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If EV-DO Rev A. coverage is not available, you'll see typical download speeds from .40 to .70 Mbps from EV-DO.
Also untrue. I typically get 2-3 megs on Verizon. Slightly less if I'm tethering over WiFi. Also, Verizon upgraded their entire EVDO network to Rev A. It's been that way for nearly a half decade now. Link:
AT&T's EDGE network is technically 3G, but markets it as 2.5G. It's network is capable of download speeds around .40 Mbps. Thus, when Verizon's entire 3G network is compared with AT&T's 3G network, it does not include AT&T's EDGE network, since AT&T doesnt market it as 3G, even though it meets the standard.
So let me get this straight. AT&T's marketing department doesn't call EDGE "3G", but they got upset that Verizon's marketing department doesn't call EDGE "3G"?
No wonder AT&T had to give up on the lawsuit. Link:
AT&T's HSPA, the higher end of it's network, is much faster than any 3G technology offered by Verizon.
So is WiFi. Neither one gives me reliable coverage across the state. This is the problem with AT&T; they assume that people will be happy with coverage at home and at work, but don't care about in-between. That might have been a viable approach in 2000, but with more people using their smartphones for navigation, streaming Pandora / Slacker, and syncing their Twiter / Facebook / Email accounts in the background while mobile, that just isn't the case anymore.
No wonder more people in the US use CDMA than GSM.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen1110
Most users are more interested in getting data service where they live and work rather than knowing there is a certain number of square miles of land with Verizon’s 3G service.
So what happens in-between those areas? You know, like when I'm on the train between Harrisburg and Pittsburgh? Or when I have to pull over along I-81 to set up a VPN and remote into a server? Or when I'm doing urbex through the back mountains of Pennsylvania and feel like uploading some photos to Facebook?
On AT&T, I fall back to GPRS and get to upload my photos at around 50k.
On Verizon, I have EVDO Rev A. I get to upload them around 1m - 3m. Maybe 500k at the worst, if I'm truly in the middle of nowhere.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen1110
Verizon has 5x more 3G coverage than AT&T ... The message is, coverage might not be as widespread (as Verizon)
Bingo. And now you know why I use Verizon -- it works. Can't say the same for my AT&T aircard.
It says a lot that AT&T trains their employees to spend so much time explaining to customers what happens when they go out of the coverage area.
AT&T: "Our HSPA+ isn't everywhere, so if you travel outside of an HSPA market, you'll fall back to HSPA. And that coverage really isn't nationwide either, so when you fall into a coverage hole, you'll fall back to UMTS. And we really haven't gotten UMTS out to the entire country yet, so when you can't get UMTS, you'll fall back to EDGE. And honestly, EDGE isn't everywhere either, so you'll fall back to GPRS. So since EDGE and up is considered 3G, your actual 3G speeds will be between 150k and 7.2 megs, provided you actually have signal in the first place and/or are in a market with increased backhaul capacity AND assuming that too many people aren't using the network."
Verizon: "Our entire network is EVDO Rev A. Expect a peak speed of around 3.2 megs."
"Instead AT&T pointed out that T-Mobile’s HSPA+ network is in fact not the largest in the country. Instead, AT&T possesses the biggest HSPA+ network "
"T-Mobile’s claims about 4G are based on the same HSPA+ technology we have deployed to 180 million people today, more than T-Mobile’s reported 140 million, and we’ll have it rolled out to 250 million people by the end of this month, substantially more than the 200 million T-Mobile says it will have by year-end."
So let me get this straight. AT&T's marketing department doesn't call EDGE "3G", but they got upset that Verizon's marketing department doesn't call EDGE "3G"?....No wonder AT&T had to give up on the lawsuit. Link:
The ads would then say AT&T customers were "out of touch" when out of it's 3G coverage. This would lead to customers, who were not technically inclined, of thinking AT&T had no service outside of it's 3G coverage.
^ This is the argument. EDGE being acknowledged as 3G is irrelevent to AT&T.
Quote:
Originally Posted by floor9
So is WiFi. Neither one gives me reliable coverage across the state. This is the problem with AT&T; they assume that people will be happy with coverage at home and at work, but don't care about in-between. That might have been a viable approach in 2000, but with more people using their smartphones for navigation, streaming Pandora / Slacker, and syncing their Twiter / Facebook / Email accounts in the background while mobile, that just isn't the case anymore.
No wonder more people in the US use CDMA than GSM.
You can do all of that over EDGE.
