Evolution question of the day (preacher, genesis, America, bible)
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As usual, a quick review of C34's authoritative commentary yields now-predictable results:
We'll start with:
Our oldest texts and religious writings - from the Bible to the Vedic scripts - all speak of a golden age when our earliest forebears dwelt in utopian bliss before losing their way and suffering annihilation in a worldwide catastrophe. In a stunning reappraisal of the sacred texts of antiquity, Ian Lawton uncovers what he believes is the key to deciphering the true origins of our antediluvian ancestors.
The comparative history community has for some years argued over who this forgotten race may be and high-profile books such as Graham Hancock's Fingerprints of the Gods and Andrew Collins' Gateway to Atlantis have found a huge audience who are prepared to look beyond the orthodoxy. Lawton argues that the evolution of the modern human race received its most supreme cultural impetus around 100,000 years ago, when the first advanced souls incarnated in human form - giving a philosophical interpretation of the universal stories of fallen angels.
With chapters on mythology, evolution, archaeology, geology and science, this scholarly work bravely combines history and philosophy to spectacular effect. The result is a groundbreaking book that will change not only the way we look at the past, but even more so the future.
(from his own website, quickly Googled, BTW). Mr. Collins book and commentary, captured below, refutes all the Atlantis-as-a-Civilization evidence, rather than suporting it, as some would have you SELECTIVELY believe. his biography:
"Andrew Collins was born in 1957. He is a historical writer and the author of a number of books that challenge the way we think about our relationship to the past. Andrew is also a regular lecturer and conference organiser on a variety of inter-related topics.
In 1985 he began investigating the idea of an advanced civilisation having existed before recorded history. This study resulted in the publication during 1996 of his highly acclaimed work FROM THE ASHES OF ANGELS.
It argues that Old Testament encounters between angels and human kind are in fact but memories of the trafficking between two separate cultures, each at a different stage of evolution. The book also sets out for the first time the geographical location of the biblical land of Eden and the events surrounding the flood of Noah and the fall of the angels.
"(Get that? "encounters between angels and human kind are in fact but memories")
It was followed by the publication two years later of Andrew's next book GODS OF EDEN, which argues that the genesis of civilisation was catalysed by the arrival in the Near East, the site of ancient Eden, of priest-shamans from the Nile Valley. It also details the existence and possible science of sound technology in the ancient world.
Andrew's current book, GATEWAY TO ATLANTIS, takes a radical new look at the age-old mystery of Plato's lost island kingdom.
rflmn's note: He speaks here from a realist's perspective, from his own Lecture: (my highlights in maroon...)
(In case you don't or won't see it, he's refuting the entire Atlantis and under-Earth or under-water civilization fantasies! Read carefully)
“However, reports of the supposed discovery of an Atlantean Temple off the tiny island of Bimini led me to explore the Bahaman link to the mystery. Sadly, this report turned out to be nothing more than a confused story regarding quarry blocks used either as ship's ballast and deposited by a ship-wreck off Moselle Shoals, some 8 miles north of Bimini, or to make sea-walls and jetties off the Miami coast (however, I can't say I didn't enjoy finding this out!). Despite this set-back, I began investigating the Bahaman connection to Atlantis, and quickly found that the entire scene was dominated by one name - Edgar Cayce. During the 1930s, America's 'sleeping prophet' predicted that portions of Atlantis would appear off Bimini in 1968/1969.”
rflmn's editorial add: C34, haven't you relied on Cayce's commentary in the past? Yes you have, by golly! Well, back to Mr. Collins' commentary....
“What seems more important, however, is the knowledge that Cayce had business connections with individuals who owned estate on Bimini before he made his famous Atlantis prophecies. They invited him to the island in the hope that he might be able to find buried Spanish treasure using alleged supernatural means. He was unsuccessful in these attempts at psychic questing, and instead offered the businessmen other more ecologically sound methods of raising capital from the natural resources of the island.”
“What quickly became clear from my own investigations into Plato's Atlantis is that the Greek philosopher had created in his writings a flawed utopian realm based on the decline of Athens' during his own age. The myth of the Ancient City of Atlantis was unquestionably a composite view of ancient city-ports such as Carthage in North Africa, seen here, Syracuse in Sicily, Ecbatana in Media and probably even Athens itself.”
