Official Greater Philadelphia Area Crime Thread (York, Darby: specialist, Latino, amendment)

[ilovephilly79]

Originally Posted by AshbyQuin

I’d say the 15 other people who were intentionally shot on the same day is the tipping point instead of a freak accident from celebratory gunfire.

Logically that would make sense. But I can tell you that if I had went to the parkway for this event and had to run my children out of there because I was worried they would be shot to death, I would not be going anywhere like that again for a very long time. Maybe ever.

[cpomp]

Originally Posted by AshbyQuin

They're now looking at is as a possible accidental celebratory shooting. A woman in Kensington was struck in the foot last night after several people shot in the air blocks away.

Sounds like some drunk idiots watching from afar, shot into the air celebrating the fireworks show and a few bullets struck the officers. Witnesses didn't see a gunman and said the shots happened at the exact same time as the show started.

I wonder if the person(s) responsible even remember what happened after a long night of drinking.

Originally Posted by mphilly

The police department itself said it was investigating whether it was celebratory and as the story has developed it’s become known that they were both just grazed by bullets. This story has always seemed strange to me.

This is not to say that crime isn’t a huge problem but I’m starting to think this particular incident was not as serious as it first seemed.

Originally Posted by ilovephilly79

Logically that would make sense. But I can tell you that if I had went to the parkway for this event and had to run my children out of there because I was worried they would be shot to death, I would not be going anywhere like that again for a very long time. Maybe ever.

I hope it was a freak accident, not intentional, but as mphilly said, the damage is done.

AshbyQuin, 15 people intentionally shot is worse, but the Parkway shooting made national news (again), and the optics of that incident will scare people even if it was an accident.

I'm not sure what the city can do at this point to "quickly" curb violence, I am hoping longterm strategies actually show some relief for Philadelphians.

New York City has a new Mayor and crime is high biggest focus, and 20+ shot and 9 people killed there last weekend. It does take time. The difference there is the Mayor is exceedingly motivated to decrease crime, unlike Mr. Kenney.

[Angus215]

Originally Posted by ilovephilly79

Logically that would make sense. But I can tell you that if I had went to the parkway for this event and had to run my children out of there because I was worried they would be shot to death, I would not be going anywhere like that again for a very long time. Maybe ever.

You would have been a fool to bring your children to a large gathering at night in Philadelphia to begin with, after seeing the carnage that was permitted during the BLM "peaceful protests" just a couple years ago . . . and the anarchy state that has been permitted since Kenney became mayor and Krasner became DA.

[MPK21]

This whole discussion about this Parkway mess being celebratory, accidental, or unintentional is misplaced. The shooter being drunk and that the 15 people shot were intended targets are all assumptions taken as conclusions.

Not understanding how even if this was unintended or accidental it somehow limits the risk to the public or security forces on hand. It happened...and whether it was 1 or 2 shots fired, they went into a large crowd.

Maybe the shooter was taking a shot at someone else outside the event or was, in fact, firing for ''fun''. Philly has tons of cases of stray bullets killing or injuring innocent bystanders or folks walking by.

It's no accident whenever anyone fires a gun not intending otherwise to kill or injure anyone. Intended, celebratory, or accidental, each posed a risk to people...which is the point...go to Penns Landing...a-holes start arguing...someone 100 ft away drinking a soda is killed or hurt by a stray bullet...oops, sorry, didn't mean to kill you, ruin your life or your family's...it's still safe to come to Penns Landing because the victim was unintended or the shooting was accidental...South Street last month...oops, sorry about that, wasn't aiming at you.

Parkway, Penns Landing, South Street...all equally dangerous situations. My concern about the Parkway on the 4th wasn't about a lone mass-shooter, more along the lines of what actually happened...stray gunfire from idiot/s.

Btw, there's no such thing as a ''freak accident from celebratory gunfire''.

[Redddog]

Originally Posted by MPK21

....

Parkway, Penns Landing, South Street...all equally dangerous situations. My concern about the Parkway on the 4th wasn't about a lone mass-shooter, more along the lines of what actually happened...stray gunfire from idiot/s.

....

Not only those areas but now, the trouble is spilling into areas surrounding those areas. We were out last night in Old City around 10. There were at least 3 groups of kids 15-19 ish running around yelling and stuff. I never saw a gun but if you don't proceed as if someone in one of those groups does, you're not paying attention. And it can happen on you in a flash.

Yesterday driving home on Kelly Drive, some d-bag was looking to turn out of one of those riverside parking lots, across the oncoming lanes. It wasn't gonna happen. But he pulled out into the furthest right lane blocking me and causing stoppage with horns blowing etc. I put my hands up like "dude, wtf?" That kid looked at me like he wanted to kill me, rolled down his window and made like he was holding a gun and pretend fired at me, yelling like a mad man "I'll kill you, mutha fukka! I'll kill you." I have no doubt that if he had a gun, he would have used it. It was effed up.

Point is, it's crazy out there right now. Kids are running wild with no impulse restraint. We have to do something to break this cycle on an immediate basis. Support groups and community involvement are long-term solutions that need to be supported and developed asap, but the groups that are out there right now are beyond that. And they're the ones terrorizing the city at the moment.

