OOPPS! California deficit now projected at 25 BILLION, bring on the taxes Moonbeam (Los Angeles: assessor, mortgage)
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[color=black][font=Verdana]Removing prop 13 would remove incentive to purchase a home.
Doesn't stop people from buying homes in other nations or other countries, why do you think it would stop people from buying homes in California?
Not to mention people who just buy houses aren't affected much by Prop 13. Prop 13 has created a rentier aristocracy in California in which property can only be owned if inherited.
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Removing mortgage interest deduction would make owning a home less affordable and again lose incentive to purchase.
So how do the Brits, Canadians, and Spaniards have higher rates of ownership lacking those things?
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Here is a thought!!! How about cutting the state and federal government spending and size instead of increasing taxes on the hard working citizens!!!
I'm for that.
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Our government spends way more money than needed and lots of the money goes to special interest, pork projects, blatant waste, fraud and abuse.
True.
A little story from California's past: when Reagan signed the biggest income tax increase in California's history before or since, he also cut state spending to show that he was serious about the state's fiscal condition.
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Cut the spending and you can cut taxes which will allow the private sector to grow and flourish.
Definitely cut sales taxes, the cost of fees and permits, fines, etc. Repealing Prop 13 would allow for that. Cutting the corporate income tax for businesses that add jobs might be a good idea, too.
Cut prop 13 and probably a third of the state will lose their homes or just sell and leave.
There is also another 700 billion owed that we don't have to pay for the lottery payments we seem to have provided for the retirement of state employees. IMO we void those and let them have SS only.
Doesn't stop people from buying homes in other nations or other countries, why do you think it would stop people from buying homes in California?
Not to mention people who just buy houses aren't affected much by Prop 13. Prop 13 has created a rentier aristocracy in California in which property can only be owned if inherited.
So how do the Brits, Canadians, and Spaniards have higher rates of ownership lacking those things?
I'm for that.
True.
A little story from California's past: when Reagan signed the biggest income tax increase in California's history before or since, he also cut state spending to show that he was serious about the state's fiscal condition.
Definitely cut sales taxes, the cost of fees and permits, fines, etc. Repealing Prop 13 would allow for that. Cutting the corporate income tax for businesses that add jobs might be a good idea, too.
I noticed you didn't comment on increasing property tax on the fixed income retired people and driving them out of their homes.
Your responses are comparing California with other countries or things that happened in the past??? What's up with that? How about talking about good old California in present day.
Bottom line is California is already over taxing its citizens while doing nothing to intelligently and effectively manage the state. The state has the largest economy but yet is in the worse shape and the 2nd highest in taxing its citizens. California has over taxed and over regulated business so business is leaving California. California spends the most per child for education but yet is one of the worst on test scores and drop outs. All I hear from the liberal politicians in California is raise taxes and I hear nothing about managing the state better. Even the liberal citizens are echoing the politician’s battle cry to raise taxes. It's insane.
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Cut prop 13 and probably a third of the state will lose their homes or just sell and leave.
There is also another 700 billion owed that we don't have to pay for the lottery payments we seem to have provided for the retirement of state employees. IMO we void those and let them have SS only.
State employees pay into their retirement, every month, year after year. If you want to "void" that retirement, then just simply pay back every employee for every payment they made, plus the interest they would have earned if they'd been able to invest that money on their own instead of the mandatory state retirement plan.
If you want to see the "free" retirements, look at the Controller's database of all the other entities that went into PERS--cities, counties, various districts. Many of them entered PERS without requiring their employees to pay anything each month.
The governor's plan to have state employees pay an extra 3% towards retirement won't really accomplish anything, as he has no control over all the other groups in PERS that have been, and continue to be, unfunded.
]Your responses are comparing California with other countries or things that happened in the past???
Spain and Britain aren't exactly doing too well right now (Spain has similar fiscal problems) but both have higher homeownership rates than the USA.
Canada is in far better economic shape than the US or most other developed countries and doesn't have mortgage deductions, yet has a higher rate of home ownership.
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What's up with that? How about talking about good old California in present day.
So I'm supposed to compare current policy to itself?
Do you even know what a comparison is?
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Bottom line is California is already over taxing its citizens while doing nothing to intelligently and effectively manage the state
Not all taxes are created equal. California's present day fiscal model of super high fees, fines, and sales taxes combined with low property taxes is completely insane. Not to mention the bureaucracy associated with starting a business, which is destructive to the state's vitality. The high fees associated with starting any type of business hurts CA's business climate as does its high corporate taxes. High sales taxes discourage consumption. I.e. a blend of the worst aspects of left and right.
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California has over taxed and over regulated business so business is leaving California.
Much of it for Canada....
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California spends the most per child for education but yet is one of the worst on test scores and drop outs.
Because the educational system like much else in the state is broken, particularly in the case of very large school districts with entrenched bureaucracies and corruption up the yingyang. And the excessive power of the teachers' union is a negative factor.
