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For what it's worth, I was driving the other day here on the Dallas Tollway, and I was moving at a pretty good clip through some curves and turns in my Z, and I saw this low-slung black car absolutely rocketing up on me and screaming past me, hugging the road like an F1 racer.
I would argue that if you want AWD, buy the time-tested best. That's Subaru. There's a reason they are popular in areas where you need traction, but you may not need a truck.
Not to slight anyone's favorite brand, but when it comes to AWD cars and value for the dollar, Subuaru wins hands down. I'd consider the Suzuki if money was tight, but go drive an SX4 followed by a Scoobie. You'll see.
I would argue that if you want AWD, buy the time-tested best. That's Subaru. There's a reason they are popular in areas where you need traction, but you may not need a truck.
Not to slight anyone's favorite brand, but when it comes to AWD cars and value for the dollar, Subuaru wins hands down. I'd consider the Suzuki if money was tight, but go drive an SX4 followed by a Scoobie. You'll see.
Thanks for sharing your experience, Getmeoutofhere. It felt really good to read that. Even though I've read reviews that say otherwise, there's still a part of me that sees a Legacy as a boring family car.
Wanneroo: I know that a redesigned Legacy is coming. The question is whether or not to wait for it. In the first model year they iron out the kinks, so it may be better to buy in the second model year. Meanwhile, the current Legacy is at the top of its game.
On the other hand, the presence of a new, redesigned Legacy, assuming it catches on, might mean a lower resale value for my older model. If it doesn't catch on, then this argument doesn't really apply. At any rate, I tend to drive my cars into the ground. I only get rid of a car when I have to, e.g. if the car dies. So the issue is probably moot.
I think my little Nissan Sentra can handle another year, if necessary,or even two, assuming I buy new tires. It's reliable but it's showing its age.
Lots of people here in Vermont get by on FWD. But lots and lots of cars up here are Subarus. Come to think of it, I don't think I've seen a single Suzuki SX4 or Mercury Milan. But I really haven't looked for them.
So now, a new question: Is it better to get a Legacy now, or to wait for the new redesign? Or, get a 2009 after the new redesign comes out, when it might be less expensive? (That also involves waiting for the new redesign.
Does anyone know what they are working on in the new redesign? Improved gas mileage? More trunk space? A hybrid? Intelligent AWD? Does anyone have any knowledge about this?
The question is more along the lines of: Do you LIKE the current design? And will you be happy driving it?
Like you said; there will be kinks worked out in the first year, but Subaru is, over all, very good about sending a quality product out the door. They don't rush things to production.
You can be almost GUARANTEED that it won't be cheaper.
From what I've been able to find out: NEW 2.0 & 2.5 Liter four cylinders. The six is likely to be axed.
2.5 Liter - Turbo is supposed to push over the 300hp mark.
Thanks for sharing your experience, Getmeoutofhere. It felt really good to read that. Even though I've read reviews that say otherwise, there's still a part of me that sees a Legacy as a boring family car.
This is why I recommend the 2.5 GT. Since its the STI engine, adding a Cobb tuning chip (you just plug it in) nets you the full 300 hp. That makes it the most powerful "family" sedan under $30k now that GM raised its MSRP on the G8 GT to $32k. Most new 08s can be had today for $27k, I found one in Florida for $24k with 112 miles on it. Subaru usually has a sales event in Feb so there may be good deals then, and if you join any one of a number of outdoor societies, you can get up to a $2-3k discount on a new Subaru.
If the new 2.5 GT already pushes the 300 hp mark, it may be worth waiting for. There will also be a deisel engine, but it won't be as powerful.
As for resale, Subaru just had a lease and sales event with 75%-80% residual after 3 years - Subarus hold their value extremely well.
Fwiw, the Mercury Milan is based on the Mazda 6 chassis - its an excellent platform, but Mazda does not sell an awd 6. I wouldn't hold Ford to cars from 20-30 years ago - the company is different from then, better managed, better quality. American car makers are finally getting it, and with Ford's current employee pricing, you are basically looking at almost $10k difference between a Subaru 2.5 GT Ltd ad an awd Milan. You'll have to decide if its worth the extra cost, but Subaru is definitely the best awd out there.
