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Ok, so you don't believe that Jesus is God, you don't believe in either heaven or hell, but you are a Christian? I am so confused.
I don't know that I said I was a Christian either.... Don't be confused. I don't believe in the devil/satan, demons, winged angels, Peter pan, or santa either.
I am, however, a follower of Christ and a theist... actually I think if you look at my profile I have been called many things which I listed under religion...
My child has had surgery for tumors in his stomach twice. If I were to "punish" him physically, he'd bleed to death internally. So, there was a need to raise him by speaking to him with reason Vs physical punishment.
I believe that if standing before God knowing one was going to be sentenced to Hell, one may ask of God for His forgiveness and that God would honor that request.
However, that said -- God says you must ask of Him with a sincere heart, and a contrite spirit. Do you not believe that God can see into your heart and know if you are sincere and contrite in your request or that you're just saying whatever you can to save your soul?
With threat of eternal torture over your head aren't those who believe in the doctrine of hell just saying whatever they can to save their soul? Are they following the laws in order to avoid eternal punishment or because they love God? I used to hear this from Christians all the time: If you accept God and you are wrong nothing will happen but if you don't accept God you will go to hell.. just accept him and your covered!
Quote:
I had a Great Uncle that didn't believe in God. All his life he said it was nonsense. Then one day my Grandfather and two of his brothers had gone hunting. The Uncle that was a nonbeliever was one of my Grandfather's brothers.
They were in an accident, the truck hit an embankment and rolled over. My Uncle that was the nonbeliever was trapped from the waist down, underneath the weight of the truck. He was dying, and knew it.
His last words to my Grandfather were "If anyone ever tells you there is no God, don't you believe it. God is here for me, right now."
In the last moments of his life, my Uncle finally knew that God was real and he accepted Jesus.
I think Universalists will say that your uncle was not an anomaly and that when faced with death we all re-think our choices in life. AND God becomes very real indeed! And what of those who don't have time to think before death? When they see God in all his glory will they deny him or be in awe?
I am sorry about your uncle, but glad that he knew the lord for that short time.
hmmm ... you don't believe in Angels? What about guardian angels? Do you believe in them?
I have a few stories about guardian angels that'd make the hair on your arms stand up. I know they're real.
I don't believe God needs help. The words translated angel in the bible are messengers and could as easily be human messengers of God.
I'm not dogmatic on this issue though as it hardly matters in my mind if there are angels or not. I have never experience anything to convince me of their existence so I can't attest to their existence other than what I said above.
OK, I'll tell you my few experiences. These things happened before I lost my eyesight completely.
My ex and I were on our first date together and ended up in a very serious car accident. We were hit by a City truck that ran a red light, and was speeding. We were sitting ducks. Couldn't go forward or backward, or anywhere to get out of the path of being hit.
The impact bent the car into a "U" shape. It broke all 4 motor mounts that held up the engine, and broke both axle's in half. The side of the car was pushed up about 8.5 inches over top of the seats (it was a two-door car). Glass broke and flew in on us, battery acid flew in and was all over him.
The accident was so bad that the medics arrived and walked up with the jaws of life expecting to have to pull bodies from the car. No one at the scene could believe we didn't die in it.
As I stood surrounded by medics, I looked over to my ex as they poured rubbing alcohol over his cuts from the broken glass, and his burns from the battery acid. He never said a word, not even a whimper.
I thought to myself, "God, thank you for letting us escape this without harm."
From behind me, as I was standing next to the medics, a voice said "You're here because of your son."
I thought, "what son?" I wasn't married yet, had no children, had never been pregnant. I turned to look for the "voice" from behind, only to find that no one was there.
Four years later, we married, and I did indeed have my only child, a son.
One other incident, which was before my son was born, and before we were married.
I was in my car driving to work because my schedule had been changed. The road I was on is one that swerves all over, barely any lights, one lane each side of the road, and had a deep revene off to the side of the road with no guard rails.
It was pitch black outside and this idiot was in front of me driving 20 mph when the limit through there was 35. He was playing road games. I signaled to pass him and he sped up and kept me over on the other side and wouldn't let me back into the lane.
I sped up because up ahead there was a semi headed for me straight on. The headlights of the semi were so close I could have reached out my window and touched them.
I knew I was going to die. I closed my eyes, and said "Lord, if you are going to take me now, I am ready to go. I am sorry for ever having offended thee."
The next thing I knew, it was like time stopped. This gust of air whooshed by. My car was on the other side of the road near the revene in the dirt. The semi and the other truck that wouldn't let me over, were no where to be seen.
From in the back seat of my car, and hand came and rested upon my shoulder and a soft spoken voice said "You are safe now my child."
I was freaking out because how could that be explained? No one in my car but me, how was I pulled from the head-on demise with the semi?
That was the work of my guardian angel. Yes, I do believe in them no matter what anyone else says. I don't think they're "helping" God, as you put it. But I believe they are God's stewards.
