I can no longer say I enjoy living here (Tucson: university, property taxes)

[mattpresley]

Originally Posted by fofinger

Well I suggest you take off before summer gets here, because if you got here in August you haven't really seen it yet.....oh and I might suggest you check out Mississippi....maybe that would be more to your liking.....don't let the door hit ya.....

Mississippi aint that bad but im still moving back to AZ. the summer here is humid but still bearable

[.45acp]

This is the Sonora Desert... not just the sand that surrounds the mall. It has it's own history and culture. Obviously not 'your' history and culture. It gets hot... I've registered 124F here on the plateau several days in a row with the highest of 130 some forty years ago in Yuma. The landscape to many of you Yankee transplants is alien as the moon. You neither understand nor accept the unique beauty of the desert. Most of you live in 'pavement'. You cannot (or refuse to) acclimate to the culture and the geography. I see that in your mannerisms and mode of dress. I'm a native Marylander... and I'll never go back to that. Not to visit... not for anything. The state is so hoplessly flawed it will never recover. Having served twenty years + in the Navy, I've been all over the US and all over the world for that matter. You neo-diversitites have no clue what diversity is about... if it doesn't include those who dress, think and share your own skewed belief system. That's not diversity... it's cookie-cutter mentality. Many of you will never be satified in any environment. You are the drifters. To the permanent locals... you will forever remain an annoyance. You will always view the 'locals' as something inferior... because you will never assimilate. You are certain of your superiority in all things. This is my Arizona. I live in an Open Range area among those sagueros posted previously. I watch the wild things come 'n go... A golden eagle this morning... the coyotes yippin' at dusk... a gray wolf howl now 'n then... lizards when it's warm. I suspect most of you are townies... city people. You don't appreciate this area... You've never bothered to look. One more thing... Arizona is about the most gun friendly state left. The 2A is actually recognized here. 'Always has been. But... if you don't like it here... please leave. Take your attitudes, politics and 'diversity' with you.

[teecher]

I agree that many of the kids in this state graduate with inflated grades. Most can't even write a decent sentence in English.

However, where would you move to? At least you have a job for now and can enjoy the mild weather...it's only going to get worse.

One thing that many Northerners do once they get here is expect the desert to be cool with oasis of green grass, just like you have "back home." This is the Southwest and people who move here have to realize that green grass, cool days and ample running water belong back East and not here.

[R_Cowgirl]

Originally Posted by psulions2007

It is a regional thing. I grew up in the southeast (FL), and interacted with many graduates of schools in PA, NJ, MD, NY, and OH. There is no comparison to the lack of quality education that is here in AZ. Keep in mind that I'm also not just talking about people who don't go to college....look at this section of an email I and the professor I TA for received last night in regards to a class:

------------
I alao want to apoligixe to pro <removed>, WHaen I spoke to himw I was wearinf
the clothes I has on the night before. When I got home from the bars I GOT A
CALL (Night before clas) frim my brother and was told that not only he died
but he wanted me ti make a speech at his funeral. So in short sorry for my poor
demeaner and for looking like <inaudible> or someone who was up all night writting his
speech. Anywya Ill be back mext class. I have to look on the syllbus for your
office gours bec i would like to have a do over and talk about some wether and
climate. I look forwad to it
--------------

This is someone who was accepted to the UofA and is a student there. This was not a student-student conversation, but a student-professor-TA conversation. Also, this is far from the first time I have encountered this in AZ....however, AZ was the first time I ever encountered this.

I'd put money on it that the student in question TEXTED his comments on his Blackberry... And how many of US could afford a $500 toy to carry with us to class when we were in college?

IMHO it isn't just AZ, it's all over. Teachers in the first grade all the way through college should require 1) ALL phones and texting toys be put in a bin by the door when you enter the room. 2) ALL students MUST read at least 8 books per school year to move on to the next grade level. 3) Parent Teacher conferences need to emphasize home discipline and reading.

If you don't teach your kids reading, you don't teach them to think, spell, put sentences together, see the world from a wider perspective. If you don't teach self-discipline, you are ripping them off. Parents need to help their kids learn self control, critical thinking, consciousness and consideration of other people -- basic common sense civility. It isn't happening.

TV and movies have taken the place of our teachers. And when you look at Hollyweird, realize THOSE screenwriters (who wrote the drivel our kids watch) are terrible parents! Either they create a Leave it to Beaver type show like the Cosby's --which is impossible to emulate, OR they create some brat show like 90210 or Degrassi, where they are teaching our kids to be meaner to each other than kids naturally are. Movies like "Clueless" probably accurately reflect the Hollywood stereotype of a teenager. But I have to wonder how many kids outside Hollywood would emulate that if they didn't get constant "instruction" on how to act badly from TV.

When we abdicated our responsibilities at home, we reaped the whirlwind of insanity we see now in our schools. We need a new model. We need to get kids reading again so their imaginations and communication skills will be developed. We need to address these electronic invasions of the school room. We need to find ways to support teachers and education and get back to basics. Foreign schools are kicking our butts because they pay attention to education. It's no wonder your support call winds up in Bangalore!