The link between property taxation and education funding is a big reason why the schools have declined ; although not the entire reason. There should be a law limiting the size of school districts at 100K students before said districts are broken up (only 2 or at most 3 school districts, all in SoCal,would be affected). In addition, the comprehensive model should be phased out and more charters started. This is a topic for a different thread, really.
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All I hear from the liberal politicians in California is raise taxes and I hear nothing about managing the state better.
California needs a new Constitution. Badly. Ironically, when there was a measure to call a new constitutional convention earlier this year, it was (some) conservatives who were most opposed to it. California has the world's third longest constitution and it is outdated and dysfunctional. A new constitution would make the state more manageable
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Even the liberal citizens are echoing the politician’s battle cry to raise taxes. It's insane.
You didn't read what I wrote. I'm for lowering most taxes, even corporate taxes (if businesses create new jobs in the state). The only taxes I'm for raising are property taxes.
With Prop 13 repealed the state would have a surplus and there could be tax cuts in other areas.
Cut prop 13 and probably a third of the state will lose their homes or just sell and leave.
That seems to be happening anyways based on some of the posts in these threads. I doubt it would cause that many people to lose their homes if any. It would establish a ceiling on how high RE prices could rise therefore preventing another bubble.
Texas has higher property taxes than CA yet has done better in some areas than CA. Conservatives praise the "Texas model", yet part of that model is having high property taxes. If Texas had a Prop 13 it would not have been spared from the RE bubble and would be in the same shape as CA, NV, AZ or FL right now.
Come on you liberal/socialists. You know more then me and better then me. Keep my paycheck a rolling. I am laughing my butt off. YOU socialists wanted this and you got it. Thank you. I'm off to Las Vegas next week.
I noticed you didn't comment on increasing property tax on the fixed income retired people and driving them out of their homes.
Your responses are comparing California with other countries or things that happened in the past??? What's up with that? How about talking about good old California in present day.
Bottom line is California is already over taxing its citizens while doing nothing to intelligently and effectively manage the state. The state has the largest economy but yet is in the worse shape and the 2nd highest in taxing its citizens. California has over taxed and over regulated business so business is leaving California. California spends the most per child for education but yet is one of the worst on test scores and drop outs. All I hear from the liberal politicians in California is raise taxes and I hear nothing about managing the state better. Even the liberal citizens are echoing the politician’s battle cry to raise taxes. It's insane.
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I understand posters are upset about taxes, but where do you get information that factually supports your claim that "California spends the most per child for education"?
Here is a link from a credible source that shows California spends among the least per child on public education (47th in the country):
That seems to be happening anyways based on some of the posts in these threads. I doubt it would cause that many people to lose their homes if any. It would establish a ceiling on how high RE prices could rise therefore preventing another bubble.
Texas has higher property taxes than CA yet has done better in some areas than CA. Conservatives praise the "Texas model", yet part of that model is having high property taxes. If Texas had a Prop 13 it would not have been spared from the RE bubble and would be in the same shape as CA, NV, AZ or FL right now.
Are you advocating California drop income tax and implement Texas Property Tax Rates?
The thing about CA is that we have just about every type of Tax and Fee compared to neighboring States...
Oregon and Nevada have no State Sales Tax... Washington no State Income Tax.
1.5% Property Tax on a median Bay Area Home is not low taxation... in fact, many that walked away from their homes in the last 2.5 years cited high property tax as a reason.
1100 square feet 1922 homes with 3 br and 1 bath were selling for 500k and the tax on that price home is $7,500.
People walked and some bought in the same neighborhood the same house for 150k and pay $2,250 in tax.
I worked in Europe for a time and no one worries about property taxes... I was in Austria and the tax is a fraction of what it would be in CA... 10% and 20% sales tax funds much of Government...
Are you advocating California drop income tax and implement Texas Property Tax Rates?
I'd have to think about that. If the state's fiscal situation improves it might be something to think about. Brown in the past advocated a flat income tax. There has been talk of reducing the number of tax brackets in California recently amongst legislators of both parties ; sounds like it could be a good idea...
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The thing about CA is that we have just about every type of Tax and Fee compared to neighboring States...
Oregon and Nevada have no State Sales Tax... Washington no State Income Tax.
Oregon and Nevada aren't doing too well, Nevada's doing as poorly as California. Washington is doing better than other Western states. Like I said, it might be something to think about.
1.5% Property Tax on a median Bay Area Home is not low taxation... in fact, many that walked away from their homes in the last 2.5 years cited high property tax as a reason.
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I worked in Europe for a time and no one worries about property taxes... I was in Austria and the tax is a fraction of what it would be in CA... 10% and 20% sales tax funds much of Government...
This link on French property taxes is rather confusing, but I notice that low income seniors are get an exemption on taxe fonciere (one of two property taxes in France - both based on the rental value of the property)
From what I read about Germany, taxes there are between 3-30% of the property's value depending upon where one's at. Doesn't sound too low to me.
Germany has one of the lowest property ownership rates of any developed country. Austria has very low property taxes but very high taxes on everything else. Spain's taxes are about 10% of the value of the property.
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