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I am a physician actually taking care of hospitalized COVID patients at one of Dallas' biggest hospitals. I have not seen my 6 month old daughter for the past 3 weeks. I am sure the 22 year old nurse who is currently intubated at my hospital would take issue with your view. Please do us a favor and do some thinking before you make such an ignorant statement
I am far from the only one who thinks forcing Americans to carry papers to identify their health status is frightening. Fear of having our rights revoked given what is actually happening is not ignorant.
If you think this is about "limited shopping", frankly you haven't been paying attention. Ten million Americans have lost their jobs. That is an unfathomable number and millions upon millions more than have become sick or have died.
This is not about people "whining." This is about people not being able to feed their children.
The messed up economy and the quarantine ARE destroying lives. I am shocked that you would think otherwise. Last week there was a story about a man who killed himself because he was so depressed from being in isolation. Why isn't HIS life important? How can you prioritize some lives and not others?
And that is just one story. This article details more:
Wait until homelessness increases exponentially due to the people being evicted or foreclosed on.
Humor me here for a sec...I will make a series of assumptions to make a point:
I'm assuming, that the vast majority of people in the food bank lines, were going to be in those lines anyway. i.e Their situations were dire beforehand. COVID-19 has made their situation harder, but likely did not cause it.
I will also assume, that a person that kills themselves because they haven't seen family or co-workers for about a month, was already dealing with some form of mental illness beforehand. COVID-19 did not cause that.
That brings me to those that are in fact loosing their jobs due to COVID-19; the ones that probably work in industries dependent on the social aspect of services- Travel, Food service, Consumer goods, Logistics etc.. We are likely talking about front line employees in these industries: cashiers, packers, flight crew, Hotel staff etc.
These cries about the economy aren't related to the suicides or food bank lines...they are about dollars. About getting those that would have been shopping(not the ones that can't afford to anyway); back out and about spending money, eating out, travelling, paying for services, experiences and the like... in other words-consuming. All of which requires a level of social interaction and the exchange of money.
The plain fact is- those that have the money-consumers- if you will.... are not willing to trade the possibility of serious illness or death, for them their or their loved ones, for most goods or services.
The quickest way for the "economy" or really, "consumers" to return is for the virus to go away. For people to have the confidence that eating out, shopping and travelling wont make them or their family members seriously ill or die. As long as confidence on that fact is low, there is no way to "bring back" the economy. We can plan all we want for a return to normalcy but that return has to be predicated by consumer confidence in the level of control over the pandemic.
There is a misconception that at the word of a politician; businesses can re-open there will be this rush of normal life. They can open all they want, but consumers will not return at anywhere near normal levels if the threat remains. Many employees won't either. The fact is -the threat has to be significantly diminished for ANYTHING to return to normal and unfortunately my antsy neighbors, science does not work on an economic timetable.
When that happens.... likely not in the next four weeks let alone two... a SLOW return to normal life is more likely. People are stressed and anxious about people with the sniffles. They will not fill the cowboy's stadium any time soon.
Attempting a restart before the cause of that anxiety is handled will lead to even more uncertainty and economic fallout especially if there is a resurgence in cases and/or fatalities. Evictions, homelessness and foreclosures can be handled legislatively if our lawmakers decide to do so. These are things that we have been through and handled before and we are smarter now than we were then.
The only thing we have not dealt with before- is a Pandemic of this magnitude. We need to tread lightly and handle that issue FIRST. The only 'handle' we have on it for now- is social distancing. When we have a treatment or a steady decline in cases or a vaccine of some sort; the economy will take care of itself.
Not re-open next week. Announce a task force to work on a PLAN to reopen. Huge difference.
Anyone who owns a physical business is working on a plan to reopen right now. I’m on a weekly call with peers in our industry to share advice and info on this topic as well as learn from our counterparts in China who have reopened. The state government should be doing the same. Which is why Gov Abbott is announcing a task force next week.
Okay, I'll give it him that he has to "announce" a group of people that will strategize on reversing or modifying his decree...because that's all he'd be doing really....whatever good that does.