“I also concluded that Plato's claim that Atlantis' destruction in one single night and day through earthquakes and floods was based on catastrophe legends told to Phoenician and Carthaginian mariners by the indigenous peoples of the Bahamas and Caribbean. They were retold to the first Spanish explorers to reach the islands, and speak of a catastrophic event involving a period of darkness, as well as an all-encompassing flood which engulfed a former great landmass, leaving behind the thousands of islands and cays which today make up these same archipelagos.
In my opinion, these stories relate to a cosmic event which occurred at the end of the last ice age and involved the creation of 500,000 elliptical craters in the eastern states of the United States. These are the so-called Carolina Bays, which are found across six states and range in size from a few hundred metres to 11 kilometres in length. The latest theories regarding their formation feature the fragmentation of a comet into literally millions of pieces which impacted a wide area, including a large part of the Atlantic Ocean off the United States, sometime between 8500 and 9000 BC.
Such an event would have caused super-tsunami waves that would have engulfed the low-lying regions of the Bahamas and Caribbean killing everything in their path. Moreover, according to Italian academic Emilio Spedicato of Bergamo University, who is with us here today, this impact event on the western Atlantic seaboard most probably catalysed the retreat of the ice sheets which had covered North America and Europe for anything up to 40,000 years. With the disappearance of the ice, the rising meltwater would have drowned the same low lying regions, now on a more permanent basis. This was the memory preserved by the indigenous peoples of the Bahamas and Caribbean and retold to ancient mariners prior to Plato's age.”
“It was against a backdrop of such ideas that Edgar Cayce, with the help of Russian born occultist Helena Petrova Blavatsky, French phililogist the Abbe Brasseur de Bourbourg and the Scottish mythologist Lewis Spence, conceived of an Atlantis that stretched from the Bahamas to the African coast, a sheer impossibilty in geological terms.”
And finally, in summation, Collins drops this summary bomb:
“No other theory fitted all the evidence. Yet the response to the publication of my book GATEWAY TO ATLANTIS was a complete eye opener, for it seemed that even after presenting this evidence for the first time a large percentage of the readers refused to even consider this solution.
rflmn's editor's note: (Welcome to C-D, Andrew!)
Since there was such a great desire to believe in Atlantis as a super continent that produced a mother civilisation of immense sophistication there was great opposition to my views.”
Ahhh yes, the power of Great Desire To Believe, eh?
Or this website by the same A. Collins, he provides a facinating review of established evidence-supported theory, coupled with visible impact evidence for something that vastly precluded the YEC-mandated timeline, and explains much of what has since been found. Talk about disrupting evolutionary timelines...
It could be man made alright...It could be the ruins and discards of cement, etc. from the disposed of remnants of missle silos,etc. from the 1961 Cuban crisis.
Well the problem is, the large blocks appear to be made of granit, not cement. And recent satellite photos reveal a network of what appears to be roads that extend from the location of the city all the way to the Bahamas and the Florida Keys. Also, underwater video shows that numerous blocks appear to be purposely placed on top of each other. Also Paulina Zelitsky who is the president of the Canadian-based company Advanced Digital Communication, stated that they don't believe that nature is capable of producing planned smmetrical architecture, unless it is a miracle. She stated, they are clearly man-made large-size architectural designs. She also stated, it was like flying over an urban development in a plane seeing highways, tunnels and buildings.
Also, if this was just a Cuban dump site, I'm sure Cuba's government would be aware of this.
I'm still wondering what all this has to do with evolution??????
What it would mean for evolution, is if the story of the flood in the Bible is accurate and literal and can be proven. Evolution would then be viewed more as a myth, that did not agree with the accurate Biblical account.
And that is why, when we are finding vast man-made structures thousands of feet below the oceans surface, you are getting closer to understanding that the Biblical account is true. You see, such information is not taught in the public schools, because it does not agree with todays evolution belief. So such accounts are just ignored, or science finds ways to pretend such things do not exist. Kind of like what they did with the El Toro Figurines. However, now they have to ignore these large man-made structures found deep below the sea.
reuters 18:12 03-29-02
I tried to look up the article in reuters archives but they only go back to 2007.
