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Old 02-20-2022, 03:08 PM
 
Location: california
7,322 posts, read 6,921,731 times
Reputation: 9258

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The provision of salvation is of God's choosing, not man's.
God chose the Jews, but because of their rejection of God's provision, the door was opened to the Gentile.
God owes nothing to man. Man owes every thing to God. and then some.
You are indebted to God because He made you. Choosing to turn your own way even by neglect is still a choice.
I worked in manufacturing stents, the kind that go in one's arteries and veins.
These things are so deeply scrutinized and examined under a microscope that the least imperfection scraps that part period.
The liability involved in these products is enormous. So the weight of each person handling the product is equally critical.
Heaven is not a place for the rebellious and liars and cheats and abusers and those the take advantage of others.
Satan was kicked out along with a third of the angels for their rebellion. God has no problem cleaning house. Crap is kicked out, not to run free, but to be confined away from making future trouble.
Since God knows the heart of people, He alone is judge, as to what a person is responsible for. If you've spent any time in scriptures, you should have learned God does not respect EXCUSES.
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Old 02-21-2022, 06:13 AM
 
2,029 posts, read 1,364,096 times
Reputation: 991
Quote:
Originally Posted by arleigh View Post
The provision of salvation is of God's choosing, not man's.
God chose the Jews, but because of their rejection of God's provision, the door was opened to the Gentile.
God owes nothing to man. Man owes every thing to God. and then some.
You are indebted to God because He made you. Choosing to turn your own way even by neglect is still a choice.
I worked in manufacturing stents, the kind that go in one's arteries and veins.
These things are so deeply scrutinized and examined under a microscope that the least imperfection scraps that part period.
The liability involved in these products is enormous. So the weight of each person handling the product is equally critical.
Heaven is not a place for the rebellious and liars and cheats and abusers and those the take advantage of others.
Satan was kicked out along with a third of the angels for their rebellion. God has no problem cleaning house. Crap is kicked out, not to run free, but to be confined away from making future trouble.
Since God knows the heart of people, He alone is judge, as to what a person is responsible for. If you've spent any time in scriptures, you should have learned God does not respect EXCUSES.
You say God owes nothing to man. That's pretty harsh isn't it? After all, He made us. I don't know about you but if I made something special, I'll put loving care into it , wouldn't you?. Your post sounds like God is in damage control when in reality, all is going according to plan, every single thing. Isn't Jew AND Gentile saved? Lastly and most importantly, God is love and HIs mercy is greater than our sins.
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Old 02-21-2022, 08:35 AM
 
9,895 posts, read 1,264,560 times
Reputation: 769
Quote:
Originally Posted by arleigh View Post
The provision of salvation is of God's choosing, not man's.
God chose the Jews, but because of their rejection of God's provision, the door was opened to the Gentile.
God owes nothing to man. Man owes every thing to God. and then some.
You are indebted to God because He made you. Choosing to turn your own way even by neglect is still a choice.
I worked in manufacturing stents, the kind that go in one's arteries and veins.
These things are so deeply scrutinized and examined under a microscope that the least imperfection scraps that part period.
The liability involved in these products is enormous. So the weight of each person handling the product is equally critical.
Heaven is not a place for the rebellious and liars and cheats and abusers and those the take advantage of others.
Satan was kicked out along with a third of the angels for their rebellion. God has no problem cleaning house. Crap is kicked out, not to run free, but to be confined away from making future trouble.
Since God knows the heart of people, He alone is judge, as to what a person is responsible for. If you've spent any time in scriptures, you should have learned God does not respect EXCUSES.
So you agree that man has a part in choosing whether to accept or reject God’s wonderful gift of salvation? It’s not all God as the Calvinist suggests?
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Old 02-21-2022, 08:40 AM
 
9,895 posts, read 1,264,560 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Matthew 4:4 View Post
2nd Peter 3:9 the choice to ' repent ' if one does Not want to ' perish ' ( be destroyed) - Psalm 92:7; Psalm 104:35; Proverbs 2:21-22
Good verses Matthew. Luke 13:3,5 pretty much say the same thing. “Unless you repent you will likewise perish.”
Choice is very loudly implied here.

The Bible doesn’t need to use the phrase “free will” for it to be true. It’s implied many times in Scripture.
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Old 02-21-2022, 08:46 AM
 
9,895 posts, read 1,264,560 times
Reputation: 769
Quote:
Originally Posted by justbyfaith View Post
Men who are drawn to Christ are given the ability to either receive or reject Him.
All are drawn to Christ. All are given the ability to accept or reject.