Amen.
Ford recently got some award or achievement for having the highest number of vehicles with top safety ratings.
The Mazda6/Milan platform is an excellent product. I find Ford dashboards generally not to my liking, and in the past I didn't like the feel of their automatics.
I would not hesitate to buy a Taurus/Sable, they are a lot of bang for the buck.
I currently have a KIA Spectra, which I bought after a drive-off vs. the Hyundai Elantra and the Suzuki SX4 sedan. All three are very good products, very stable and solid. The Kia/Hyundai (same engine and trannie) seem to have a bit more mid range torque. I like the front quarter windows in the Suzuki, which give a real boost to forward vision, and I believe the new Suzukis have nav as standard on all SX4, hatch and sedan.
A friend suggested I also consider a Civic, since he likes his Accord so much. I've owned several Accords, all of them good but not great cars. Prior to 2003, there was little torque to be found south of 3500 rpm.
I went to the local Honda dealer to check out the Civics, but the salesman was so full of B$ that he was a joke of stereotypical proportions. I have far too much experience in buying cars to tolerate the same old Honda salesman pitch that "Hondas never break, all we do is oil changes in our shop!", "There's only a couple hundred dollars markup in these, so we sell them all at sticker."
I left.
I later had an opportunity to drive my aunt's 07 Civic hybrid, and it rode like a buckboard. The gadgetry was fun, but I see no need for a modern car to ride like it has axles mounted solidly to the frame, and 100-psi tires.
My Spectra is a real pleasure to drive, it's solid as a rock at any speed up to 100, it practically drives itself, and I like its minimalist feel. It has sufficient but not extraordinary power, its shift points are properly programmed (my 01 Accord four shifted out of 2nd at 65, leaving you high and dry with no power in some merging situations).
I'd probably also be comfortable with a Rio or the Hyundai equivalent.
I don't have ABS or stability control, this is my first non-abs car in a long time. The brakes are dialed in quite nicely, I could not get anything to lock up on dry pavement, and I'm pretty comfortable sans-abs. It makes you a little more wary because you don't have a foolproof system to back up your judgement.
I try to read traffic carefully, watch for the erratic and distracted, and utilize preactions as opposed to relying on reactions.
I'd drive a few cars, trying to put aside my historical biases. I never would have imagined I'd buy a KIA, up to a few weeks before I bought this one in March. At twelve grand+ for a brand new car, it was an incredible buy.
There really aren't any junkers out there, just cars that have varying levels of a goodness of fit for each individual.
edit: Waiting for a new, improved model can be a problem. It depends on how much has changed mechanically, or if there are just some body, suspension, and systems tweaks.
One thing I've found over the years is there generally are big bargains to be found in the last year of production. Manufacturers and dealers are willing to bargain, and after four or five years all the bugs are gone from the line. Not always so with a new model.
Last edited by Dwatted Wabbit; 12-01-2008 at 10:39 PM..
Reason: edit
I've done a little research on the new Subaru. (Googled it and read one or two articles).
They are planning mostly cosmetic changes, and they anticipate that the new look will be "polarizing". I saw a picture and I didn't like it.
But they are also improving their engine. They are making it more powerful and they are designing it so sit lower, creating an even lower center of gravity. They are also working to improve emissions and fuel economy.
Ford Fusion, Mercury Milan, and Lincoln MKZ are all based on the same platform related to the Mazda 6 and all offer an AWD option. The Ford Taurus, Mercury Sable, and Lincoln MKS all offer AWD and all are based upon the same platform as the Volvo S80. I believe their 6 cylinder is similiar to the one offered in the new Mazda 6. I'm not endorsing them, just saying that's what's available. We don't get snow around here so except for some trucks and SUVs I don't see many AWD vehicles. Except for my first car, all my cars have been FWD. Oh, and on the Kia Spectra, I love the Spectra5. It's a slightly bigger version of the Protege' 5 which was a good looking wagon.
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