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Old 12-16-2008, 08:38 PM
 
Location: ITL (Houston)
9,221 posts, read 15,968,440 times
Reputation: 3545

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Quote:
Originally Posted by BBQgritz View Post
Dallas is planning far beyond Houston at this point by developing a state of the art regional rail system. By 2025 while Houston is repaving and planning double decker freeways, citizens of the Metroplex will be riding the rails.

Anyways, you're claiming Tyler... don't you guys still have dirt roads? How dare you slam Dallas.
You want to see Houston's?



You obviously don't know much about Houston's plans. What freeways will Houston be double-decking? You obviously didn't talk about DFW's planned third TOLL loop.

 
Old 12-16-2008, 08:45 PM
 
Location: ITL (Houston)
9,221 posts, read 15,968,440 times
Reputation: 3545
Quote:
Originally Posted by BBQgritz View Post
OOOOO... Guess you got me.

The up and coming Victory Park Dallas: by jtk




Please, spare me those pictures. You should read up on what's happening in Victory Park right now. Numerous towers are on hold or canceled and many retailers have left all together. Victory Park is a ghost town. The Dallas Morning News has numerous articles on this. Go read up at DallasMetropolis (in the urban development section). Why don't you try getting pictures when there is not an event going on.
 
Old 12-16-2008, 08:50 PM
 
371 posts, read 941,401 times
Reputation: 95
hi guys I will be driving from Houston to DFW airport to catch my flight on the 21st which is a Sunday, and it is also 4 days before xmas.....normally it's about 4 hours and 30 min drive but how many hours do you guys think I should prepare it for? since it's a Sunday and everyoen is out xmas shopping and stuff? thanks
 
Old 12-16-2008, 08:51 PM
 
Location: ITL (Houston)
9,221 posts, read 15,968,440 times
Reputation: 3545
Quote:
Originally Posted by Spade View Post
Or maybe Houston built it's line through established heavily dense neighborhoods already while Dallas did not. Dallas plopped it's stations purposely in areas where there could easily become a dense TOD. They both built it's systems much differently than the other. Once Dallas build the new line to the airport. Expect that line to skyrocket. BTW, Dallas ridership numbers is now over 70,000.
And Houston's is closer to 50,000. Plus, the newer lines being built will be near new mixed-use developments.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BBQgritz View Post
Excuse me, I misunderstood the point of your post when I previously responded.

As I've stated, I do not know the points of Dallas' most heavily used section of light rail. Maybe downtown to Richardson, downtown to Garland.

What is known is DART and the regional planning commission had the insight to plan, develop and initiate a rail system, not just a single line as Houston (METRO).
The most used section in DART is somewhere near Plano and North Dallas (in between), and gets 21,000 per day (per the DMN).
 
Old 12-16-2008, 08:56 PM
 
288 posts, read 1,192,066 times
Reputation: 124
Quote:
Originally Posted by Angel713 View Post
Please, spare me those pictures. You should read up on what's happening in Victory Park right now. Numerous towers are on hold or canceled and many retailers have left all together. Victory Park is a ghost town. The Dallas Morning News has numerous articles on this. Go read up at DallasMetropolis (in the urban development section). Why don't you try getting pictures when there is not an event going on.
It wasn't a city endeavour to begin with, it was a developer's. The whole place is an embarrassment. Ross Perot Jr. isn't exactly William H. Whyte. A DMN columnist had some great ideas for beginning steps to prepare the space for human activity (beyond sports venues).

Meanwhile, Brooklyn, NY has probably averted a copycat development scheme (but in this case crammed into a sensitive urban junction).
 
Old 12-16-2008, 09:00 PM
 
Location: NE Atlanta Metro
3,197 posts, read 5,381,338 times
Reputation: 3197
Quote:
Originally Posted by Angel713 View Post
You want to see Houston's?
Great maybe Houston will have 14 miles completed by 2020?
 
Old 12-16-2008, 09:01 PM
 
Location: ITL (Houston)
9,221 posts, read 15,968,440 times
Reputation: 3545
Quote:
Originally Posted by BBQgritz View Post
Great maybe Houston will have 14 miles completed by 2020?
More like, 30 new miles of light rail complete by 2012. Then, additional light rail after than (to the airports, Inner Katy line, etc.).

Here is METRO Phase II (2012-2014): http://www.metrosolutions.org/posted/1068/ms_phase2_plan_map.216954.pdf (broken link)

And the light rail lines in more detail: http://www.metrosolutions.org/posted/1068/5Corr_Board_Approv_30x40_v110607.181488.pdf (broken link)
 
Old 12-16-2008, 09:20 PM
 
Location: Upper East Side of Texas
12,498 posts, read 27,015,869 times
Reputation: 4890
Quote:
Originally Posted by Angel713 View Post
Please, spare me those pictures. You should read up on what's happening in Victory Park right now. Numerous towers are on hold or canceled and many retailers have left all together. Victory Park is a ghost town. The Dallas Morning News has numerous articles on this. Go read up at DallasMetropolis (in the urban development section). Why don't you try getting pictures when there is not an event going on.
As much as I like Victory's concept & flashy looks, it really wasn't a good idea to begin with.

Come on, Dallas' version of Times Square?

Hou Pav will be a much better development IMO.
 
Old 12-16-2008, 09:31 PM
 
Location: ITL (Houston)
9,221 posts, read 15,968,440 times
Reputation: 3545
I agree, except Houston Pavilions is just a small part on what is going on in that section of Downtown Houston. You have the new park (Discovery Green), new 500-foot residential tower, Embassy Suites, new convention center hotel, new rail lines coming in, and all of the office towers going up around it. Not to mention retail already there (especially Macy's).
 
Old 12-16-2008, 11:12 PM
 
10,130 posts, read 19,893,911 times
Reputation: 5820
Quote:
Originally Posted by jluke65780 View Post
65,900 ridership for a 45 mile line vs. a 39,500 ridership for a 7 mile line......see where I'm going with this..... and on top of that Houston's rail line dosen't even hit all the CBD's in the area. Watch and wait when rail extends out to Greenway and Uptown. Rail works better for Houston because it more centralized than Dallas and has a much more developed and dense core with the population exceeding 600k within the inner loop.
You are getting at ridership per mile again. It's very simple, really -- as Houston expands it's rail beyond the 7.5 miles and introduces longer trips (to the outer neighborhoods or airports or the burbs), ridership will go up, but not at the same rate as the increase in miles. Will it take 45 miles for Houston ridership to reach 66K? If they stick to short trips within the inner city neighborhoods, no... they may reach that # in less than 30 miles. Which would be impressive, but that wouldn't be linking IAH or the burbs.

Consider an airline like Southwest. When it was just running hops between cities in Texas, it had a tremendous number of passengers per mile. But when you add routes to LAX, Las Vegas, Fort Lauderdale... yes, you get more passengers but not nearly at the same rate as the increase in mileage of the trips. So Houston's rail is like SWA in the 80s, and Dallas' rail line is more like SWA today, in terms of total passenger trips vs. miles traveled. Whether that is good or bad (SWA before vs. SWA now) actually is debatable...

But hey, both systems are WORLDS better than our MetroRail here in Austin... 32 miles from a distant suburb to downtown, with a projected ridership of 2000 per day. That's 62.5 riders per mile. Talk about a bad idea to begin with.
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