Ohio, pulled in two directions (Cleveland, Dayton: quality of life, to live, dangerous)

[SlideRules99]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

I think it's important to not judge people by what they put in front of their house. I actually wouldn't be too upset if lawn signs were banned, it makes it too easy to be hostile to people you don't know at all. I get along with the people in my neighborhood with both the "Let's Go Brandon" sign and the pride flag. Perhaps I'm alone, but I actually find it kinda encouraging that these types of people can coexist in such close proximity.

No, you’re not alone. I also prefer a mixed bag and (ideally) a civil co-existence.

I’ve lived in counties where 80% of voters have voted one way. A bit too lopsided for me, especially with no counter-balance at the state level.

In that case, the threat of violence against those expressing opposing views was very real.

[GraniteStater]

Originally Posted by sheena12

I am a transplant from the NYC metro area, to Ohio. We moved from NY, for a more affordable lifestyle, yet had moderate politics, respect for education, superior health care, and vibrant cities with arts, culture, and professional sports. (That last requirement was my husband's)

We are not Southerners. The Bible Belt would not work for us. We are not conservatives by any stretch of the imagination. We enjoy the outdoors and eating out. We are not fans of fast food, we prefer sophisticated food, whether international, ethnic and fine dining. We are socially progressive, and we have Gay friends.

Both of us are saddened by the path that Ohio has taken. It's disturbing.

We live in Trumbull County, but we go to Cleveland many weekends. We have made more like-minded friends there. Cleveland still feels chill and interesting. We were still interested in selling our house and relocating to Cleveland. Now, we are unsure.

On the way home Sunday, on 422 we had a discussion. It's always a little sad to return leave Cleveland but this time we noticed a proliferation of Right Wing billboards, and lawn signs, more numerous than ever before. More of them, and more extreme, angry, and hateful. Especially towards the current president. We also took notice of all of the fundamentalist churches. It seems that every other month, there's a new Mega Church upstart. I've never seen more Pentecostal, Nazarene, and Baptist churches - except in the Carolinas.

We didn't want to move to the Bible Belt, but it seems the Bible Belt has moved to us.

Trumbull County has been declining in population and jobs for decades, it doesn't surprise me at all that it displays more regressive characteristics as that is one unfortunate result of the Brain Drain in action. It actually has a lower median household income now (when adjusted for inflation) compared to 30 years ago.

[SlideRules99]

Originally Posted by GraniteStater

Trumbull County has been declining in population and jobs for decades, it doesn't surprise me at all that it displays more regressive characteristics as that is one unfortunate result of the Brain Drain in action. It actually has a lower median household income now (when adjusted for inflation) compared to 30 years ago.

Trumbull County has shifted rightward as predominantly white middle class voters have turned away from a Democratic Party more focused on national culture wars and identity politics, than on working class labor and economic concerns.

And voters there are upset about inflation and chaos at the southern border. I cannot emphasize the latter enough…

While I am much more familiar with Trumbull Co., I suspect many other non-urban working class communities share these sentiments.

Dems may have a chance to recapture some hearts and minds by campaigning on local issues such as manufacturing/labor, and keeping a distance from transgender bathroom debates.

Further, the GOP over-reach on abortion could swing things a few points to the Dem side.

[GraniteStater]

Originally Posted by SlideRules99

Trumbull County has shifted rightward as predominantly white middle class voters have turned away from a Democratic Party more focused on national culture wars and identity politics, than on working class labor and economic concerns.

And voters there are upset about inflation and chaos at the southern border. I cannot emphasize the latter enough…

While I am much more familiar with Trumbull Co., I suspect many other non-urban working class communities share these sentiments.

Dems may have a chance to recapture some hearts and minds by campaigning on local issues such as manufacturing/labor, and keeping a distance from transgender bathroom debates.

Further, the GOP over-reach on abortion could swing things a few points to the Dem side.

I think another factor that results in the negative job growth rates found in places like Trumbull County is the fact that many companies will not choose to relocate or expand there (for better or worse) only because Ohio is not a "Right To Work" state. This has a disproportionately negative impact on lower-middle income cities and counties outside of larger metropolitan areas in the state. The loss of younger and middle aged residents in places like Trumbull County also means companies will think twice at relocating there if they can't access the type of workforce required. A higher percentage of residents are over age 65 than under age 18.

