Coronavirus (Los Angeles, Sacramento: hardware, shop, assessment)

[goodheathen]

Anybody vaccinated who has to work a face-to-face job with many members of the public probably will be safe enough from the old versions of COVID-19, but a breakthrough infection with that could then mean spreading it to vulnerable relatives, for example, and they do have to miss work and other duties if infected. If they're scared, it's justifiable. I don't understand why the CDC and California decided to overlook the ripple effect of abandoning most mask rules. Mask-free hardly even benefits the economy, and businesses risk trouble with OSHA and at least in LA the health department if they have workplace spread.

[goodheathen]

Originally Posted by sav858

As you shouldn't because it's irrelevant when compared to another metropolis.

The UK spread out the second dose to 12 weeks versus 4 weeks that was recommended earlier in the year. You don't think that affected how much protection the vaccines provide? Nearly twice the rate of people have been infected too in LA County vs the UK providing more natural immunity.

Believe what you want but maybe look at the data at some point.

I don't know if the longer time between doses, which I only heard a little about, makes a difference. That's for researchers to determine. The more natural immunity in Los Angeles probably will be wearing off in the winter. There will be not be a quick decline in the situation due to the 'freedom' from masks. Except in a packed region like New York City, it always takes a while to become bad. I hope it never happens.

By the way, everyone views natural immunity as an add-on to vaccination totals, but the CDC urges many previously infected people to be vaccinated and some have complied and there probably are no records of how many. Also, it's murky whether they should get one or two shots, so I don't know how that affects fully vaccinated numbers vs. at least one dose numbers.

If Los Angeles officials wanted to be prudent about all this, instead of relaxing masks rules, there first should have been a fresh study, per sampling, of what percentage of residents have high levels of antibodies.

[sav858]

Originally Posted by goodheathen

I don't know if the longer time between doses, which I only heard a little about, makes a difference. That's for researchers to determine. The more natural immunity in Los Angeles probably will be wearing off in the winter. There will be not be a quick decline in the situation due to the 'freedom' from masks. Except in a packed region like New York City, it always takes a while to become bad. I hope it never happens.

By the way, everyone views natural immunity as an add-on to vaccination totals, but the CDC urges many previously infected people to be vaccinated and some have complied and there probably are no records of how many. Also, it's murky whether they should get one or two shots, so I don't know how that affects fully vaccinated numbers vs. at least one dose numbers.

If Los Angeles officials wanted to be prudent about all this, instead of relaxing masks rules, there first should have been a fresh study, per sampling, of what percentage of residents have high levels of antibodies.

Well then I guess it's a good thing LA is expected to reach herd immunity based on vaccination rates by the end of August then.

[roadwarrior101]

Originally Posted by sav858

Well then I guess it's a good thing LA is expected to reach herd immunity based on vaccination rates by the end of August then.

It's a very good thing. It's the reason why I'm feeling increasingly safe about sending my kids back to in person schooling in August, even though the vaccine won't be available to them until fall.

However, it's also the reason why it seems premature to get rid of the mask mandate before this occurs. Hopefully, our vaccination rate here in the Bay Area is high enough to where this is a non-issue. I don't think this will be the case elsewhere though.

[sav858]

Originally Posted by roadwarrior101

It's a very good thing. It's the reason why I'm feeling increasingly safe about sending my kids back to in person schooling in August, even though the vaccine won't be available to them until fall.

However, it's also the reason why it seems premature to get rid of the mask mandate before this occurs. Hopefully, our vaccination rate here in the Bay Area is high enough to where this is a non-issue. I don't think this will be the case elsewhere though.

Oh does it Dr. Roadwarrior? What happened to listen to the CDC and " the experts"?

Again there are numerous states out there that got rid of these restrictions a while ago and still have seen metrics continue to decline. Why do you constantly ignore those real world examples?

[roadwarrior101]

Originally Posted by sav858

Oh does it Dr. Roadwarrior? What happened to listen to the CDC and " the experts"?

Again there are numerous states out there that got rid of these restrictions a while ago and still have seen metrics continue to decline. Why do you constantly ignore those real world examples?

I don't, but have stated over and over that the CDC guidance is only for vaccinated people. You seem to constantly overlook this as we have no good control mechanism in place to separate the two.

And I think its really premature for you to suggest that this is a done deal. Let's see how the southern states with low vaccination rates do (or even deep red counties in interior California) in terms of a summer surge.

[sav858]

Originally Posted by roadwarrior101

I don't, but have stated over and over that the CDC guidance is only for vaccinated people. You seem to constantly overlook this as we have no good control mechanism in place to separate the two.

And I think its really premature for you to suggest that this is a done deal. Let's see how the southern states with low vaccination rates do (or even deep red counties in interior California) in terms of a summer surge.

Not overlooking it at all but it doesn’t seem to be an issue even without a “control mechanism”. It hasn’t been a problem for other states so why do you want California to be the only state with this mask mandate in place? How is that even remotely necessary when you have zero data to support keeping it ?

You really think some place like Lasen County with 30k people in the far corner of the state is even going to matter to the rest of CA?

It’s just funny how now you don’t trust the “experts” and think you know better than them. As well as just completely disregard what has happened, or not happened for that matter, in other states that have been largely restriction and mask free for a while now.

[1AngryTaxPayer]

Originally Posted by sav858

Yeah, you still see a ton of people wearing them outdoors even with no one around. Some people are going to cling to them forever.

It's a virtue signaling game to see who can hold out the longest. The science went out the window quite a while ago.

[roadwarrior101]

Originally Posted by sav858

Not overlooking it at all but it doesn’t seem to be an issue even without a “control mechanism”. It hasn’t been a problem for other states so why do you want California to be the only state with this mask mandate in place? How is that even remotely necessary when you have zero data to support keeping it ?

You really think some place like Lasen County with 30k people in the far corner of the state is even going to matter to the rest of CA?

It’s just funny how now you don’t trust the “experts” and think you know better than them. As well as just completely disregard what has happened, or not happened for that matter, in other states that have been largely restriction and mask free for a while now.

Umm, have you been following what the Delta variant has done in terms of surges in the UK? What makes you think it won't do the same thing here with unvaccinated people? Are Americans somehow immune from this strain of COVID? They haven't been for other strains. But keep pretending I have zero data to support this. LOL

Regarding rural counties, do you not expect a lot of people to travel this summer and come into contact with locals? Last time I checked the Sierras were PACKED with people coming from the Bay Area, Sacramento, etc. We don't all stay in one place isolated from contact from one another. What happens elsewhere does impact us as we're a mobile society.

[goodheathen]

https://deadline.com/2021/06/los-ang...st-1234768233/

The title is misleading. Los Angeles is only expecting 80% with at least one dose of a vaccine by late August (which, with Johnson & Johnson rare around here, makes 1 dose rarely fully vaccinated). That isn't automatically whatever is considered herd immunity. That is bad for those of us in the area and also embarrassing. Mask on me for me in stores that aren't virtually empty. Maybe if Newsom were from Southern California, he'd be more concerned about the numerically most important county in California being the weakest link of the counties that aren't sparsely populated.

Here's a map that suggests where in Los Angeles it's probably safe and where it probably isn't.
https://abc7.com/how-many-people-hav...ates/10560882/

Edit: San Bernadino is also big and even more vaccine-hesitant, but it's much less important to the state's economy.