OK, I'll tell you my few experiences. These things happened before I lost my eyesight completely.
My ex and I were on our first date together and ended up in a very serious car accident. We were hit by a City truck that ran a red light, and was speeding. We were sitting ducks. Couldn't go forward or backward, or anywhere to get out of the path of being hit.
The impact bent the car into a "U" shape. It broke all 4 motor mounts that held up the engine, and broke both axle's in half. The side of the car was pushed up about 8.5 inches over top of the seats (it was a two-door car). Glass broke and flew in on us, battery acid flew in and was all over him.
The accident was so bad that the medics arrived and walked up with the jaws of life expecting to have to pull bodies from the car. No one at the scene could believe we didn't die in it.
As I stood surrounded by medics, I looked over to my ex as they poured rubbing alcohol over his cuts from the broken glass, and his burns from the battery acid. He never said a word, not even a whimper.
I thought to myself, "God, thank you for letting us escape this without harm."
From behind me, as I was standing next to the medics, a voice said "You're here because of your son."
I thought, "what son?" I wasn't married yet, had no children, had never been pregnant. I turned to look for the "voice" from behind, only to find that no one was there.
Four years later, we married, and I did indeed have my only child, a son.
One other incident, which was before my son was born, and before we were married.
I was in my car driving to work because my schedule had been changed. The road I was on is one that swerves all over, barely any lights, one lane each side of the road, and had a deep revene off to the side of the road with no guard rails.
It was pitch black outside and this idiot was in front of me driving 20 mph when the limit through there was 35. He was playing road games. I signaled to pass him and he sped up and kept me over on the other side and wouldn't let me back into the lane.
I sped up because up ahead there was a semi headed for me straight on. The headlights of the semi were so close I could have reached out my window and touched them.
I knew I was going to die. I closed my eyes, and said "Lord, if you are going to take me now, I am ready to go. I am sorry for ever having offended thee."
The next thing I knew, it was like time stopped. This gust of air whooshed by. My car was on the other side of the road near the revene in the dirt. The semi and the other truck that wouldn't let me over, were no where to be seen.
From in the back seat of my car, and hand came and rested upon my shoulder and a soft spoken voice said "You are safe now my child."
I was freaking out because how could that be explained? No one in my car but me, how was I pulled from the head-on demise with the semi?
That was the work of my guardian angel. Yes, I do believe in them no matter what anyone else says. I don't think they're "helping" God, as you put it. But I believe they are God's stewards.
I believe in angels too, I'm glad your guardian angel was there!
I have been around all kinds, Mormons on my husbands side, and so on. These subjects are very important to me and I am still studying my heart out. I am not a Universalist. I am still studying. I do know, for a fact, and I have checked up and down for the last few years, that "hell" became a very mangled doctrine of Christianity.
Thank you for the response.
Since your husbands family is Mormon, the Mormon equivalent to hell is "outer darkness".
Matthew 25:30
And throw that worthless servant outside, into the darkness, where there will be weeping and gnashing of teeth.'
I reject the "theory" that Jesus Christ is God... it isn't a fact....it is a supposition stemming from misinterpretation. The bible does not say "Jesus is God" you just suppose it does.
There is no need to twist anything to avoid anything. "Jesus is God" is not found in scripture, neither is any variance of that statement.
If you think Hell literally exists then proving it to someone should be easy.. What convinces you that hell literally exists somewhere? You can choose not to respond... but I have to wonder why people choose to believe in something they cannot prove through scripture they say is God's word.
So here you say I don't believe in God as he has revealed himself in scripture yet you don't bother to show how God is revealed in scripture... perhaps you will discuss what you think God's character is or perhaps you can just tell me what part of scripture leads you to believe in the tangibility of hell. Is hell a literal place or not, Mike? Show me the scripture. You obviously believe the bible is the word of God so I am asking you to use your own proof (the bible) to show there is a literal place where people burn for eternity...
Should be quite simple if it is the truth.... I am not asking you to prove God exists but that hell exists using scripture....
You say you don't believe that the existence of Hell can be proven by scripture and then ask that scripture be used to prove its existence.
You don't believe the scriptures about the reality of Heaven or that Jesus Christ is God and you don't believe the scriptures about the reality of angels which includes Satan. Therefore you will and do simply reject any scriptures that are used which do prove the existence of hell. And in so doing you make the word of God out to be a lie.
The proof of the existence of Hell is quite easily proven by the Scriptures. You simply refuse to accept it. Here's the proof. Matthew 10:28, Matthew 25:41,46, Revelation 20:10-15. If you believed that the Bible was the word of God then you would believe the Scriptures about the reality of hell and the reality of Heaven and the reality of the deity of Christ.
You have rejected the truth and are now under strong delusion.
Final comment
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I reject the "theory" that Jesus Christ is God... it isn't a fact....it is a supposition stemming from misinterpretation. The bible does not say "Jesus is God" you just suppose it does.
