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As far as ambience, yes. DT SF and DT Chicago along with Manhattan are the only downtowns in America I consider to be real destination downtowns. People gravitate there outside of M-F for purposes like shopping and entertainment in a way that I have never seen anywhere else. Sure some cities have little bar districts but they lack everything that is found in total in the above mentioned three.
I didnt say DT SF is bigger than DT Chicago. Im saying its better. The notion that SF lacks streetlife is quite absurd at best. Pound for Pound, SF is second to Manhattan in streetlife.
No, I think if we evaluate the whole package, retail, entertainment, hotels, bars, restaurants, pedestrian traffic, SF and Chicago are tied, but SF gets the edge from me because its more interesting to walk around
quite frankly. SF is also more memorable.
I guess I'll just say that I respect your opinion, but I really don't think you can compare San Francisco with Chicago. Like I said, SF has a very nice downtown, but in both quantity and quantity, it's a couple levels below Chicago. I put SF in a league with Boston. Not bad company. (FWIW-- I also put NYC a couple of levels above Chicago).
As far as ambience, yes. DT SF and DT Chicago along with Manhattan are the only downtowns in America I consider to be real destination downtowns. People gravitate there outside of M-F for purposes like shopping and entertainment in a way that I have never seen anywhere else. Sure some cities have little bar districts but they lack everything that is found in total in the above mentioned three.
Manhattan and SF certainly are heavyweights in the downtown department but to say no other cities can compare is a bit of an overstatement, at least in SF's case. Manhattan is in a league all its own. SF trying to jump on Manhattans coattails would be akin to Tori Spelling standing next to Megan Fox and proclaiming that they are the two hottest girls in the room.
Chicagos downtown is 3x the size of SF, eventhough SF may appear more quaint and lively you have to take the sheer size and vibrancy of downtown Chicago into account. Boston and Philly both have close to 100,000 full time downtown residents which dwarfs SF. Boston + Phillys downtowns are also cultural + entertainment centers for regions that are the same size as The Bay area. Admittedly SF is more of a national + international tourist city than either Boston or Philadelphia
Center City Philly is extremely lively. Its liveliness may be more economically and racially diverse than SF and thus it may not register in what you categorize as a "destination". My guess is that you classify "lively" with $$$$ and may have a certain criteria of demographic in what qualifies for destination status.
I think perhaps you havent seen most of downtown SF. Its very big and spreads into several different areas, n ot just the touristy parts. In addition, neighborhoods like the Mission, Lower Haight, the Castro, etc, which arent technically downtown, are actually more vibrant and bustling than most downtowns across the country.
Here are some pictures of the Mission District, an area far form downtown
Quote:
Originally Posted by BigLake
I guess I'll just say that I respect your opinion, but I really don't think you can compare San Francisco with Chicago. Like I said, SF has a very nice downtown, but in both quantity and quantity, it's a couple levels below Chicago. I put SF in a league with Boston. Not bad company. (FWIW-- I also put NYC a couple of levels above Chicago).
No, I think they equate vibrancy with vibrancy. Ive spent a lot of time in Philly, and love it, its gritty in an awesome way and has some cool areas.
But San Francisco's Downtown far eclipses Philly. Its way more dense, more crowded (especially during the daytime, when the city's population doubles), has more distinct sections, and feels more like a big city. You can walk through the Tenderloin, the Theatre District, Chinatown, North Beach, Union Square, Market Street (forget Fishermans Wharf), etc and have yourself a guarenteed adventure, seeing all walks of life, from the slummiest to the most grand, from great street food to top notch fine dining. And its so unbelievably packed you can discover something new everytime. Not to mention, most other neighborhoods in San Francisco feel almost like a downtown.
This, for instance, is normal foot traffic for certain areas of Market Street, and not during a "festival":
Quote:
Originally Posted by rainrock
Manhattan and SF certainly are heavyweights in the downtown department but to say no other cities can compare is a bit of an overstatement, at least in SF's case. Manhattan is in a league all its own. SF trying to jump on Manhattans coattails would be akin to Tori Spelling standing next to Megan Fox and proclaiming that they are the two hottest girls in the room.
Chicagos downtown is 3x the size of SF, eventhough SF may appear more quaint and lively you have to take the sheer size and vibrancy of downtown Chicago into account. Boston and Philly both have close to 100,000 full time downtown residents which dwarfs SF. Boston + Phillys downtowns are also cultural + entertainment centers for regions that are the same size as The Bay area. Admittedly SF is more of a national + international tourist city than either Boston or Philadelphia
Center City Philly is extremely lively. Its liveliness may be more economically and racially diverse than SF and thus it may not register in what you categorize as a "destination". My guess is that you classify "lively" with $$$$ and may have a certain criteria of demographic in what qualifies for destination status.
Italian Market
Typical scene along Market Street
Rittenhouse Square
Broad Street
South Street
Walnut Street
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