Do Atheists believe in Justice? (religion, prayer, Creator, Universe)
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That would be called sadism, and while agreeably horrible by most of us...there are in fact scumbags who do this...else we'd never hear the stories of such deeds.
But why does it always have to be for fun? Because lots of "children" have been forced to work in labor camps, whipped/beaten, raped, etc. Those performing the actions, for the most part, had a different morality than most of us would agree with.
Its waste of time & effort to think up magical entities that have the corner market on morality. The more productive use of same time & effort would be to identify the causes of behaviors that most of us would not subjectively endorse, and then work towards remedying.
The root of such abhorrent acts are in psychology. And the more we learn about the human mind, the more we can easily explain "why" people do bad things.
The reason they add the "for fun" aspect is to distance their mass-murdering, psychopathic god from the conversation.
The very same god, of course, who ordered pregnant women's bellies to be slashed open and infants to have their heads smashed in -- among endless other abominations.
But he didn't command those atrocities for "fun." Nuh-uh. It was for very good reasons - such as, they weren't "chosen people" and therefore had to be slaughtered.
That would be called sadism, and while agreeably horrible by most of us...there are in fact scumbags who do this...else we'd never hear the stories of such deeds.
But why does it always have to be for fun? Because lots of "children" have been forced to work in labor camps, whipped/beaten, raped, etc. Those performing the actions, for the most part, had a different morality than most of us would agree with.
Its waste of time & effort to think up magical entities that have the corner market on morality. The more productive use of same time & effort would be to identify the causes of behaviors that most of us would not subjectively endorse, and then work towards remedying.
The root of such abhorrent acts are in psychology. And the more we learn about the human mind, the more we can easily explain "why" people do bad things.
This doesn't address the argument.
I am not arguing that torture and rape and murder don't exist, or why they exist but the fact that from a naturalist view, they are no more 'evil' then disinfecting your kitchen counter.
I am not arguing that torture and rape and murder don't exist, or why they exist but the fact that from a naturalist view, they are no more 'evil' then disinfecting your kitchen counter.
In a sense....agreed.
But thats because we are people with a different agenda than the average germ might have. If you were a germ...with enough cognition to understand people spraying you with bleach is bad for you...then your morality is in conflict with the people's"god" who wants them to eradicate you. Or more accurately...the people who think you are going to make them ill.
But being people, we can agree on an awful lot of morality before it gets complicated. But just because there are simple moralities we can (almost universally) agree on...doesnt mean they are objective in the strict sense of the word.
But he didn't command those atrocities for "fun." Nuh-uh. It was for very good reasons - such as, they weren't "chosen people" and therefore had to be slaughtered.
But not for fun....
yep...there is a time and place for hate, bigotry, and mass murder. But only when its for "good"...which is when (I interpret) my god says its good.
But thats because we are people with a different agenda than the average germ might have. If you were a germ...with enough cognition to understand people spraying you with bleach is bad for you...then your morality is in conflict with the people's"god" who wants them to eradicate you. Or more accurately...the people who think you are going to make them ill.
But being people, we can agree on an awful lot of morality before it gets complicated. But just because there are simple moralities we can (almost universally) agree on...doesnt mean they are objective in the strict sense of the word.
I don't think cognition affects our moral obligations. If our cognition evolved as a beneficial evolutionary trait, then it cannot attest to morality any more then if we had evolved gills or a prehensile tail. Which is why there is no objective good or evil in this view. It is only with a transcendent God can we attain a truly objective morality. Anything else is just individual taste.
I don't think cognition affects our moral obligations. If our cognition evolved as a beneficial evolutionary trait, then it cannot attest to morality any more then if we had evolved gills or a prehensile tail. Which is why there is no objective good or evil in this view. It is only with a transcendent God can we attain a truly objective morality. Anything else is just individual taste.
The reason cognition matters is because you need a certain amount to even conceptualize something like morality. Which is of course the only reason we are even able to ponder whether it is objective or subjective.
But this always confounds me with believers. What makes you think any entity thats capable of doing all that you believe they did....gwould have your best interests at heart?
But this always confounds me with believers. What makes you think any entity thats capable of doing all that you believe they did....would have your best interests at heart?
Why would it confound you? If God exists and created humanity in His own image, it was an act of love. God loves us, every single one of us as if we were the only human in existence.
If God exists, then the most important interest is not our insignificant time in this life, but our eternal destination.
Why would it confound you? If God exists and created humanity in His own image, it was an act of love. God loves us, every single one of us as if we were the only human in existence.
*chuckle* He's got a funny way of showing it quite often.
Quote:
Originally Posted by JJ_Maxx
If God exists, then the most important interest is not our insignificant time in this life, but our eternal destination.
... aaaand there's the escape clause. This life isn't significant or important. Some asserted life that is alleged to exist AFTER this one, though, god's all over THAT. How very convenient; you have a place to dispose of all the suffering and tragedy in the world that gives the lie to your sunny belief that god is in control, cares, and actually acts.
Why ISN'T this life important and significant? If god can act in some other life he can equally well act in this one. That he won't act here suggests he won't act anywhere else.
*chuckle* He's got a funny way of showing it quite often.
... aaaand there's the escape clause. This life isn't significant or important. Some asserted life that is alleged to exist AFTER this one, though, god's all over THAT. How very convenient; you have a place to dispose of all the suffering and tragedy in the world that gives the lie to your sunny belief that god is in control, cares, and actually acts.
Why ISN'T this life important and significant? If god can act in some other life he can equally well act in this one. That he won't act here suggests he won't act anywhere else.
What other way would you prefer? A world where we are all forced to be good? A world without choice? God desires for people to choose Him freely and frankly I don't blame Him. Would you want people to be forced to be your friend, your lover, your spouse? I know I wouldn't.
Why ISN'T this life important and significant? If god can act in some other life he can equally well act in this one. That he won't act here suggests he won't act anywhere else.
One could think he might not even be real with such indifference to the only life we are aware of....
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