The opportunity of the economic malaise may well be that our kids learn what it is to go without. (I LOVE the "turn off the TV" week they did at my kids school!) Too many kids think a car at 16, a blackberry in the 3rd grade, a ride to school, online cheat sheets for every test, and every little latest trend their hearts desire is their birth right. My generation really messed this one up! Let's fix it before it's too late!

How? Volunteer at your neighborhood school. Take one hour a week and offer to read to the first graders or the after school program. Donate books and magazines to school libraries. Join Junior Achievement or support it with money. Give your kid's teacher $100 for supplies just out of the blue (you'd be surprised how much these underpaid teachers pay for out of their own pockets!!!)

I was collecting those small jars of honey and jelly you get on the airplane. I washed and donated them to the kindergarten class in a school near here. I also gave them all my old magazines for art projects. When I was at Costco they had some deals on cleaning rags. I added that to the donation. Schools can use ANYTHING! Paper towels, art supplies, soap, magazines, books, old shirts can be used for art smocks, old t-shirts can be decorated by the kids, your old tupperware without lids can be used for all sorts of things. Your old book case, plastic buckets, who knows?

Obviously you want to check first. But don't toss things without checking. If we all did a little to help the schools, they might not feel so abandoned and may feel a little motivated to do better. We all are better off when the next generation (who will some day be running this state and country) are better educated!

[R_Cowgirl]

oh -and one more thing... how do we know the student in question graduated from an AZ high school? We have students here from all over the world. So using the example above as bad education in AZ is a specious argument. It's just bad... that's all. Texting has destroyed the English language and the art of writing.

[Nelly Nomad]

I'm not from AZ, don't live in AZ now and, matter of fact, I've never even BEEN to AZ, so I have no dog in this particular fight. However, I have moved a lot and have sometimes ended up in places I wasn't very happy with. Just like any relationship, it's not until you're committed and living together that you really know the other party. So, when I saw the OP's thread-title, I was intrigued and decided to read further.

Please note, I didn't read all the posts in the thread but this one jumped out at me because it addressed a particular bugaboo of mine -- poor writing skills:

Originally Posted by psulions2007

...look at this section of an email I and the professor I TA for received last night in regards to a class:

------------
I alao want to apoligixe to pro <removed>, WHaen I spoke to himw I was wearinf
the clothes I has on the night before. When I got home from the bars I GOT A
CALL (Night before clas) frim my brother and was told that not only he died
but he wanted me ti make a speech at his funeral. So in short sorry for my poor
demeaner and for looking like <inaudible> or someone who was up all night writting his
speech. Anywya Ill be back mext class. I have to look on the syllbus for your
office gours bec i would like to have a do over and talk about some wether and
climate. I look forwad to it
--------------

This is someone who was accepted to the UofA...

Please note the part in red. Now, far be it from me to excuse poor writing but I'm wondering if there may be extenuating circumstances in this student's case. Perhaps s/he was still in shock and typing while crying. Perhaps s/he knew the email needed to be done and simply wanted to get it over with. No proofreading, no editing, just type and hit SEND.

Or perhaps the author was drunk. S/he indicated s/he goes to the bars. Perhaps s/he wrote this email after a night of bar-hopping.

Of course, I could be totally off-base but I just wanted to throw that out as a possibility. Surely most college students have more skills than the excerpt above displays?

[Gwen r.]

There is absolutly no way you can compare Arizona to any other state in the country.We have our downfalls like any where else, but where else can you hike a mountian carrying your gun and survive such a prickly harsh terrain? Yet in less then
30 mins. be back inside the cool air conditoning sipping on a refreshing glass of iced tea? You really have to live in the desert for some time before you can learn to enjoy the pure bueaty of it.

[psulions2007]

Originally Posted by Gwen r.

There is absolutly no way you can compare Arizona to any other state in the country.We have our downfalls like any where else, but where else can you hike a mountian carrying your gun and survive such a prickly harsh terrain? Yet in less then
30 mins. be back inside the cool air conditoning sipping on a refreshing glass of iced tea? You really have to live in the desert for some time before you can learn to enjoy the pure bueaty of it.

The negatives far outweigh the positives here, and that is why I am moving within the next 2-3 months.

Personally, I couldn't care less about hiking a mountain with a gun, and I hate the 'prickly, harsh terrain'.

[azhiker]

Originally Posted by psulions2007

The negatives far outweigh the positives here

I don't doubt that that is true for you. Certainly not so for those of us who like it here. I don't know you from Adam, except from what you post here, but you seem truly unhappy here in Tucson from what I've read, so I'm happy you're able to leave.

Many of us like it quite well here, but it all boils down to personal preference. There's really no right or wrong about it.

[sickofIL]

The negatives far outweigh the positives here,

Again like so many others this is just your opinion. Everyone is entitled to their own. That doesn't make Tucson bad it just isn't what you like.