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i'm sorry I'm not using half a verse to explain what I think.
I'm using WHOLE PASSAGES.
which passages?
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This is why everyone is ridiculing what you and Preterist are writing.
I have been given several approvals. What do you mean by "everyone" BTW?
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You're completely taking the Word of God out of context from 1-2 words out of a verse.
where?
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There's a verse that says "Jesus wept"
Does that mean He's still weeping now?
I don't even understand this point.
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Let me put it in layman terms
Jesus goes up to Heaven, and there were no Angels making NO announcement........
Of COURSE there was!
Jesus went up....there were 2 Angels that made the Announcement...
Jesus is coming back the same way he left!
The End.
Where is the announcement except to the men of Galilee in Acts 1? Why is it not to so few men on his return in this case? I still do not see this answer.
It's so interesting to me how people still believe in the rapture, and continue to misunderstand one Bible text after another. Rev. 1:7 clearly states that when Christ returns for the second time, (the first being when He came to earth as man) that every eye shall see Him. There will no "secret" return.
Gwynedd, the above quote from jeweloflight answered your question about 'all' seeing Christ's return. You apparently missed it, or choose to ignore it, or you wanted someone else to point it out to you.
Gwynedd, the about quote from jeweloflight answered your question about 'all' seeing Christ's return. You apparently missed it, or choose to ignore it, or you wanted someone else to point it out to you.
Hi Marianinark,
I did miss that. Thanks.
If only a few in Galilee see him leave and every eye in the world will see him come then that scripture has an apparent contradiction does it not ?
I have some questions.
Why are people mourning because of Christ?
Revelation 1
7(X)BEHOLD, HE IS COMING WITH THE CLOUDS, and (Y)every eye will see Him, even those who pierced Him; and all the tribes of the earth will (Z)mourn over Him. So it is to be. Amen.
Why are they eagerly awaiting here?
Hebrews 9
28so Christ also, having been (CC)offered once to (CD)bear the sins of many, will appear (CE)a second time for (CF)salvation (CG)without reference to sin, to those who (CH)eagerly await Him.
Why do you jam this in one event?
Why don't you read Revelation 2 and 3 like I posted where it says:
Revelation 2
To Ephesus
5'Therefore remember from where you have fallen, and (I)repent and (J)do the deeds you did at first; or else I am coming to you and will remove your (K)lampstand out of its place--unless you repent.
To Pergamum
16'Therefore (AQ)repent; or else (AR)I am coming to you quickly, and I will make war against them with (AS)the sword of My mouth.
To Sardis
3'So (F)remember what you have received and heard; and keep it, and (G)repent Therefore if you do not wake up, (H)I will come (I)like a thief, and you will not know at (J)what hour I will come to you.
Lastly
To Philadelphia
Revelation 3
10'Because you have (AD)kept the word of (AE)My perseverance, (AF)I also will keep you from the hour of (AG)testing, that hour which is about to come upon the whole (AH)world, to test (AI)those who dwell on the earth.
Why isn't Jesus coming to the good church? How can a sinful church cause Christ to come? Can they not start sinning to bring Christ in a second coming? Repent or else I will come.....? Don't repent then.
Where in the Bible does it say Christ will come only once in judgment?
How do you explain Jesus arrival in Revelation 1 is the complete opposite of Acts 1 and Hebrews 9?
Did the Angels say that the men of Galilee will be the ONLY people to see Jesus coming back?
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Originally Posted by gwynedd1
Hi Marianinark,
I did miss that. Thanks.
If only a few in Galilee see him leave and every eye in the world will see him come then that scripture has an apparent contradiction does it not ?
Did the Angels say that the men of Galilee will be the ONLY people to see Jesus coming back?
Hi renriq,
If you are asking for my interpretation is it consistent with Hebrews 9 when he comes for those who wait for him when we die. Only believers would see this.
I did miss that. Thanks. If only a few in Galilee see him leave and every eye in the world will see him come then that scripture has an apparent contradiction does it not
No, it is not a contradiction. It is a misunderstanding on your part.
