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View Poll Results: Do you support giving Ukraine F-16s
Yes 201 39.64%
No 257 50.69%
Unsure 49 9.66%
Voters: 507. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 12-31-2022, 06:30 PM
 
8,996 posts, read 11,885,467 times
Reputation: 10906

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Precision artillery and drone strikes kill more Russian invaders.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBQqtTLbh2E
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Old 12-31-2022, 07:17 PM
 
Location: NE Mississippi
25,799 posts, read 17,567,944 times
Reputation: 37708
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hesychios View Post
I don't let "sources" tell me what to think.

I have five decades as an adult voter, making my own observations to inform me about the Republican Party. I have seen it from up close.
Then how could you be so wrong?
Here I am a Republican voter that can match your five decades; I have lots of Republican friends and none of us believe what you charge us with. The Dems have got your head, nothing more. If you are typical your entire family is Democrat.
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Old 12-31-2022, 08:24 PM
 
21,422 posts, read 7,520,927 times
Reputation: 13233
Quote:
Originally Posted by Listener2307 View Post
Then how could you be so wrong?
Here I am a Republican voter that can match your five decades; I have lots of Republican friends and none of us believe what you charge us with. The Dems have got your head, nothing more. If you are typical your entire family is Democrat.
No. Not wrong ... dead right.

I have been Republican, and have many relatives who were Republicans their whole lives or are Republicans to this day, including an uncle who ran for congress here in Illinois when Nixon was president. I didn't like Nixon but I supported my uncle.

I have a small business and belong to the Chamber of Commerce, I was quite active as an Illinois Republican voter and donor for over two decades. Of course that is in the past, no more Republican Party for me.

To Republicans the Defense budget is a sacred cow. It is extraordinarily bloated. For people who believe in "small government" that simply does not apply when we are talking about the military. It was that way since the early 50's, which caused president Eisenhower to warn us about the military-industrial complex, which to his alarm he watched grow. This is a betrayal of the values and principles of the earlier Republican party Eisenhower came from.

Traditional Republicans before WWII were against a large military, but Big Business got the upper hand in the party and promoted excessive defense spending in peacetime. It remained that way all through the Nixon and Reagan neocon era, through both Bush presidencies and into the Trump era.

Just as remarkably steady was the Republican opposition to assisting people in need or improving our lives in meaningful ways. This is why the party opposed Social Security when it was first proposed and all the way through to today, also opposing Medicare. You should not need me to point this out.

This is also why Republicans today oppose all progressive legislation and regulations protecting our drinking water and the air we breathe (it wasn't always that way, but it is today), they oppose workplace safety,they oppose any efforts to raise the minimum wage to return it to anything close in buying power to what it was decades ago. The party even opposes the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, and has tried to kill it off more than once.

It is why the Republicans have always opposed programs like Head Start for kids, and help with school meal programs.

Not least, the party opposes any sort of national health care program. We are the only major western nation not to have one. When Trump and the Republican Congress had a chance to write the law for one which they promised to do, they came up empty-handed ... awkward.

Yet this conversation started out with someone complaining that we could be "taking care of a myriad problems right here in this country" with the money we are spending buying American made military hardware for Ukraine.

No we wouldn't ... not if we rely on Republicans to do it. Republicans would oppose any spending for such purposes. That money could perhaps go into the Pentagon budget and make the whole Republican Party happy, but they wouldn't be using it to make the world safe for democracy and they wouldn't be using it for any positive good here at home.
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Old 12-31-2022, 08:52 PM
 
2,076 posts, read 1,359,075 times
Reputation: 5150
Here's a closer look at both sides of why negotiations have not had success.
BTW, Novara media is a leftwing news source.
https://novaramedia.com/2022/10/17/n...s-with-russia/
https://novaramedia.com/2022/10/07/l...ar-in-ukraine/

Here is a list of the 10 points of the most recent proposal by Ukraine/Zelenskyy
https://www.wionews.com/world/explai...support-547475

And here is the real problem, dated Dec 28, 2022
https://www.reuters.com/world/europe...ns-2022-12-28/

Quote:
The Kremlin on Wednesday dismissed Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelenskiy's 10-point peace plan, saying that proposals to end the conflict in Ukraine must take into account what it calls "today's realities" of four Ukrainian regions having joined Russia.

Kremlin spokesman Dmitry Peskov said: "There can be no peace plan for Ukraine that does not take into account today's realities regarding Russian territory, with the entry of four regions into Russia. Plans that do not take these realities into account cannot be peaceful."

