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View Poll Results: Do you support giving Ukraine F-16s
Yes 209 40.04%
No 263 50.38%
Unsure 50 9.58%
Voters: 522. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 08-03-2022, 11:08 PM
 
Location: Honolulu, HI
25,053 posts, read 9,784,597 times
Reputation: 23367

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The armchair war generals aren't going to like this news.

Quote:
Amnesty International has accused Ukraine of war crimes during its ongoing military conflict with invading Russian forces.

The humanitarian organization said in a release on Wednesday that the Ukrainian military's tactics "violate international humanitarian law and endanger civilians" by operating weapons out of bases established in residential areas while civilians are present.

Russia has previously been accused by Amnesty International of violating multiple international laws during the war. The organization on Wednesday said that Ukraine's alleged violations "in no way justify Russia's indiscriminate attacks."

"We have documented a pattern of Ukrainian forces putting civilians at risk and violating the laws of war when they operate in populated areas," Amnesty International Secretary General Agnès Callamard said in a statement. "Being in a defensive position does not exempt the Ukrainian military from respecting international humanitarian law."
https://www.newsweek.com/ukraine-vio...tional-1730696

As I said, both sides are bad and you have to draw your own conclusion away from forced MSM narratives. It's called critical thinking.
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Old 08-04-2022, 04:30 AM
 
Location: Port Charlotte FL
5,016 posts, read 2,786,794 times
Reputation: 7810
Quote:
Originally Posted by Rocko20 View Post
The armchair war generals aren't going to like this news.


https://www.newsweek.com/ukraine-vio...tional-1730696

As I said, both sides are bad and you have to draw your own conclusion away from forced MSM narratives. It's called critical thinking.

no, it's called bs..as long as Ukraine is outmanned 10 to 1 and outgunned 100 to 1, Ukraine using civilian residences for firing positions is completely acceptable collateral damage as far as I'm concerned..you see, I'm on Ukraines side here..Russia must die..
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Old 08-04-2022, 07:22 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,905,310 times
Reputation: 9728
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hesychios View Post
Why no references?

Where's the link?
It was on two Telegram channels. I had not found a webpage on it. Today there are a few:

Translated by Google:
Quote:
Kuleba said that the ICC cannot apply the article "aggression" to Russia
Ukrainian Foreign Minister Kuleba: ICC cannot apply the article "aggression" against Russia
Minister of Foreign Affairs of Ukraine Dmytro Kuleba - RIA Novosti, 1920, 03.08.2022
© AP Photo / Geert Vanden Wijngaert
Minister of Foreign Affairs of Ukraine Dmytro Kuleba. Archival photo
Read ria.ru in

MOSCOW, Aug. 3 — RIA Novosti. Ukrainian Foreign Minister Dmytro Kuleba said that the International Criminal Court (ICC) cannot apply the article "aggression" against Russia.
"In its (International Criminal Court. - Comment. ed.) the statute states that one of the crimes by which he can judge is aggression. But in practice, purely for legal reasons, he cannot apply this article specifically to the case of Ukraine and Russia," Ukrinform quoted him as saying.


According to Kuleba, there is a problem of institutional egoism in the issue of International Criminal Court, and in the matter of creating a special tribunal. The Minister believes that partners Ukraine they urge not to create a special tribunal, since there is an ICC, so as not to create alternatives to it.
"What is more important – the interests of the ICC, which does not want any temporary alternatives to itself, or the justice for which the ICC exists? Here they have a stupor, because they are both for justice and for the ICC," the head said. Ministry of Foreign Affairs of Ukraine.

Kuleba previously said that he intends to ask the prosecutor's office of the International Criminal Court, European Commission and government Netherlands to establish a special international tribunal for Russia. Deputy Speaker Federation Council Konstantin Kosachev In response, he stressed that the Ukrainian initiative to create a tribunal for Russia is devoid of an international legal basis.
Since February 24, Russia has been conducting a special operation to denazify and demilitarize Ukraine. Vladimir Putin called it the task of "protecting people who for eight years have been subjected to bullying, genocide by the Kiev regime." According to the president, the ultimate goal is to liberate Donbass and to create conditions that guarantee the security of Russia itself.
https://ria.ru/20220803/mus-1807056224.html
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Old 08-04-2022, 07:35 AM
 
Location: NE Mississippi
25,860 posts, read 17,633,452 times
Reputation: 37804
Quote:
Amnesty International has accused Ukraine of war crimes during its ongoing military conflict with invading Russian forces.

The humanitarian organization said in a release on Wednesday that the Ukrainian military's tactics "violate international humanitarian law and endanger civilians" by operating weapons out of bases established in residential areas while civilians are present.

Russia has previously been accused by Amnesty International of violating multiple international laws during the war. The organization on Wednesday said that Ukraine's alleged violations "in no way justify Russia's indiscriminate attacks."

