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Actually, UR says, or believes, no such thing. You're deliberately leaving out Rom 11:30-36:
Rom 11:30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
Rom 11:31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.
Rom 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.
Rom 11:33 O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!
Rom 11:34 For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor?
Rom 11:35 Or who hath first given to him, and it shall be recompensed unto him again?
Rom 11:36 For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.
BF....your response? Pretty powerful statement here....God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all. Please explain this verse then.
Universalism never comes and says that the universe is made of anything else other than what it is. It doesn't challenge God's sovereignty. It agrees with it.
Universalism never comes and says that the universe is made of anything else other than what it is. It doesn't challenge God's sovereignty. It agrees with it.
What many do not realize is that UR has already been accomplished objectively for all. It's already done.
Col 1:20 And, having made peace through the blood of his cross, by him to reconcile all things unto himself; by him, I say, whether they be things in earth, or things in heaven.
Col 1:21 And you, that were sometime alienated and enemies in your mind by wicked works, yet now hath he reconciled
2Co 5:19 To wit, that God was in Christ, reconciling the world unto himself, not imputing their trespasses unto them; and hath committed unto us the word of reconciliation
It's also the Lord's way of calling the things that be not (subjectively) as if they were (objectively):
Rom 4:17 (As it is written, I have made thee a father of many nations,) before him whom he believed, even God, who quickeneth the dead, and calleth those things which be not as though they were.
And we're to proclaim and teach these things so that all will live accordingly to it, subjectively.
1Ti 4:10 For therefore we both labour and suffer reproach, because we trust in the living God, who is the Saviour of all men, specially of those that believe.
1Ti 4:11 These things command and teach.
God has ordained some men to perdition instead of Salvation. You know what that is ?
The Gk. term "ἀπώλεια" that we translate as "perdition" is not once (in context) used as an eternal condition. The word is derived, or taken from the term "ἀπόλλυμι", also used by Jesus to describe Judas, "the son of perdition" with the sense of Judas being lost, or being ruined and destroyed (Gk: "ἀπόλλυμι"):
Joh 17:12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.
Judas had a job to do, he was hand selected by Jesus to do it, and he fulfilled scripture (his job) exactly as he was called. However, that's not the end of Judas nor the end of his story. For there is always hope in Christ, who is come to save that which was, or is: "ἀπόλλυμι":
Mat_18:11 For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.
Luk_15:6 And when he cometh home, he calleth together his friends and neighbours, saying unto them, Rejoice with me; for I have found my sheep which was lost.
Luk_15:24 For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry.
Luk_15:32 It was meet that we should make merry, and be glad: for this thy brother was dead, and is alive again; and was lost, and is found.
Luk_19:10 For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.
If you'll notice in the above texts, what was lost is, or will be, found and what was dead is made alive again. All of the texts use the exact Gk. term that Jesus did in describing Judas: "ἀπόλλυμι".
Actually, UR says, or believes, no such thing. You're deliberately leaving out Rom 11:30-36:
Rom 11:30 For as ye in times past have not believed God, yet have now obtained mercy through their unbelief:
Rom 11:31 Even so have these also now not believed, that through your mercy they also may obtain mercy.
Rom 11:32 For God hath concluded them all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all.
Rom 11:33 O the depth of the riches both of the wisdom and knowledge of God! how unsearchable are his judgments, and his ways past finding out!
Rom 11:34 For who hath known the mind of the Lord? or who hath been his counsellor?
Rom 11:35 Or who hath first given to him, and it shall be recompensed unto him again?
Rom 11:36 For of him, and through him, and to him, are all things: to whom be glory for ever. Amen.
God will have mercy on all the elect, they are the vessels of mercy opposed to the vessels of wrath Rom 9 they are found within the jews and gentiles. Gods mercy is confined to all the remnant Micah 7:18
Who is a God like unto thee, that pardoneth iniquity, and passeth by the transgression of the remnant of his heritage? he retaineth not his anger for ever, because he delighteth in mercy.
So for anyone to deny God His absolute prerogative to limit His Mercy to a remnant of mankind instead of all without exception, that's an attack on Gods Glory.
The Gk. term "ἀπώλεια" that we translate as "perdition" is not once (in context) used as an eternal condition. The word is derived, or taken from the term "ἀπόλλυμι", also used by Jesus to describe Judas, "the son of perdition" with the sense of Judas being lost, or being ruined and destroyed (Gk: "ἀπόλλυμι"):
Joh 17:12 While I was with them in the world, I kept them in thy name: those that thou gavest me I have kept, and none of them is lost, but the son of perdition; that the scripture might be fulfilled.
Judas had a job to do, he was hand selected by Jesus to do it, and he fulfilled scripture (his job) exactly as he was called. However, that's not the end of Judas nor the end of his story. For there is always hope in Christ, who is come to save that which was, or is: "ἀπόλλυμι":
Mat_18:11 For the Son of man is come to save that which was lost.
Luk_15:6 And when he cometh home, he calleth together his friends and neighbours, saying unto them, Rejoice with me; for I have found my sheep which was lost.
Luk_15:24 For this my son was dead, and is alive again; he was lost, and is found. And they began to be merry.
Luk_15:32 It was meet that we should make merry, and be glad: for this thy brother was dead, and is alive again; and was lost, and is found.
Luk_19:10 For the Son of man is come to seek and to save that which was lost.
If you'll notice in the above texts, what was lost is, or will be, found and what was dead is made alive again. All of the texts use the exact Gk. term that Jesus did in describing Judas: "ἀπόλλυμι".
Yeah perdition means eternal misery, damnation in lieu of salvation. I already gave the definition of perdition.
Universalism never comes and says that the universe is made of anything else other than what it is. It doesn't challenge God's sovereignty. It agrees with it.
Its an attack on Gods Sovereignty and Glory. Gods Glory is manifested by His limiting to whom He will show Mercy to. Ex 33:18-19
18 And he said, I beseech thee, shew me thy glory.
19 And he said, I will make all my goodness pass before thee, and I will proclaim the name of the Lord before thee; and will be gracious to whom I will be gracious, and will shew mercy on whom I will shew mercy.
Thats God proclaiming, Preaching His Own Name ! To say its not fair or not right for God to show discriminating mercy, is reply against God.
God will have mercy on all the elect, they are the vessels of mercy opposed to the vessels of wrath Rom 9 they are found within the jews and gentiles. Gods mercy is confined to all the remnant Micah 7:18
Who is a God like unto thee, that pardoneth iniquity, and passeth by the transgression of the remnant of his heritage? he retaineth not his anger for ever, because he delighteth in mercy.
So for anyone to deny God His absolute prerogative to limit His Mercy to a remnant of mankind instead of all without exception, that's an attack on Gods Glory.
UR doesn't deny God's sovereignty over all His works, but rather testifies to what scripture has revealed about what God has done, and/or will do, concerning all things in Christ.
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All the vessels of mercy