No wonder why more people on the planet use GSM, instead of CDMA.
GSM is the dominant wireless standard in the world.
Quote:
Originally Posted by floor9
I typically get 2-3 megs on Verizon...On AT&T, I fall back to GPRS and get to upload my photos at around 50k....On Verizon, I have EVDO Rev A. I get to upload them around 1m - 3m. Maybe 500k at the worst, if I'm truly in the middle of nowhere....Bingo. And now you know why I use Verizon -- it works. Can't say the same for my AT&T aircard.
Verizon: "Our entire network is EVDO Rev A. Expect a peak speed of around 3.2 megs."
As you said twice before:
"under ideal conditions. Add in signal variance, network capacity, and overall coverage, and you'll rarely see that."
"the only important factor is whether or not your device works where you need it to. To this end, your coverage and network performance will vary greatly from area to area, and in fact, from user to user."
AT&T: "Our HSPA+ isn't everywhere, so if you travel outside of an HSPA market, you'll fall back to HSPA. And that coverage really isn't nationwide either...so when you can't get UMTS, you'll fall back to EDGE. And honestly, EDGE isn't everywhere either, so you'll fall back to GPRS.
Nice try..
"you can pretend to be serious; you can't pretend to be witty" - Sacha Guitry
AT&T HSPA+ network covers every 8/10 people in this country.
Your linked article is nearly six months old. This is wireless; a LOT changes in six months.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen1110
The ads would then say AT&T customers were "out of touch" when out of it's 3G coverage. This would lead to customers, who were not technically inclined, of thinking AT&T had no service outside of it's 3G coverage.
If AT&T truly believes that having 150k EDGE is "in touch", then they've once again explained why their network just can't compete.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen1110
No wonder why more people on the planet use GSM, instead of CDMA. GSM is the dominant wireless standard in the world.
The moment I move out of the US, that might be relevant. Until then, it isn't. I wonder why more people choose Sprint and Verizon over AT&T and T-Mobile? Could it be ... network quality?
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen1110
As you said twice before:
"under ideal conditions. Add in signal variance, network capacity, and overall coverage, and you'll rarely see that."
"the only important factor is whether or not your device works where you need it to. To this end, your coverage and network performance will vary greatly from area to area, and in fact, from user to user."
^ these were your words......however
They sure are. And that's exactly why I don't use AT&T. They don't deliver. I couldn't care less what their peak throughput is in Portland, OR. I need service here in Pennsylvania, and that includes -- shocker -- being in-between places where 97% of Americans live.
Incidentally, those maps show a lot of coverage gaps. Zoom in to Pennsylvania, and you'll see even more. That's exactly what I'm saying; HSPA+ just isn't everywhere, and EDGE is hardly worthwhile. Who wants to suffer through a 100k - 150k connection? Verizon, on the other hand, gives me a consistent 2-3mb speed. AT&T gives me 7-something in downtown Harrisburg, then flops back to a few megs 10 miles outside of town. Hit exit 85 (about 15 miles out of town) and it's GPRS for about an hour north along I-81. And if you venture off the Interstate, you can look forward to enjoying lots of areas with no signal.
I don't have that problem with Verizon.
AT&T's 3G performance is all over the board. Verizon's is consistently 2-3 megs. Sorry, AT&T, but you're just not up to par.
The moment I move out of the US, that might be relevant. Until then, it isn't. I wonder why more people choose Sprint and Verizon over AT&T and T-Mobile? Could it be ... network quality?
Depends on what you mean by network quality
Quote:
Originally Posted by floor9
Verizon, on the other hand, gives me a consistent 2-3mb speed. AT&T gives me 7-something in downtown Harrisburg, then flops back to a few megs 10 miles outside of town. Hit exit 85 (about 15 miles out of town) and it's GPRS for about an hour north along I-81. And if you venture off the Interstate, you can look forward to enjoying lots of areas with no signal.
I don't have that problem with Verizon.
AT&T's 3G performance is all over the board. Verizon's is consistently 2-3 megs. Sorry, AT&T, but you're just not up to par.
"under ideal conditions. Add in signal variance, network capacity, and overall coverage, and you'll rarely see that."
"the only important factor is whether or not your device works where you need it to. To this end, your coverage and network performance will vary greatly from area to area, and in fact, from user to user."