Hebrews 9
28 So Christ was once offered to bear the sins of many; and unto them that look for him shall he appear the second time without sin unto salvation.
Those without sin will see Him unto salvation.
Those with sin will see Him but NOT unto salvation
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Originally Posted by gwynedd1
Hi renriq,
If you are asking for my interpretation is it consistent with Hebrews 9 when he comes for those who wait for him when we die. Only believers would see this.
jeweloflight: What is my point with "near" in Revelation 1:3 and 22:10? You want to take Revelation 1:7 literally but you refuse to take 1:1 and 3 and 22:6 and 10 the same way.
God has given us time and He communicates to us in terms that have meaning to us. Just because a day is as a thousand years to God and a thousand years are as a day, does not mean that simple words such as "near," "shortly," and "at hand" do not mean exactly what they say. Why don't you take them literally?
The Greek words for "near" (engus, engizo) and "shortly" (tachos) are used frequently in the NT. If I presented to you those passages, you would take those time words found within them at their face value. What does near mean in the following (same Greek word as in Revelation 1:1)?
"Now when vintage time drew near, he [landowner] sent his servants to the vineyard" (Mat. 21:34--Parable of the Wickedness Vinedressers).
[Jesus in the Garden at the time of His arrest] "See, My betrayer is at hand (Mat. 26:46).
There are many, many such passages. Near always means near! I submit that you probably only have a problem with this term when it deals with prophecy!
The same is true of the word tachos (shortly). No futurist ever has problems with Acts 25:4 which uses the exact same Greek word.
"But Festus answered that Paul should be kept at Caesarea, and that he himself was about to go there shortly" (Acts 25:4). When was he to go? SOON!
The coming of Christ is not still near. It was near in John's day; it is not near in ours. Do we care what words mean? I believe things happened when and how the Scriptures say they were to happen--soon in that first-century time.
James said, "the coming of the Lord is at hand" (James 5:8). What did he mean? Will you take that literally or are you only literal sometimes? Peter said, "the end of all things is at hand" (1 Peter 4:7). Are you a literalist here?
I never said "every" does not mean "all." I said that the term does not in Revelation 1:7 mean everybody everywhere at one time throughout the entire earth. You yourself acknowledge that it includes those who pierced Him. The mentioning of those who pierced Him places this event within their lifetimes. Furthermore, it is the "tribes of the land" who mourned because of Him. What do you think went through the minds of those first-century Jews as their Temple and city burned to the ground? We must consider their background. God had brought judgment upon their forefathers in the same way when Antiochus IV destroyed the first Temple. The destruction of the Temple and city in A. D. 70 was such a judgment--a judgment Jesus pronounced upon that stiff-necked, apostate, reprobate generation of Jews of His day in Matthew 23. It was that generation which was found guilty of "all the righteous blood shed on the earth." Jesus avenged their innocent blood in A. D. 70 when He used the Roman armies to exact His judgment! Every eye of that wicked generation "saw" Him in the destruction of their Temple and city and they, "the tribes of the land" mourned because of Him.
Preterist
That was me Betsey, the mentioning of also those who pierced Him, means something or someone was added to the equation. Also is the key word here.
Definition of also: (Beginning Dictionary, Scott, Foresman 3rd Edition)
Also (ol'so), too; in addition: I like summer but I enjoy winter also. adverb.
Now you read it in that 'context' and the truth shall set you free also.
And since all things have been fulfilled in 70 AD, where in history is there documented proof that Israel has ever signed a 7-year peace treaty with any other nation? Much less had it broken within a three year period? Note: The peace treaty and the breaking of it, are requirements to the fulfilling of Revelation.
Yet another requirement is the revealing, assassination and the rising of the anti-christ from the dead. Happened when? One question at a time please. Preferably tonight.............................
Last edited by Betsey Lane; 11-11-2008 at 05:08 PM..
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