Coronavirus in Massachusetts (Boston, Worcester, New Bedford: orthodox, 2013, exemptions)

[redplum33]

Originally Posted by massnative71

But it's not government in that case, it's private enterprise. "My" restaurant. "My" stadium. "My" airline. "I" have that right to control my own destiny and set safety or other measures as I see fit, and for the well being of my staff and customers. I suppose you can make an argument for a grocery store in a small town that's the only one for miles, don't want to end up in a situation where essential goods/services are denied.

There will likely be new discrimination laws to not allow what you're suggesting.

And there isn't even a vaccine for kids. So kids can't go anywhere?

[OutdoorLover]

Originally Posted by bizcuit

And besides death, there is the risk of Long Covid which can greatly affect people who even had a mild initial case. My brother (who had a severe case) is now disabled.

Sorry to hear that. I don't want any part of a Covid-19 infection - not worth rolling the dice. I hope your brother is still able to make a full recovery later. Have you seen these reports that something like 40% of long-haulers seem to improve by getting vaccinated?

[massnative71]

Originally Posted by redplum33

There will likely be new discrimination laws to not allow what you're suggesting.

Will there???

Originally Posted by redplum33

And there isn't even a vaccine for kids. So kids can't go anywhere?

I can't see this type of stuff happening before the vaccine has its chance to make its way around (for it to be even feasible). If I were to guess, it will be emergency approved for kids by this summer. I can imagine airlines making exceptions for kids in the same manner as they do for ID requirements. Bars, concert venues...obviously they won't be a factor.

[BostonMike7]

Originally Posted by OutdoorLover

Now, you're not fully understanding what adverse events are. Adverse events are any negative health events that occur after a treatment. There is no judgement required at this stage that the event be caused by the treatment - in fact, it's specifically required that people in the field *not* try to make such calls, they should just report *anything* that is remotely unusual - that's the most conservative way to do the reporting, and that's just standard pharmacovigilance requirements. The 3,000 deaths that have been reported under VAERS are not therefore, 3,000 deaths due to the vaccine. The vaccine makers and the FDA follow up on adverse event reporting to try to determine (a) if there is any increased incidence of the event in people receiving the treatment vs the general population and (b) does there appear to be a plausible causal link. My understanding is that the judgement has been that there have been few, if any of these VAERS deaths for Covid-19 vaccines that are believed to be excess deaths, due to the vaccines.

You mean you can’t have it both ways?


A cardiac event in a healthy individual who caught covid shouldn’t be considered a covid death? But a 99-year old on their last legs with multiplie comorbidities who dies 15 days after the 2nd vaccine shot is 100% a vaccine death.


Funny how the deniers are quick to not say it was a covid death, but eager to run up the vaccine deaths. Amazing.

[rach5]

The expected years of life lost due to covid will be substantial - a heart attack, or permanent lung damage in a 40 year old, someone who has to go on dialysis at 50, another 35 year old who develops diabetes (even if that same person would have developed diabetes 10-15 years down the line, the additional 10 years of vascular damage may well affect life expectancy, and of course quality of life), ... may in some ways much more than what we have been measuring in terms of nursing home deaths, or deaths of the very elderly for instance. Vaccine damage compared to this will be vanishingly small.

[redplum33]

Originally Posted by redplum33

There will likely be new discrimination laws to not allow what you're suggesting.

Originally Posted by massnative71

Will there???

The vaccinated-only college campuses have to (legally?) allow exceptions for medical and religious reasons. It unfortunately defeats the purpose. And I'd guess "religious reasons" probably can't be questioned.

[massnative71]

Originally Posted by redplum33

The vaccinated-only college campuses have to (legally?) allow exceptions for medical and religious reasons. It unfortunately defeats the purpose. And I'd guess "religious reasons" probably can't be questioned.

Haha I just had this image of a newly converted "Amish" trying to fly on a plane, or get into a bar or rock concert.


But seriously, I imagine the number doing this will be lower than expected. More will probably just suck it up and get the vaccine at the end of the day, rather than go through the extra trouble of that stuff (and I also imagine those would require proof of a negative test or something in lieu of vaccination).

[bizcuit]

Originally Posted by OutdoorLover

Sorry to hear that. I don't want any part of a Covid-19 infection - not worth rolling the dice. I hope your brother is still able to make a full recovery later. Have you seen these reports that something like 40% of long-haulers seem to improve by getting vaccinated?

Yes, he has gotten vaccinated and is experiencing some days where the covid fog seems to lift for a bit, but it is not consistent. Hopefully he will improve over time though.

[Boston Shudra]

Originally Posted by BostonMike7

But a 99-year old on their last legs with multiple comorbidities who dies 15 days after the 2nd vaccine shot is 100% a vaccine death.

Haven't really been following the conversation, but to my knowledge this is how pharma companies treat adverse events. Even if it probably wasn't the cause, if someone dies after recieving the vaccine it "counts". Same is true for any other treatment or vaccine.

Anyway looks like there were only 1,265 confirmed cases yesterday. Hopefully that's a good sign! *knock on wood* https://www.mass.gov/info-details/co...onse-reporting

Originally Posted by redplum33

And I'd guess "religious reasons" probably can't be questioned.

Church of Christ Scientist is the only denomination I know of that preach against manmade medicine. As far as I know, the pope has not spoken out against the vaccines, so religious exemptions probably shouldn't apply to Catholics.

[htfdcolt]

Originally Posted by BostonMike7

You mean you can’t have it both ways?


A cardiac event in a healthy individual who caught covid shouldn’t be considered a covid death? But a 99-year old on their last legs with multiplie comorbidities who dies 15 days after the 2nd vaccine shot is 100% a vaccine death.


Funny how the deniers are quick to not say it was a covid death, but eager to run up the vaccine deaths. Amazing.

I don't believe there has been a single death attributed to any of the 3 approved vaccines, per the CDC.

"A review of available clinical information including death certificates, autopsy, and medical records revealed no evidence that vaccination contributed to patient deaths."

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019...se-events.html