[bjimmy24]

There are really good people in Trumbull and mahoning. They’ve been through a lot like we have in Cleveland, but they haven’t seen a rebound nearly as close to what we have. They are hit hard disproportionately by a lot of economic factors and then told they are the problem too, as they see their lives deteriorate. They all voted Dem until 2016. This is not the peoples fault.

[216facts]

I used to watch MSNBC & CNN political shows all the time, got a bit riled up about Fox pundits and some of the other radio pundits. Then I realized I'm playing their game and they're changing the rules as I play. At the end of the day, I divorced it all. I don't care much about state or even Fed politics, I go with the flow, ignoring much of what I see and hear. I focus on other things that matter a hell of a lot more to me.

[sheena12]

Originally Posted by TheProf

Sheena, you seem like a cool person. Sorry to hear about your recent negative impressions in Greater Cleveland. Were there specific areas you can point to?

Cleveland is still cool. It's when you get on the outskirts, particularly 422 traveling East. "Eff Biden" on a large placard in front of a private home. Billboards about eternal damnation. Numbers to call if you want to be "saved".

It's the STATE - not Cleveland.

Trumbull county is crazy conservative. The Assemblies of God plant churches here constantly, and they are especially insidious about political indoctrination. My area has about 11 churches of this denomination in our area, including many other evangelical churches and a mega-church.
They are involved in local affairs. They only do "good works" for the area for the press and publicity.

And the recent legislation. I feel as though there is, in a broad sense; little separation of church and state, in Ohio. And people are OK with that. In fact, they welcome it.
For example, we attended a community meeting about the adoption of children from state foster care, and it was held at the local megachurch. OK, that's not terrible, but our public HS, of which our daughter is a graduate; was also a choice. The pastor began the information session with a prayer. It was not a religious adoption agency, it was one connected with the state. Yet, everyone dutifully bowed their heads in prayer. He proceeded to invite people in the audience to his church.

The absolute worst to us is the myriad of current proposed legislation that is nothing short of wacky - and dangerous.

[sheena12]

Originally Posted by bjimmy24

There are really good people in Trumbull and mahoning. They’ve been through a lot like we have in Cleveland, but they haven’t seen a rebound nearly as close to what we have. They are hit hard disproportionately by a lot of economic factors and then told they are the problem too, as they see their lives deteriorate. They all voted Dem until 2016. This is not the peoples fault.

Much of it has to do with gerrymandering.

[TheProf]

Originally Posted by SlideRules99

No, you’re not alone. I also prefer a mixed bag and (ideally) a civil co-existence.

I’ve lived in counties where 80% of voters have voted one way. A bit too lopsided for me, especially with no counter-balance at the state level.

In that case, the threat of violence against those expressing opposing views was very real.

Diversity of political views is one thing. I can have an honest discussion and debate with a traditional Republican (supply-side economics; small government, reducing regulations, etc) and would welcome them into the neighborhood and marketplace of ideas. But this new MAGA, election-denying, Jan- 6 supporting far-right iteration of the GOP is beyond the pale. Not only are they not worthy of debate and not suitable for any neighborhood I want to live in; they should be watched by the authorities. Unfortunately, this is what Ohio and the Ohio GOP are morphing into ... Very dangerous.

[sheena12]

Originally Posted by TheProf

Diversity of political views is one thing. I can have an honest discussion and debate with a traditional Republican (supply-side economics; small government, reducing regulations, etc) and would welcome them into the neighborhood and marketplace of ideas. But this new MAGA, election-denying, Jan- 6 supporting far-right iteration of the GOP is beyond the pale. Not only are they not worthy of debate and not suitable for any neighborhood I want to live in; they should be watched by the authorities. Unfortunately, this is what Ohio and the Ohio GOP are morphing into ... Very dangerous.

I agree. I have had such discussions. But these people are impossible to debate. This new breed of "Republican" is unreasonable. I mean "unreasonable" literally. They can not reason, and their "debates are befouled with racism, name-calling, hatred, sentimental patriotism, and religion.