Doesn't that go without saying? What organization doesn't have a "what next" plan? What is the purpose of such an announcement? Outside of playing politics that is.
Okay, I'll give it him that he has to "announce" a group of people that will strategize on reversing or modifying his decree...because that's all he'd be doing really....whatever good that does.
Doesn't that go without saying? What organization doesn't have a "what next" plan? What is the purpose of such an announcement? Outside of playing politics that is.
Your posts show that you’re only capable of thinking in black or white. We’re going to be living in shades of grey until there is a vaccine. The only people who hibernate from society until 2021 should be those who are at ultra high risk of dying from covid/19. Maybe that’s you - and if so, I apologize.
The rest of us need a plan for what happens once we’re most of the way down the hill on the other side of the local peak:
-Should dentists and dermatologists (non-essential medical) be able to reopen before Disney World does? Yes, that seems like a no brainer. (And considering you seem to think the only people financially impacted so far are hourly wage service industry people....my own dentist has laid off their office manager, front desk and hygenists).
-Should offices be able to reopen if they can achieve social distancing measures by allowing a mix of WFH and rearranging work stations in open office areas?
-Should a personal trainer be able to meet clients in a small workout facility before 24 Hour Fitness is allowed to reopen? Yes, probably.
-How does public transit work with social distancing? Is the bus driver going to count passengers to ensure 50% capacity limit?
And so forth. There are a lot of questions that need considering so we don’t fumble the reopening of society.
I will also assume, that a person that kills themselves because they haven't seen family or co-workers for about a month, was already dealing with some form of mental illness beforehand. COVID-19 did not cause that.
Reports out of Italy show that 99% of all people who died from CV had an underlying condition such as diabetes, heart disease, asthma, etc. Their underlying conditions should not be more important than someone whose underlying condition was a mental health problem. We all should have equal priority for our lives.
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There is a misconception that at the word of a politician; businesses can re-open there will be this rush of normal life. They can open all they want, but consumers will not return at anywhere near normal levels if the threat remains. Many employees won't either. The fact is -the threat has to be significantly diminished for ANYTHING to return to normal and unfortunately my antsy neighbors, science does not work on an economic timetable.
When that happens.... likely not in the next four weeks let alone two... a SLOW return to normal life is more likely. People are stressed and anxious about people with the sniffles. They will not fill the cowboy's stadium any time soon.
Nobody is discussing attending a Cowboys game. But maybe people who need to sell their homes could do so. Maybe people can get back to important doctor's appointments. Maybe some states could stop arresting a father for taking his three year old to the park, as happened this past week in Colorado. TC80 just explained this quite well.
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. Attempting a restart before the cause of that anxiety is handled will lead to even more uncertainty and economic fallout especially if there is a resurgence in cases and/or fatalities. Evictions, homelessness and foreclosures can be handled legislatively if our lawmakers decide to do so. These are things that we have been through and handled before and we are smarter now than we were then.
The only thing we have not dealt with before- is a Pandemic of this magnitude. We need to tread lightly and handle that issue FIRST. The only 'handle' we have on it for now- is social distancing. When we have a treatment or a steady decline in cases or a vaccine of some sort; the economy will take care of itself.
Not all Americans will get vaccinated. It will never happen.
Your posts show that you’re only capable of thinking in black or white. We’re going to be living in shades of grey until there is a vaccine. The only people who hibernate from society until 2021 should be those who are at ultra high risk of dying from covid/19. Maybe that’s you - and if so, I apologize.
The rest of us need a plan for what happens once we’re most of the way down the hill on the other side of the local peak:
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Re: the dentists- It would be a "no brainier" if there was some assurance of a decline or lack of community spread. They weren't ordered closed in the first place for kicks.
Do offices want to take on the responsibility of ensuring that one asymptomatic employee does not render their entire building unusable? How would they do that? Swab testing at the door? Temperature checks? Changing seating arrangements? Isn't that how we got here to begin with? Most employers didn't start with sending everyone home.