Edit: Hey, look at that -- AT&T has scrubbed their website of any news regarding how many customers are covered by their enhanced backhaul. Interesting. Wonder why they're hiding it? I did manage to find this article, which says AT&T plans to have "almost two-thirds" of their HSPA network equipped with enhanced backhaul by the end of 2011. So that means that if AT&T's HSPA+ covers 250 million people currently, then by the end of this year, they hope to have roughly 165 million of those people actually able to use those speeds.
Without sufficient network capacity, AT&T's 4G is like hooking an 802.11n router up to a 1.5m DSL, and saying that's faster than an 802.11g router hooked up to a 20m fiber connection. I guess AT&T somehow thinks their "4G running at 3G speeds" is better than "4G running at 4G speeds" ... or something ...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen1110
Depends on what you mean by network quality
Hah - AT&T has to ask an Internet forum what "network quality" means. Not surprising.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen1110
You keep forgeting you said this
Nope. You keep quoting it as if it disagrees with what I've said so far, however.
AT&T doesn't provide good coverage here. When they do have signal, their performance is slow. Naturally, I don't use AT&T. Verizon has better service, better coverage, and better speed. The fact that you keep insisting that this somehow disagrees with my statement that people should use whatever carrier works best for them really shows why AT&T gets such poor marks for customer service.
But please, tell us again how me saying "I use Verizon because AT&T's service is terrible here" is contrary to "people should use whatever works best for them".
Last edited by DowntownHarrisburg; 05-27-2011 at 08:14 AM..
Backhaul.Edit: Hey, look at that -- AT&T has scrubbed their website of any news regarding how many customers are covered by their enhanced backhaul. Interesting. Wonder why they're hiding it? I did manage to find this article, which says AT&T plans to have "almost two-thirds" of their HSPA network equipped with enhanced backhaul by the end of 2011. So that means that if AT&T's HSPA+ covers 250 million people currently, then by the end of this year, they hope to have roughly 165 million of those people actually able to use those speeds.
Hah - AT&T has to ask an Internet forum what "network quality" means. Not surprising.
Not quite.
I want you to tell me how does Sprint and Verizon have better network quality than AT&T and T-Mobile.
What exactly are you thinking about when you say better network quality?
Don't just make the claim, back it up with evidence. Or else it is simply disregarded.
Quote:
Originally Posted by floor9
Nope. You keep quoting it as if it disagrees with what I've said so far, however.
AT&T doesn't provide good coverage here. When they do have signal, their performance is slow. Naturally, I don't use AT&T. Verizon has better service, better coverage, and better speed. The fact that you keep insisting that this somehow disagrees with my statement that people should use whatever carrier works best for them really shows why AT&T gets such poor marks for customer service.
But please, tell us again how me saying "I use Verizon because AT&T's service is terrible here" is contrary to "people should use whatever works best for them".
No. It's not that. It's this. I'll put only the important parts in bold.
"under ideal conditions. Add in signal variance, network capacity, and overall coverage, and you'll rarely see that."
"the only important factor is whether or not your device works where you need it to. To this end, your coverage and network performance will vary greatly from area to area, and in fact, from user to user."
What you experience with your devices and networks doesn't translate into what the nation experiences.
I'm sorry, but HSPA+ is not and never will be truly 4G. 3.5G, yes, but not 4G.
Verizon 4G LTE is light years ahead of it. I did a speed test on my thunderbolt and got 19.5 Mbps down. AT&T cannot compete with that.
"In Plano Texas AT&T demonstrated their super-fast LTE network. In the demonstration they were seeing download speeds of nearly 29 Mbps and upload speeds of 10.4 Mbps"
Well actually, their website has this information regarding their 4G network. Did you try to look?
I sure did. Did you? Like I said, it doesn't mention how widespread the increased backhaul is. Guess it must be pretty bad then.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen1110
I want you to tell me how does Sprint and Verizon have better network quality than AT&T and T-Mobile.
I already have. Repeatedly. Verizon gives me better speeds throughout the state.
AT&T can promise me 7.2 megs in center city Philly (assuming there aren't too many people using their phones - lol). That's great, but what about I-81 between Harrisburg and Hazleton? What about rural Pennsylvania? What about when I get 15 miles outside of Harrisburg? No, no, and no.
I'll take Verizon's "slow" 2-3m over AT&T's "faster" 20k-50k (if I even get signal) any day.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stephen1110
What you experience with your devices and networks doesn't translate into what the nation experiences.
I tried to perform some with my employer's HSPA+ AT&T aircard, but my connection kept dropping. I guess not enough Americans live in Baltimore!
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