“ and I, if I may be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto myself.“ (John 12:32 YLT)
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Old 02-21-2022, 10:05 AM
 
8,039 posts, read 1,837,694 times
Reputation: 143
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissKate12 View Post
All are drawn to Christ. All are given the ability to accept or reject.

“ and I, if I may be lifted up from the earth, will draw all men unto myself.“ (John 12:32 YLT)
Yes, I agree.

However, every person is given a specific window of opportunity in which they are drawn to Christ and thus enabled to receive Him if that should be their choice.
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Old 02-21-2022, 01:29 PM
 
63,791 posts, read 40,053,123 times
Reputation: 7869
Quote:
Originally Posted by MissKate12 View Post
So you agree that man has a part in choosing whether to accept or reject God’s wonderful gift of salvation? It’s not all God as the Calvinist suggests?
To our primitive ancestors that may have been the only way to see the choice. Nuance was definitely not a major feature of their mindset. The truth, however, is that salvation was never in danger once Jesus accomplished what He did. But what we personally experience as "saved Spirits" does depend on whether or not we take full advantage of being saved by building on the foundation of agape love Jesus laid for us.

If we do not believe we need to do anything to emulate Jesus and follow His instructions to love God and each other every day and repent when we fail, that is on us!!! We will reap whatever we sow but we are still "saved as by fire."
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Old 02-21-2022, 03:14 PM
 
Location: Mexico
248 posts, read 81,508 times
Reputation: 24
The importance is to put things in God's hands even if it's hard to do the freewill put things in God hands no matter what. Even we say now in our modern times putting our hands is that we are happy and thankful for what happens and faithful. Did people back in the old put thier ahnds in God trusted him ?


Yes


Psalm 138:7
your gith hand saves me and that action required for us to put our hands in his ;D.


1 Peter 5:6


humble and he will life you with his hands


proverbs 29:25


Trust in the lord


Ecclesiastes 2:24


From his hand


Isaias 48:13


His hand have created all




the most important hand
Deuteronomy 7:8


His hand took Israel from Egypt.


Even it is not possibel for he all powerful to walk blindfolded and he holds your hands and guides you get to heaven sometimes we must take chances in life.
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Old 02-22-2022, 04:25 AM
 
9,895 posts, read 1,264,560 times
Reputation: 769
Quote:
Originally Posted by justbyfaith View Post
Yes, I agree.

However, every person is given a specific window of opportunity in which they are drawn to Christ and thus enabled to receive Him if that should be their choice.
I’m not sure about a specific window, but I do know that as time goes by, man hardens his heart so he no longer hears.
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Old 02-22-2022, 05:21 AM
 
4,627 posts, read 1,171,293 times
Reputation: 86
Quote:
Originally Posted by pcamps View Post
Again, there is plenty of proof IN the scriptures that tell us otherwise. What I am against especially with what you are saying is not so much what you believe, but in believing what you do, it cannot but have you looking down upon those who you believe are depraved, you will never ever have the ability to see them how our Heavenly Father does.


22 Then Paul stood in the midst of Mars' hill, and said, Ye men of Athens, I perceive that in all things ye are too superstitious.
23For as I passed by, and beheld your devotions, I found an altar with this inscription, TO THE UNKNOWN GOD. Whom therefore ye ignorantly worship, him declare I unto you.
24God that made the world and all things therein, seeing that he is Lord of heaven and earth, dwelleth not in temples made with hands;
25Neither is worshipped with men's hands, as though he needed any thing, seeing he giveth to all life, and breath, and all things;
26And hath made of one blood all nations of men for to dwell on all the face of the earth, and hath determined the times before appointed, and the bounds of their habitation;
27That they should seek the Lord, if haply they might feel after him, and find him, though he be not far from every one of us:
28For in him we live, and move, and have our being; as certain also of your own poets have said, For we are also his offspring
.
29Forasmuch then as we are the offspring of God, we ought not to think that the Godhead is like unto gold, or silver, or stone, graven by art and man's device. 30And the times of this ignorance God winked at; but now commandeth all men every where to repent:

Obviously the Athenians believed in something more than themselves, and sought God and decided he was unknown.
Theres not one scripture that says otherwise. Man naturally doesnt seek after God, hasnt any desire for God Rom 3:11


11 There is none that understandeth, there is none that seeketh after God.

Rom 3:11 is speaking about the True God, not mens idols, all men by nature seek after false gods, Acts 17 proves that.
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