I'm usually the first to push the theory that violent crime in this town and elsewhere are mostly drug-trade players and thugs. But the recent activity points to a more wide-spread group that is just out of control. People aren't safe in this town right now. And a show of force, along with HEAVY consequences for violent behavior is the only way out in the immediate term.

I say bring the Nat Guard in. This is war. (I'm only half serious).

[Muinteoir]

Originally Posted by Redddog

Not only those areas but now, the trouble is spilling into areas surrounding those areas. We were out last night in Old City around 10. There were at least 3 groups of kids 15-19 ish running around yelling and stuff. I never saw a gun but if you don't proceed as if someone in one of those groups does, you're not paying attention. And it can happen on you in a flash.

Yesterday driving home on Kelly Drive, some d-bag was looking to turn out of one of those riverside parking lots, across the oncoming lanes. It wasn't gonna happen. But he pulled out into the furthest right lane blocking me and causing stoppage with horns blowing etc. I put my hands up like "dude, wtf?" That kid looked at me like he wanted to kill me, rolled down his window and made like he was holding a gun and pretend fired at me, yelling like a mad man "I'll kill you, mutha fukka! I'll kill you." I have no doubt that if he had a gun, he would have used it. It was effed up.

Point is, it's crazy out there right now. Kids are running wild with no impulse restraint. We have to do something to break this cycle on an immediate basis. Support groups and community involvement are long-term solutions that need to be supported and developed asap, but the groups that are out there right now are beyond that. And they're the ones terrorizing the city at the moment.

I'm usually the first to push the theory that violent crime in this town and elsewhere are mostly drug-trade players and thugs. But the recent activity points to a more wide-spread group that is just out of control. People aren't safe in this town right now. And a show of force, along with HEAVY consequences for violent behavior is the only way out in the immediate term.

I say bring the Nat Guard in. This is war. (I'm only half serious).

I'm sorry to hear about this. The people who drive recklessly and then act as if they'll pop anyone who reacts to their recklessness really get me. I'm totally in favor of an all-out, "stop violent/dangerous crime at every inkling" campaign. I get it's hard now with police involvement/morale low. But I know how many people are so friggin' over it. Let's start at upping police pay, support them in a pursuit to stop unlawful gun possession, ATV / dirt bike gangs, and reckless driving. The city needs to put out a message now that all of this deadly behavior is absolutely intolerable and participation in it will result in serious consequences. The vast majority of us who do not participate in it, but are subject to be victim to it at any time, are completely sick of it.

And we need to be clear that the focus is VIOLENT crime. We aren't wastin' time/resources on crimes of self-harm (drugs, etc.) These are "crimes" that deserve to be approached with empathy and rehabilitation.

I 100% believe the long-term solution to these problems is one that gets at social/economic inequality. But we need immediate change in this city. And yes, many other Americans cities need this now too.

[ilovephilly79]

Totally agree with the previous two posts. The only way to change this is to have violent crime taken seriously. Swift severe punishment for everybody. But good luck with the optics out there. People truly don't understand what the police have to put up with and how dangerous the situations are. It's hard to Institute something like this when the police feel as though they are going to be tried as a murderer when they react less than perfectly in intense and complex situations.

[cpomp]

Also agree with the above ideas.
Short term we need Law & order, violent actions = consequences.

Plans to address poverty, community services, job training, etc., will take time. If people cannot follow the basics of law & order or acceptable ethical standards, then we have no choice but to crack down. This cycle of violence and zero regard for other humans will continue to snowball and plague Philadelphia (and elsewhere).

But that is unlikely to happen in the foreseeable future.

[Redddog]

Originally Posted by ilovephilly79

Totally agree with the previous two posts. The only way to change this is to have violent crime taken seriously. Swift severe punishment for everybody. But good luck with the optics out there. People truly don't understand what the police have to put up with and how dangerous the situations are. It's hard to Institute something like this when the police feel as though they are going to be tried as a murderer when they react less than perfectly in intense and complex situations.

It's true.

I've spoken to a few cops lately and they're absolutely overwhelmed. That's why I mentioned the Nat Guard. I think training in dismantling threats as your max option and bodycams would do a lot towards protecting cops from prosecution. Whenever 15 cops unload their magazines on a guy running away, it's gonna be a bad look.

Disable and arrest. Then don't let him out if he's committed ANY act of violence.

[MarketStEl]

Originally Posted by Redddog

It's true.

I've spoken to a few cops lately and they're absolutely overwhelmed. That's why I mentioned the Nat Guard. I think training in dismantling threats as your max option and bodycams would do a lot towards protecting cops from prosecution. Whenever 15 cops unload their magazines on a guy running away, it's gonna be a bad look.

Disable and arrest. Then don't let him out if he's committed ANY act of violence.

Pumping 90 bullets into a guy you've already immobilized is bad judgment, not just a "bad look". I can't wait to hear what excuse that police department comes up with. I really can't imagine how that can be defended.

But otherwise, yeah, we pretty much need to do that in the short run.