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I think the tens of billions in miliary aid counts for something. So does the non-military support and military training.
We probably won't see US, UK, French and German forces in Ukraine, but that does not mean that Ukraine unsupported.
I agree that Western support has been great and Ukraine needs it but it is not enough so that Ukraine can take back the stolen lands. Russia stole Crimea and the Donbas regions in 2014. What did the West do? They made some noises at the UN meetings and slapped some sanctions on Russia. Meanwhile Russia treated the stolen lands as Russian lands. They created sham referendums, replaced Ukrainians with Russians and turned Ukrainian lands into Russian lands.
Because they rightly saw Russia as a continuing threat.
Because a number of USSR republics and Warsaw Pact countries thought the same way and asked for alliance as a preventative measure against invasion.
Because it reduces the chances of smaller wars between independent European nations and promotes being between NATO members as well.
Because the countries involved are sovereign and can do as they wish.
Because NATO is a defensive/deterrent alliance, and has never initiated military action against anybody.
This is aside from all of your misrepresentations about doubling of size (incorrect); same powers invading and occupying countries (mostly incorrect).
But I have mentioned this to you before and you have ignored it. You seem not interested in the answers to your questions.
Threat to who? Us ? Thanks for the laugh. Should we militarize to China's borders because you feel they are a threat? Is that your foreign policy.
Anybody can ask to join NATO, they want to get funds. The problem is the U.S (the side of deciding)for accepting making the region and globe unstable. It makes no sense in accepting those countries in a military nuclear alliance made for the main reason to be anti-Russia if you want peace in the globe.
"Because U.S/ NATO is a defensive/deterrent alliance, and has never initiated military action against anybody????" Say again? Are you joking?
I'm not going back and forth with a person that swears in this forum that the U.S/NATO has never initiated military action against anybody and then accuse me of misrepresentations. What a joke.
Last edited by SanJuanStar; 03-01-2023 at 08:23 PM..
Yea Russia was mad they lost their puppet so they decided to destabilize the country. Standard Russian MO.
Just like the flood of nonsense and counter reality claims is standard Russian propaganda MO. Firehose of falsehood.
And what "stabilization" is, according to you?
So the Nationalists overthrow the legitimate government, democratically elected and voted for overwhelmingly by the South-East of the country, and everyone is supposed to shut up and put up with it, and if not - they will be killed and bombed into the ground?
No. ABC reported it correctly. You are the one who misrepresented the article.
ABC stated that a soldier in Bakhmut told them that the average life expectancy on the front lines was 4 hours. They did not state that this was an accurate assessment, they did not provide additional evidence to support this assertion, and they did no analysis on whether this could be a reasonable assessment.
All in all, much more of a human interest puff piece than serious journalism, and I would never cite it to support a point. The fact that you did just illustrates that you do not have serious standards of evidence.
So, ABC News writes puff pieces? I said that ABC News reported that the average survival time of a Ukrainian soldier is four hours. That is a fact. I did not misrepresent anything. The information came from a soldier as they had said. The information has to come from somewhere. ABC News would not have reported it if it was not credible and if they did not take that seriously. This was not a puff piece but serious journalism by ABC News. There is no other way to look at it.
Here are some other news outlets that report the same. They would not be reporting it if they considered that this was fluff and not true. None of the outlets claimed that the soldier's story was exaggerated or false.
Again, serious reporting by professional news organizations. Unless you consider ABC News, the New York Post, Business Insider, IBTimes, USSA News, The Express, and The Sun to be Putin-loving propaganda outlets.
Last edited by BusinessManIT; 03-01-2023 at 08:30 PM..
Because they rightly saw Russia as a continuing threat.
Because a number of USSR republics and Warsaw Pact countries thought the same way and asked for alliance as a preventative measure against invasion.
Because it reduces the chances of smaller wars between independent European nations and promotes being between NATO members as well.
Because the countries involved are sovereign and can do as they wish.
Because NATO is a defensive/deterrent alliance, and has never initiated military action against anybody.
This is aside from all of your misrepresentations about doubling of size (incorrect); same powers invading and occupying countries (mostly incorrect).