This is the closest I could find to the original article.
Scientists Probe Possible Sunken City Off Cuba (http://www.scribd.com/doc/11491126/Scientists-Probe-Possible-Sunken-City-Off-Cuba - broken link)
Campbell, this is also in the article.
"Recently, a French archaeologist found some evidence of people being here in South America 40,000 years ago,"
Do you believe humans were in South America 40,000 years ago?
The "structures" are most likely limestone and or jointing of a basaltic flow.
What it would mean for evolution, is if the story of the flood in the Bible is accurate and literal and can be proven. Evolution would then be viewed more as a myth, that did not agree with the accurate Biblical account.
No it will not. This does not deflect to a default of godunnit. If there is something to observe and study, the conclusion will come after the study, not like you folk want it done.
Quote:
And that is why, when we are finding vast man-made structures thousands of feet below the oceans surface, you are getting closer to understanding that the Biblical account is true.
You assume they are man-made, that has not yet been proven, appear is the operative word. It still would not prove a global flood as we have ice cores dating back 750,000 years and that alone blows your flood out of the water.
Quote:
You see, such information is not taught in the public schools, because it does not agree with todays evolution belief. So such accounts are just ignored, or science finds ways to pretend such things do not exist. However, now they have to ignore these large man-made structures found deep below the sea.
Well I googled American school science curriculum and came up empty handed.
Evolution is not a belief. There are many facts to support it. Your creation crap is a belief as it is not supported by anything other than lame deflections to non scientific stuff just like this latest offering of yours.
How about those Ice cores, this is about the 15th time I have asked. A flood would float and melt that ice. Oh and BTW, we talk of ice cores all around the world but the Antarctic is the one with the greatest age.
How about those Ice cores, this is about the 15th time I have asked. A flood would float and melt that ice. Oh and BTW, we talk of ice cores all around the world but the Antarctic is the one with the greatest age.
That's a good point and Antarctica has such little precipitation that it's considered to be a desert. It's ridiculous to think that ice from all over the world wouldn't melt in a global flood and even more ridiculous to think that if they didn't melt that they'd land in exactly the same polar regions that they floated away from after the flood waters receded. And of course if they just melted there wouldn't be enough time for new thick levels of ice to accumulate particularly in Antarctica in just a few thousand years. Just one more glaring reason why Noah's flood is fiction.
reuters 18:12 03-29-02
I tried to look up the article in reuters archives but they only go back to 2007.
This is the closest I could find to the original article.
Scientists Probe Possible Sunken City Off Cuba (http://www.scribd.com/doc/11491126/Scientists-Probe-Possible-Sunken-City-Off-Cuba - broken link)
Campbell, this is also in the article.
"Recently, a French archaeologist found some evidence of people being here in South America 40,000 years ago,"
Do you believe humans were in South America 40,000 years ago?
The "structures" are most likely limestone and or jointing of a basaltic flow.
I'm believe man's existance my go back to about 14,000 years.
That's a good point and Antarctica has such little precipitation that it's considered to be a desert. It's ridiculous to think that ice from all over the world wouldn't melt in a global flood and even more ridiculous to think that if they didn't melt that they'd land in exactly the same polar regions that they floated away from after the flood waters receded. And of course if they just melted there wouldn't be enough time for new thick levels of ice to accumulate particularly in Antarctica in just a few thousand years. Just one more glaring reason why Noah's flood is fiction.
Here again, the age of the Ice is assumed to be that old. Ice is not dated by counting annual layers, as some believe. And a number of assumptions much like carbon dating is required to establish such a date. However, let me provide you with a better example to show you how the age of ice can not be trusted by it's depth. In 1942 six P-38's and two B-17's had to be ditched off the east coast of Greenland because they ran out of gas. In the year 1981 members of the original crew decided to try and recover their planes. When they got to the spot were they left them, it was their belief that they would be found in a few feet of snow. Yet when they got to the spot, the planes were no where to be found. They had to return in 1988 with detection equipment, and soon discovered their planes were not in a few feet of snow, but were to be found in 260 feet of snow. Now if they were doing ice core sampling here, Im sure they would of stated that the age of the ice here was thousands of years old. Yet the 260 feet of ice had built up to that depth in just 46 years. consider link below.
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