Russia declared Ukraine's Donetsk, Luhansk, Kherson and Zaporizhzhia regions as part of its territory in September after referendums condemned by Ukraine and Western countries. Russia does not fully control any of the four regions.
So NO, Russia is not willing to negotiate a peace plan, it is demanding a surrender.
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Old 12-31-2022, 09:11 PM
 
Location: NE Mississippi
25,799 posts, read 17,567,944 times
Reputation: 37708
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hesychios View Post
No. Not wrong ... dead right.

I have been Republican, and have many relatives who were Republicans their whole lives or are Republicans to this day, including an uncle who ran for congress here in Illinois when Nixon was president. I didn't like Nixon but I supported my uncle.

I have a small business and belong to the Chamber of Commerce, I was quite active as an Illinois Republican voter and donor for over two decades. Of course that is in the past, no more Republican Party for me.

To Republicans the Defense budget is a sacred cow. It is extraordinarily bloated. For people who believe in "small government" that simply does not apply when we are talking about the military. It was that way since the early 50's, which caused president Eisenhower to warn us about the military-industrial complex, which to his alarm he watched grow. This is a betrayal of the values and principles of the earlier Republican party Eisenhower came from.

Traditional Republicans before WWII were against a large military, but Big Business got the upper hand in the party and promoted excessive defense spending in peacetime. It remained that way all through the Nixon and Reagan neocon era, through both Bush presidencies and into the Trump era.

Just as remarkably steady was the Republican opposition to assisting people in need or improving our lives in meaningful ways. This is why the party opposed Social Security when it was first proposed and all the way through to today, also opposing Medicare. You should not need me to point this out.

This is also why Republicans today oppose all progressive legislation and regulations protecting our drinking water and the air we breathe (it wasn't always that way, but it is today), they oppose workplace safety,they oppose any efforts to raise the minimum wage to return it to anything close in buying power to what it was decades ago. The party even opposes the Consumer Financial Protection Bureau, and has tried to kill it off more than once.

It is why the Republicans have always opposed programs like Head Start for kids, and help with school meal programs.

Not least, the party opposes any sort of national health care program. We are the only major western nation not to have one. When Trump and the Republican Congress had a chance to write the law for one which they promised to do, they came up empty-handed ... awkward.

Yet this conversation started out with someone complaining that we could be "taking care of a myriad problems right here in this country" with the money we are spending buying American made military hardware for Ukraine.

No we wouldn't ... not if we rely on Republicans to do it. Republicans would oppose any spending for such purposes. That money could perhaps go into the Pentagon budget and make the whole Republican Party happy, but they wouldn't be using it to make the world safe for democracy and they wouldn't be using it for any positive good here at home.
LOL! Your side just passed and signed a bill that was twice the size of the defense budget and there was literally nothing of substance on it!
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Old 12-31-2022, 09:27 PM
 
8,217 posts, read 3,771,999 times
Reputation: 2767
Quote:
Originally Posted by Listener2307 View Post
LOL! Your side just passed and signed a bill that was twice the size of the defense budget and there was literally nothing of substance on it!
The "defense" budget needs to be cut by a factor of 4. And I'm being generous. Next.
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Old 12-31-2022, 10:20 PM
 
Location: Southwest
2,625 posts, read 2,364,580 times
Reputation: 1986
Quote:
Originally Posted by davidt1 View Post
Precision artillery and drone strikes kill more Russian invaders.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zBQqtTLbh2E

Saw the first two scenes. I guess the guys didn't survive.
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Old 01-01-2023, 02:22 AM
 
51,742 posts, read 26,064,301 times
Reputation: 38064
Fascinating analysis of the Kharkiv counteroffensive.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world...erson-donetsk/
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Old 01-01-2023, 08:05 AM
 
51,742 posts, read 26,064,301 times
Reputation: 38064
I read that some Russian came back after the partial mobilization seemed to come to an end. Imagine they will be hitting the road again.

Last edited by GotHereQuickAsICould; 01-01-2023 at 08:22 AM..
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Old 01-01-2023, 08:13 AM
 
Location: NE Mississippi
25,799 posts, read 17,567,944 times
Reputation: 37708
Ian Bremmer is another one of the geopoliticists who have studied and written so much about this conflict. He takes positions about Biden, Trump, European leaders, Putin and so forth.
Cut to the 7 minute mark and see how he was wrong about this invasion and hear him explain why he was wrong and what might happen next..... He goes on to predict the rebirth, so to speak, of NATO.
As usual, there are points I disagree with, too.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wqqUZB4XnLo
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