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View Poll Results: Do you support giving Ukraine F-16s
Yes 209 40.04%
No 263 50.38%
Unsure 50 9.58%
Voters: 522. You may not vote on this poll

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Old 03-27-2023, 09:52 AM
 
Location: NE Mississippi
25,860 posts, read 17,633,452 times
Reputation: 37809

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Quote:
Originally Posted by fishbrains View Post
The US, or US led coalitions, won Gulf War 1, Gulf War 2, and Afghanistan. Militarily they triumphed. I have no doubt the US military is capable of winning wars.

However, the US lost the subsequent occupation, peace and rebuilding. They are terrible at that. I have no doubt they could fail at martial law within the continental US.
The purpose of the US-Islamist war was to prevent the formation of a caliphate. If allowed to form, the caliphate would have been stronger that any single country in that region.
In that respect, the US succeeded. And was succeeding in Afghanistan, for that matter.
There was never an attempt at occupation in the traditional sense. No country was going to "surrender" and the US was never going to rule any of those countries.
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Old 03-27-2023, 09:58 AM
 
Location: Elysium
12,552 posts, read 8,343,524 times
Reputation: 9331
Quote:
Originally Posted by GotHereQuickAsICould View Post
"There are many histories where complete militaries collapse in the field and point their guns in the other direction"
When has this happened?

Not that I don't believe you, I just haven't heard of it and couldn't find it with a Google search.
Most relevant to Russian fears would be the 1917 October Revolution as they were losing men to the Germans in WWI.
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Old 03-27-2023, 10:11 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles
7,817 posts, read 2,769,294 times
Reputation: 3388
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taiko View Post
Most relevant to Russian fears would be the 1917 October Revolution as they were losing men to the Germans in WWI.
You beat me to it.
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Old 03-27-2023, 10:14 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles
7,817 posts, read 2,769,294 times
Reputation: 3388
Quote:
Originally Posted by GotHereQuickAsICould View Post
When has this happened?

Not that I don't believe you, I just haven't heard of it and couldn't find it with a Google search.
Here is a list of military disasters....makes one wonder if this one will make it into Wiki

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...tary_disasters
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Old 03-27-2023, 10:16 AM
 
Location: West Coast of Europe
25,947 posts, read 24,905,310 times
Reputation: 9728
An interesting new video on the CIA coup in 2014:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MtbnLuKpjpo
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Old 03-27-2023, 10:27 AM
 
Location: Danville, VA
7,204 posts, read 6,931,371 times
Reputation: 4860
Hungary just ratified Finland's accession to NATO. Took long enough...

https://twitter.com/AmbassadorKlara/...87529743499267

As far as Turkey goes, it looks like they'll ratify Finland either tomorrow or Wednesday. Once Turkey does it, Finland is in.

Sweden is still being held hostage though, because of Turkey's upcoming elections, and because of Hungary's beef with the EU.

https://twitter.com/BalazsOrban_HU/s...Czjcal5r4tAAAA
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Old 03-27-2023, 10:29 AM
 
Location: Los Angeles
7,817 posts, read 2,769,294 times
Reputation: 3388
Quote:
Originally Posted by GotHereQuickAsICould View Post
When has this happened?

Not that I don't believe you, I just haven't heard of it and couldn't find it with a Google search.
This is usually what I am thinking of when pointing that out, Russo-Ukraine War has many of these characteristics

The Military Collapse of the Central Powers

https://encyclopedia.1914-1918-onlin...central_powers
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Old 03-27-2023, 10:43 AM
 
47,138 posts, read 26,296,435 times
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Quote:
Originally Posted by lancers View Post
Maybe Russia should consult the US generals who speak about the war. You know the group that hasn't won a war in 50 years.
The Russian generals would give their right testicles to have the sort of strategic and logistical strength that enabled the 2003 invasion of Iraq, for instance. I was against it - it was futile, wrong-headed and reprehensible - but it was competent.

Russia? - can't take a city the size of Pawtucket that's 40 miles or so from their own border.
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Old 03-27-2023, 10:46 AM
 
51,805 posts, read 26,130,999 times
Reputation: 38131
Quote:
Originally Posted by JohnBoy64 View Post
Here is a list of military disasters....makes one wonder if this one will make it into Wiki

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...tary_disasters
There's a good chance it will as it is bound to be an epic battle.

Ukrainians are blowing up things in Crimea as if preparing for an attack there. Crimea is the prize for Putin. Now that Ukraine is getting MiG-29s, longer-range missiles, etc., going for Crimea is certainly a possibility.

But heading across to the Sea of Azov, cutting off the land supply routes, then destroying the Kerch bridge means they could focus on the Donbas, lay siege to Crimea, and get to it in the by and by.

Russian military has to defend both Crimea and the Donbas. Since they've been in both for 9 years now, they are likely prepared to do so.

The question is do they divide their forces, or focus them on one area.

Is it Calais or Normandy?
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Old 03-27-2023, 10:46 AM
 
47,138 posts, read 26,296,435 times
Reputation: 29631
Quote:
Originally Posted by Taiko View Post
Most relevant to Russian fears would be the 1917 October Revolution as they were losing men to the Germans in WWI.
Exactly. Soldiers, fed up with being fed into a pointless meat grinder, shot their officers and went home. Except for a sizable number who first went to the seat of government to settle a a score. And brought their guns.
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