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Yes, they did. God told Adam & Eve what to do and not do. Cain had a built-in sense of right and wrong. He knew that his attitude toward his brother was wrong. God told Cain to resist the sinful nature, but instead Cain allowed it to rule over him, and he murdered his brother. This was a sin, even though no written law said it was. Abraham obeyed God.
So which is it, your god taught us right and wrong with the 10 commandments, or we already knew it?
Yes, I know. My point is, even if God knows what will happen, from our perspective, we still have choices.
There are choices, but we would not have them, because we can only ever do what a god knows we would do, otherwise your all knowing god would be wrong. If a god knows we will sin, then we can only commit that sin, we can not do anything else without an all knowing god being wrong.
It is quite amusing to hear the quaint notion that people "fear us atheists".
Filing it under fantasy. Cross reference as humor.
Quote:
Originally Posted by cb2008
LOL. That is better than imagined attacks and victimhood fantasy.
Oh, it is not an obvious 'kill the spider / snake / zombie' type of fear. But we see evidence for this in your behavior. Your pretense to want to hear different views in religion, but not from atheists; the need for the religious to ignore evidence they do not like; the amusing, quaint notion that 'Christianity is not a religion, it is a relationship with God', because some Christians instinctively understand that if other religions are false, then maybe all of them are.
Because we do not rely on ancient texts that are not only too often wrong, but contradict other ancient religious texts. Texts that have unbelievable stories such as Saint Peter resurrecting a cooked fish.
Deep down, at a life and death instinctive level, the evidence suggests you may be afraid that you are wrong. That is why, as one theist happily pointed out the hatred and bigotry, atheists in the US are the most hated group, and hate often comes from fear.
Oh, it is not an obvious 'kill the spider / snake / zombie' type of fear. But we see evidence for this in your behavior. Your pretense to want to hear different views in religion, but not from atheists; the need for the religious to ignore evidence they do not like; the amusing, quaint notion that 'Christianity is not a religion, it is a relationship with God', because some Christians instinctively understand that if other religions are false, then maybe all of them are.
Because we do not rely on ancient texts that are not only too often wrong, but contradict other ancient religious texts. Texts that have unbelievable stories such as Saint Peter resurrecting a cooked fish.
Deep down, at a life and death instinctive level, the evidence suggests you may be afraid that you are wrong. That is why, as one theist happily pointed out the hatred and bigotry, atheists in the US are the most hated group, and hate often comes from fear.
You're deflecting so that you don't have to answer that question about your own tribe.
Outside the world of evangelicalism and certain other isms, people don't see everything in terms of fear of being wrong or "falling short" apart from (and likely even in spite of) great striving toward an ideal. We can accept imperfections in ourselves and others with tolerance and good humor -- or at least with the humbling knowledge that we are just as imperfect. In your world it is all about being right[eous]. And that's a heavy, heavy load to carry. What if all that investment and effort is for naught -- because it doesn't really move the needle, for one thing, and because it may even be just plain wrong?
It's you guys that have something to fear: the wrath of your (loving??) god. We have only natural consequences and limited time and energy to be concerned with.
The whole "fear of being wrong" fantasy can only come from a mindset that already feels that way. It is projecting their own "fear of being wrong" onto others.
Last edited by Tzaphkiel; 08-08-2023 at 07:59 AM..
You're deflecting so that you don't have to answer that question about your own tribe.
Outside the world of evangelicalism and certain other isms, people don't see everything in terms of fear of being wrong or "falling short" apart from (and likely even in spite of) great striving toward an ideal. We can accept imperfections in ourselves and others with tolerance and good humor -- or at least with the humbling knowledge that we are just as imperfect. In your world it is all about being right[eous]. And that's a heavy, heavy load to carry. What if all that investment and effort is for naught -- because it doesn't really move the needle, for one thing, and because it may even be just plain wrong?
It's you guys that have something to fear: the wrath of your (loving??) god. We have only natural consequences and limited time and energy to be concerned with.
But what if there is a god?
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