But I have mentioned this to you before and you have ignored it. You seem not interested in the answers to your questions.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SanJuanStar
Threat to who? Us ? Thanks for the laugh. Should we militarize to China's borders because you feel they are a threat? Is that your foreign policy.
Anybody can ask to join NATO, they want to get funds. The problem are the U.S (the side of deciding)for accepting making the region and globe unstable. It makes no sense in accepting those countries in a military nuclear alliance made for the main reason to be anti-Russia if you want peace in the globe.
"Because U.S/ NATO is a defensive/deterrent alliance, and has never initiated military action against anybody????" Say again? Are you joking?
I'm not going back and forth with a person that swears in this forum that the U.S/NATO has neverinitiated military action against anybody and then accuse me of misrepresentations. What a joke.
Readers should take note that SanJuanStar is deceptively quoting me as saying "U.S./NATO", which I absolutely did not. Looks like SJS cannot actually reply to my post without lying.
The USA is not the equivalent of NATO, and I never stated or implied that it was. When I stated that NATO had never initiated military action, that was and is true. This is not true of the USA, which has initiated military action many times.
I am quite happy for a liar like yourself not to respond to my posts. I engage honestly, it is unfortunate that you choose not to do likewise.
Readers should take note that SanJuanStar is deceptively quoting me as saying "U.S./NATO", which I absolutely did not. Looks like SJS cannot actually reply to my post without lying.
The USA is not the equivalent of NATO, and I never stated or implied that it was. When I stated that NATO had never initiated military action, that was and is true. This is not true of the USA, which has initiated military action many times.
I am quite happy for a liar like yourself not to respond to my posts. I engage honestly, it is unfortunate that you choose not to do likewise.
U.S. is NATO. Without the U.S. there is NO NATO. Damn are you serious?
The benefits of NATO membership include more than just security benefits and collective defense but also disaster relief, humanitarian aid, and scientific collaboration through the NATO Science for Peace and Security Program.
The smaller countries wants handouts by the bigger countries in NATO. Ukraine and that former comedian running the country is a perfect example. You think all of them wants to join because then love western democracy.
I'm not going back and forth with a person that swears in this forum that the U.S/NATO has never initiated military action against anybody and then accuse me of misrepresentations. What a joke.
Well, that resolution ^^^^ didn't last long. 37 minutes from when you swore off responding to me and your next post replying.
Quote:
Originally Posted by SanJuanStar
U.S. is NATO. Without the U.S. there is NO NATO. Damn are you serious?
The benefits of NATO membership include more than just security benefits and collective defense but also disaster relief, humanitarian aid, and scientific collaboration through the NATO Science for Peace and Security Program.
The smaller countries wants handouts by the bigger countries in NATO. Ukraine and that former comedian running the country is a perfect example. You think all of them wants to join because then love western democracy.
Yeysk, Russia, 150 KM from the front lines has been hit by a Ukrainian kamikaze drone. It was evidently hit hard doing a lot of damage. Part of the attack is on video.
Yeysk is home to SU-34.
My posts are not for you but you read 'em. Try again. What was that again, the U.S. and NATO are 2 different things?
Sure are. Lets take a look at your own statement:
Quote:
Originally Posted by SanJuanStar
U.S. is NATO. Without the U.S. there is NO NATO. Damn are you serious?
The benefits of NATO membership include more than just security benefits and collective defense but also disaster relief, humanitarian aid, and scientific collaboration through the NATO Science for Peace and Security Program.
The smaller countries wants handouts by the bigger countries in NATO. Ukraine and that former comedian running the country is a perfect example. You think all of them wants to join because then love western democracy.
So, your claim is that US and NATO are equivalent. But you also state that the smaller countries want to join in order to gain handouts. The implication is that smaller countries are taking advantage of the USA.
If the USA and NATO were the same thing, benefits would derive to the US, not the smaller countries.
Oh, and NATO governance is obviously not US only. All member countries participate, and the alliance works on a veto system, so Estonia has just as much influence in some types of decisionmaking as does the USA.
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