the country. Some of the crops and animals used by the Neolithic Fayumians do appear to have come from the Near East instead of being indigenous to Africa, but even here it is unlikely that the people themselves were of Near Eastern origin. Ehret et all (1996) note that the development of agriculture in the Fayum area appears to have been gradual, which is more consistent with native Africans slowly incorporating Near Eastern domesticates into an indigenous foraging strategy rather than a mass colonization of Near Eastern farmers, who would have brought about a more abrupt change in subsistence strategy. Furthermore, Arkell (1975) notes similarities in artifacts from the Fayum Neolithic to those produced by contemporary Sudanese cultures, and as will be shown later, the skeletal remains left behind by the people of ancient northern Egypt are more similar to those of Africans."
"Between 5200 and 4000 BC, knowledge of agriculture spread from the Fayum into Upper (southern) Egypt, but this did not completely replace the earlier cattle-herding Upper Egyptian culture. On the contrary, Egyptians continued to be semi-sedentary cattle herders who annually moved between Nile Valley villages and the grasslands beyond, with agriculture being only a supplement to this pastoral lifestyle (Wilkinson 2003). Egyptian tools and pottery also continued to resemble those from more southerly Africa (de Heinzelin 1962, Arkell and Ucko 1965, and Arkell 1975) and prehistoric rock art from the Sahara shows Egyptian connections (Donadoni 1964)."
"The Sahara began to turn from savanna into desert between 4000 and 3000 BC, forcing the Egyptians to abandon their pastoral ways, cling to the Nile Valley, and develop an urbanized and socially stratified culture that would evolve into classical Egyptian civilization. Most of these developments would occur in Upper Egypt, with Lower (northern) Egypt remaining a relative backwater as indicated by unimpressive burials relative to the large elite tombs of the south (Wilkinson 2003). Eventually the Upper Egyptian culture would completely replace the Lower Egyptian culture and dominate the entire length of the Egyptian Nile Valley (Bard 1994). Around the same time, a wealthy monarchic culture very similar to Upper Egypt's was developing in Sudan (Williams 1986), again showing a cultural link between Egypt and this part of Africa."
Taken as a whole, the archaeological data shows both strong cultural affinities between early Egypt and more inland regions of Africa, particularly Sudan, and a predominantly southern origin for Egyptian civilization. If Egyptian culture was heavily derivative of Near Eastern traditions, Lower Egyptian culture would have dominated the south, yet instead the reverse is observed. Whatever influence the Near East had during Egypt's formative period was not enough to replace an indigenous---and therefore African---foundation.
What has any of this to do with the fact that the Egyptians are the same people that they always were, and never a "blacker" people?
What has any of this got to do with the more important fact that THEY AREN'T YOUR ANCESTORS ONE WAY OR THE OTHER?
A lot of this is outdated, by the way, and Egyptians origins are known to come from many directions.
Jesus Christ will you read the thread? This has already been debunked.
DNA TRIBES is based on data ADMITTEDLY FALSIFIED.
Besides, this, even taken at face value, relates to ONE DYNASTY OF THE NEW KINGDOM.
You second "evidence" clearly states that the results are that the mummy is WEST ASIANS. Good job! You have added to post 529, and from now on, I will be citing your study.
You can't pull anything because you don't know anything.
DNA Tribe data was admittedly falsified? Based on what?
The whole point of me posting DNA stats was to show you how easy it was to pull information from the web to support either side of the debate. The only thing you show as proof to back up your argument is post #529, which is fine but it doesn't tell the full story. I'd rather focus on historical, cultural anthropological and archeological evidence to support my claims.
Egypt had no effect on Africa other than the Sudanese.
You go right ahead.
Other than Sudan, name them and the SPECIFIC instances of hieroglyphic writing, pyramid building, and Maat found throughout the rest of Africa. Name on country that continued to be influenced by Ancient Egypt.
Dear lord, the ones I recognize support my position. I quoted Brace.
ThePredynastic of Upper Egypt and the Late Dynastic of Lower Egypt are moreclosely related to each other than to any other population. As a whole, theyshow ties with the European Neolithic, North Africa, modern Europe, and, moreremotely, India, but not at all with sub-Saharan Africa, eastern Asia... ...Oceania,or the New World. Adjacent people in the Nile valley show similarities intrivial traits in an unbroken series from the delta in the north southwardthrough Nubia and all the way to Somalia at the equator. At the same time, thegradient in skin color and body proportions suggests long-term adaptiveresponse to selective forces appropriate to the latitude where they occur...
...We conclude thatthe Egyptians have been in place since back in the Pleistocene and have beenlargely unaffected by either invasions or migrations. As others have noted,Egyptians are Egyptians, and they were so in the past as well
So why don't you go ahead and explain how these random "sources" you posted in any way support your absurd position?
Bro, did you even bother looking up any of the works I cited?
What has any of this to do with the fact that the Egyptians are the same people that they always were, and never a "blacker" people?
What has any of this got to do with the more important fact that THEY AREN'T YOUR ANCESTORS ONE WAY OR THE OTHER?
A lot of this is outdated, by the way, and Egyptians origins are known to come from many directions.
A lot of if is outdated? Now I know you didn't bother looking up any of the works lol.
Just like the Greeks and Romans may not have been your ancestors. Yet you still claim them as your own(As most Eurocentric's do) Show me evidence that the Slavs, Celts, Basically any tribe that originated in Northern Europe had anything to do with the "foundation" of Greco Roman culture and I'll gladly retract my statement.
What has any of this to do with the fact that the Egyptians are the same people that they always were, and never a "blacker" people?
What has any of this got to do with the more important fact that THEY AREN'T YOUR ANCESTORS ONE WAY OR THE OTHER?
A lot of this is outdated, by the way, and Egyptians origins are known to come from many directions.
Nowhere in any of my posts did you see where I typed that Egyptians were a "blacker" people. There were many skin tones, from very dark to lighter skin.
Last edited by jkc2j; 03-04-2014 at 10:25 PM..
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cachibatches .. again....
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