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Well, Paul said (in Ephesians 4:11-14) that when Jesus Christ established His Church he gave us "apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors and teachers." He explained the purpose behind this organizational structure and said that it was essential that it exist until we all came into a unity of our faith, understanding and knowledge of the gospel of Jesus Christ. Then he specifically cautioned that without it, we would be like "children, tossed to and fro, and carried about with every wind of doctrine, by the sleight of men, and cunning craftiness, whereby they lie in wait to deceive." To me, he was saying that without the leadership of men called by God to act on His behalf, we are in danger of being misled, that we can be persuaded by crafty men to believe doctrines that are not of God at all, and will have a difficult time being able to distinguish between what is true and what is false. When you look at what happened during the first couple of centuries after Christ's apostles died, it appears that he was right.
It seems the simple simple breadcrumbs left by Jesus were disturbed by Paul.
Didn't the simple breadcrumbs become kinda complicated?
What I just read in your post was complicated to me anyway.
It seems the simple simple breadcrumbs left by Jesus were disturbed by Paul.
Some people do feel that way. I tend not to hold Paul responsible. I think the "disturbance" took place after he was gone. He did predict it, after all -- on numerous occasions.
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Didn't the simple breadcrumbs become kinda complicated?
Oddly, I think some of them became overly complicated and others overly simplified.
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What I just read in your post was complicated to me anyway.
I'm sorry (and surprised) to hear that. Is there some part of what I said that I can clarify?
So stupid, so backwards and ignorant that we need saviors, masters, avatars, teachers
sent to this 3rd Dimension to leave breadcrumbs for us to find our way Home?
Spirituality has such broad definitions and can mean anything to anyone. As already noted, do we actually need it? Is introspection not merely inner thoughts and ramblings while we are awake?
People relate to gurus who say stuff that resonates with these personal thoughts but none of that actually proves anything except that more than one person has similar ideas.
This is born of the concept that we somehow must have some divine purpose to life, a presupposition that has no merit.
The cycle of life is simple, we are born, we live, reproduce and then we die. Anything outside of that is extra twaddle and life is what we make of it with the cards we are dealt.
So stupid, so backwards and ignorant that we need saviors, masters, avatars, teachers
sent to this 3rd Dimension to leave breadcrumbs for us to find our way Home?
Whassup with that?
It seems out of character for you to call your fellow man stupid, backwards and ignorant.
It also seems out of character for me to sit here telling you that I'm not that pessimistic about my fellow man.
It seems the simple simple breadcrumbs left by Jesus were disturbed by Paul.
A different way to put it would be that the bread crumbs that the anonymous authors of Matthew, Mark and Luke attributed to Jesus are different from the ones that Paul attributed to Jesus. And come to think of it, the authors of Matthew, Mark and Luke claim various contradictory things for their particular Jesuses as well.
Too bad Jesus didn't leave any breadcrumbs himself. Strange, too, if he really thought it was important enough for the rest of us to follow them.
It seems out of character for you to call your fellow
man stupid, backwards and ignorant.
It also seems out of character for me to sit here telling you that I'm not
that pessimistic about my fellow man.
Not really out of character, mordie, bec I have always said, for ex, that the Old Test is a lot
of made up stories by primitive minds...not that they could help it mind you.
(Early primitive minds did the best they could thinking an earthquake was,
"God in sky mad, let's kill goat to make happy...")
When a modern man blames another person for their problems...that is from ignorance,
When it is ourselves, our thinking and our beliefs that brought that into our sphere
in the first place. And yes, mass national thought can bring on a nation's problems...for those
Trade Tower posts that will be brought up.
Even Natalie Sudman*, bombed in Irag, understood it was not the "fault" of the person
who placed the bomb...she didn't blame "God" either...or any concept of the Creator...
No blame. She 'got' why and how the whole thing could have happened.
She now has one eye...she is not blaming anyone.
Now, SHE, is leaving breadcrumbs of wisdom for us to follow to peace and understanding.
* From her book, "Application of Impossible Things".
I do follow many things Paul said, don't get me wrong.
And I'm not a scholar that has studied him or could hold my end in
any discussion about his words.
I also think that his letters to his particular 1st c audience was (probably) very necessary...a lot
of confusions back then...ask Constantine!! Ha! This faction and that faction, all following Christ in
their own way...
It was pretty nutty for society to handle.
I think the messages, guidance (breadcrumbs) that Jesus left were so simple.
Ask, believe, receive. Do not worry about your shelter or clothing.
And if you believe, look, you can even be more powerful than known
Physical "Laws". Love the Father with all your heart, mind and soul...you know
the rest of them...the Kingdom of God is within...love your neighbor as yourself , why? Because they are yourself...
What you do to the least of these you do to me, why? Because they are him, and you and me
and it's all One.
So don't judge because you have no idea what is going on anyway and you're judging yourself which is
part of the Whole, One, Father Creator.
Now Paul was pretty simple to the Phillipians...be anxious for nothing.
That I follow, so simple.
Because by design we are made carnal for survival in a carnal world. Our every reaction is predisposed toward our individual survival and well-being as an animal. Any spiritual aspirations and drives must be learned from external sources and imposed on our animal drives and nature.
Well said. I agree with this.
Our spiritual selves are hidden within our human selves, sort of blocked.
I have a friend who has a severely handicapped son, born with over 100 anamolies. He is 19 years old and wears a size 4 Toddler clothing. His body is twisted. He is blind. Part of his brain never formed and his mental capacity is the equivalent of a four-month-old. Yet, there is something about this boy that draws you to him. You can feel his spirit very strongly, and I believe that it's more evident because he does not have the physical and mental blocks to his spirit that those of us who are "normal" have.
When a modern man blames another person for their problems...that is from ignorance, When it is ourselves, our thinking and our beliefs that brought that into our sphere
in the first place. And yes, mass national thought can bring on a nation's problems...for those
Trade Tower posts that will be brought up.
I think the error is not so much ignorance as in thinking that your life is actually about you. It is not. So when someone wrongs you, it is not because they are "at fault" in the sense that they got in the way of you and your objectives and this great wrong must be redressed. Nor is it all about you in the sense that you are in control of your universe and just fell down on the job. It is all about life itself "just being", and who or what happened to intersect with and bump up against you.
I'm not saying there's nothing to recognizing that we're present too, and have a role to play, and that what we pay attention to (or not) can tend to broadly influence what we get ourselves into or expose ourselves to. But acknowledging that as anything more than a rather weak tendency leads, in my view, to a blame-the-victim mentality. Or even to the denial that there are ever victims. Which enables injustice and indifference thereto. Besides, everyone makes mistakes and misjudges things and compassion demands that we not insist they pay for all their mistakes to the last farthing.
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