"We have documented a pattern of Ukrainian forces putting civilians at risk and violating the laws of war when they operate in populated areas," Amnesty International Secretary General Agnès Callamard said in a statement. "Being in a defensive position does not exempt the Ukrainian military from respecting international humanitarian law."

That there is some hysterically funny stuff.

Russia launches hundreds of missiles into apartment buildings, leaves the bodies of civilians lying in the street when they withdraw, and cuts off water and food for civilians as the world watches. Ukraine is accused of some unnamed offense. Then some guy who claims he possesses superior critical thinking skills the rest of us don't have tells us we must see both sides as bad. Blames our error on our inferior thinking skills and something he calls "MSM".
That there is some hysterically funny stuff.
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Old 08-04-2022, 07:43 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,905,310 times
Reputation: 9728
Quote:
Originally Posted by Listener2307 View Post
That there is some hysterically funny stuff.

Russia launches hundreds of missiles into apartment buildings, leaves the bodies of civilians lying in the street when they withdraw, and cuts off water and food for civilians as the world watches. Ukraine is accused of some unnamed offense. Then some guy who claims he possesses superior critical thinking skills the rest of us don't have tells us we must see both sides as bad. Blames our error on our inferior thinking skills and something he calls "MSM".
That there is some hysterically funny stuff.
AI is a rogue organization, which has long become public, so they are trying to improve their reputation by writing something that people in the West don't want to hear, of course not without spreading lies about Russia at the same time. There are no indiscriminate Russian attacks.
And there are not two bad sides, only the Ukrainian one is. Russia is like an exorcist in Ukraine.
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Old 08-04-2022, 07:51 AM
 
Location: Port Charlotte FL
5,016 posts, read 2,786,794 times
Reputation: 7810
who invaded who?....in what country are innocent civilians being intentionally attacked and killed?..Russia must die and anyone that supports them should just dry up and blow away..
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Old 08-04-2022, 08:55 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,905,310 times
Reputation: 9728
Quote:
Originally Posted by double6's View Post
who invaded who?....in what country are innocent civilians being intentionally attacked and killed?..Russia must die and anyone that supports them should just dry up and blow away..

Ukrainians invaded the Donbass (first 8 years ago after the illegal coup, and acutely again from February 15 on, which lead to the current invasion), which had decided to split from Ukraine after their language and culture was targeted by the Kiev regime. A legitimate step, according to the international court in The Hague, which said that it does not violate international law when a region of a country declares itself independent from that country against that country's will.

You are probably also one of those defending Taiwan independence. A lot of people do, while at the same time denying the Donbass and Crimea the same right, which is a consistency black hole because laws, rules, and consistency do not vary depending on your ideological taste.

And invasion? You have fallen for the silly narrative that Ukraine is the poor little innocent country being attacked and invaded. Ukraine is an evil country, and Russia is driving the devil out. Just like the allies did in Nazi Germany, when they invaded and attacked it.

Russia will not die, else the whole world will die. Is your fondness of Nazis worth ending the world?
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Old 08-04-2022, 09:01 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,905,310 times
Reputation: 9728
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnBoy64 View Post
Todays Update

https://www.understandingwar.org/bac...sment-august-3



Key Takeaways



Activity in Russian-occupied Areas

You know what your problem is? You are totally relying on and quoting one side of the story, which is based on Ukrainians sources and propaganda.
That's why the outcome of that conflict will eventually come as a shock to people in the West.
And that's also why the Global South does not align with the West, they have not banned media, they have access to the full story and hence are much more aware of reality than we here in the West are.
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Old 08-04-2022, 09:41 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles
7,817 posts, read 2,769,294 times
Reputation: 3388
Quote:
Originally Posted by Neuling View Post
You know what your problem is? You are totally relying on and quoting one side of the story, which is based on Ukrainians sources and propaganda.
That's why the outcome of that conflict will eventually come as a shock to people in the West.
And that's also why the Global South does not align with the West, they have not banned media, they have access to the full story and hence are much more aware of reality than we here in the West are.
I'm the one totally relying on and quoting one side of the story on here?? There are plenty of people posting Russian propaganda on here. And alot of the sourcing for the analysis out of ISW are coming from Russian milbloggers and Russia State media sources. This isn't some guy in his basement on Youtube.
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Old 08-04-2022, 09:53 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,905,310 times
Reputation: 9728
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnBoy64 View Post
I'm the one totally relying on and quoting one side of the story on here?? There are plenty of people posting Russian propaganda on here. And alot of the sourcing for the analysis out of ISW are coming from Russian milbloggers and Russia State media sources. This isn't some guy in his basement on Youtube.
I don't know who he is, but from your long post it is obvious that he is anti-Russian.
What he or his sources say, makes little sense.

For instance it is Ukrainians that are targeting the nuclear power plant with drones.
And it certainly was not the Russians that shelled the POW detention facility. It was the Ukrainians because some of the POW were starting to talk in detail about Ukrainian war crimes.
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