Does the small workout facility want to bear the responsibility of making sure that all 30 of their personal trainer's clients are COVID-19 free at every interaction and handle the disinfection routines necessary for them to operate on a semi- normal schedule? Does the trainer? Maybe they do.
Would the bus driver be expected to count passengers AND drive? While he's forced to do that, can he ask a coughing passenger to leave the bus?
There are lots of questions with no answers currently. All the more reason to re-open when it makes the most sense. We haven't been "closed" a month. It took Wuhan several months and very restrictive measures to get to a point where they are slowly returning to normal. And their return is still very restrictive.
Yes there needs to be a plan for re-opening. Everyone needs and probably has one. It does NOT need to be a source for political grandstanding however. It has been ONE MONTH. No work out session is worth however many lives a sick trainer with no symptoms would put at risk especially at a time when answers on how else to deal with this are in short supply.
We seem to have forgotten that this worldwide pandemic started with ONE case in some random village market. In China.
Reports out of Italy show that 99% of all people who died from CV had an underlying condition such as diabetes, heart disease, asthma, etc. Their underlying conditions should not be more important than someone whose underlying condition was a mental health problem. We all should have equal priority for our lives.
Nobody is discussing attending a Cowboys game. But maybe people who need to sell their homes could do so. Maybe people can get back to important doctor's appointments. Maybe some states could stop arresting a father for taking his three year old to the park, as happened this past week in Colorado. TC80 just explained this quite well.
Not all Americans will get vaccinated. It will never happen.
Re: "equal priority for our lives" well that's a rabbit hole. Should we release all prisoners while we are at it? They have equal priority not to die of COVID-19 too. What about drug addicts and alcoholics who's constantly altered states make them more susceptible?
Define "important" doctors appointments. To my knowledge medically important visits and procedures have not been disallowed. But those that can wait should wait.
So is that father exempt from the rules that all other citizens in that Colorado town have to follow? What makes him above the rule all the other fathers of all other 3 year olds had to follow? Does he think people have something against 3 year olds going to the park or was there a compelling reason such a rule was put in place?
Getting all Americans vaccinated is not the goal. Finding a treatment option outside of hiding from the virus is. Those that want to preserve their right to naturally die a slow agonizing death have always had the legal right to do so around here.
There are lots of questions with no answers currently. All the more reason to re-open when it makes the most sense. We haven't been "closed" a month. It took Wuhan several months and very restrictive measures to get to a point where they are slowly returning to normal. And their return is still very restrictive.
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People also seem to forget that not every part of China was as bad as Wuhan. Same in Italy and the US. NY & Washington State (and others) probably will and should be on a different timeline than less affected areas.
I am far from the only one who thinks forcing Americans to carry papers to identify their health status is frightening. Fear of having our rights revoked given what is actually happening is not ignorant.
Let's recall a few things. Dr. Fauci is a medical expert and advisor. I too get frission at the thought of US authorities uttering the phrase, "papers please." That said Fauci does not call the shots.
The other side of this is if we had continued as per normal NBA, MLB, rock concerts, packed subways, jammed offices etc. etc. This thing would have blown up into a full on short term new dark ages. Millions of dead, so many millions sick that most organizations and systems we depend on would have failed most everyone else so worried about getting sick many would hide......wrecking our medical system would be catastrophe number one. Police, fire, garbage would be next. And to ally any notion that I'm getting carried away this kind of thing is happening now in other places.
As an aside my wife's company as of now plans to enforce a rule such that when physical offices reopen it'll be take a test or your badge won't open the door.
It sucks but wholesale testing, rigorous contact tracing and something akin to quarantines are in the cards.
I am a physician actually taking care of hospitalized COVID patients at one of Dallas' biggest hospitals. I have not seen my 6 month old daughter for the past 3 weeks. I am sure the 22 year old nurse who is currently intubated at my hospital would take issue with your view. Please do us a favor and do some thinking before you make such an ignorant statement
Thank you for your efforts. Let's all hope the best for the nurse you noted.
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