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Why should I respect someone who got shot while attacking and beating someone?
you don't no what happened.
How would you feel if it was your kid.
Zimmerman is a grown ass man, The kid simply went to the store to get Iced Tea and skittles. Zimmermans prejudiced led him to follow the kid and kill him.
That is the stupid thing about SYG. That is something extraneous to the information that is NOT contested.
what we know:
1. Z followed M when told not to
2. Struggle occurred
3. Z shot and killed M
now just knowing this does that sound like SYG applies to you?
I think not. We need more facts. The facts need to be tried and a ruling be given by a judge or jury. Like I said SYG gives the defendant immunity from prosecution, so how would SYG apply in your case?
The police didn't even interview witnesses, how are they to know who cooled off and who accelerated/ flamed the fire, and whether or not Z had the right to stand his ground. I mean there is too much leeway given to the police. Are they gonna just take the word of the defendent?
If I don't like my neighbor can I just corner him on the street, start an altercation and when things heat up can I just shoot him and say I had a right to stand my ground??? BS!!!!!
Fact of the matter is a trial of the matter needs to be done, which means it is regular self defense and not SYG. And that is what the family has been seeking in the first place- that someone is tried for the killing of their son. The MOm even concedes that it may have been a mistake and that Z might not be a bad man, but common, an unarmed Boy just walking gets killed and no trial??? BS
The biggest fact of all: Trayvon would have been alive if Zimmerman was not stalking him
I always want to say this. If you think your feeble mind can remotely compare to those lawyers who wrote the law, you are seriously think too high of yourself.
The SYG law, actually, just a self-defense law has been written a long time ago and has accumulated millions of test cases. It's well established in our legal systems and thoroughly tested.
If you say SYG gives immunity for prosecution, well, we are immune to prosecution if we aren't doing anything wrong anyway.
Before SYG, assume Martin threw the first punch, Zimmerman would be required to turn around and run if he could do so safely. If he didn't, then he would be prosecuted for manslaughter. After SYG, he didn't have to run - he could choose to run but not necessarily. He could throw a punch back to match Martin's force with force. He couldn't shoot him just because of being punched in the face - I would personally disagree but in the eyes of the court, we can't do that yet. Now, once Zimmerman was pinned down and his head was smashing the concrete, justification for deadly force became apparent.
On important factor that many ignore is this happened in a gated community where Zimmerman has a right to be. Of course, it would matter that much if it were public street but does give Zimmerman more leeway.
Following someone is not a crime, particularly in a gated community. It won't be seen as provocation either. This actually negates any legitimacy of Martin's use of any force whatsoever.
Unless the prosecution team can prove Zimmerman killed Martin on purpose, they don't have a case for murder. At best, they can convict him for manslaughter. I personally don't see that happening either but under political pressure, weird things do happen.
That is the stupid thing about SYG. That is something extraneous to the information that is NOT contested.
what we know:
1. Z followed M when told not to
2. Struggle occurred
3. Z shot and killed M
Exactly. Also, whether people call it stalking, hunting, following or just being nosy, several people heard shouting between 2 people before the shooting. To me that means Zimmerman had to be behind the buildings where he shot Martin, not on the way back to his vehicle. Just my opinion.
The convoluted logic used on this board so much is that Zimmerman was acting as a private citizen and, therefore, had more rights than a neighborhood watch captain. I do not want to keep dwelling on this, but every time I point out that the NW rules for this community (there is a brochure in .pdf format) and every other in Florida and elsewhere, clearly state that nobody should ever assume police authority or pursue a "suspect." So automatically, when we learned that George was only running errands that evening and not acting as a NW volunteer, some people assume it means he had more rights as a private citizen. This makes no sense.
Then we keep hearing that, as a private citizen, he had every right to follow anyone. Doesn't the same apply to the victim? As a private citizen, doesn't someone who is being followed have the right to protect himself?
Also, why are so many failing to consider the 11 year age difference? A 17 year old should not be held to the same standard as a 28 year old when it comes to reasoning. I'm not saying that, had Zimmerman been 19 or 20, he would be any less innocent or guilty, only that an adult should at least have more common sense than a high school student. Still, I am quite sure that, had Zimmerman been killed, Trayvon Martin would have a lot of explaining to do, even though Martin was unarmed and Zimmerman was.
what we know:
1. Z followed M when told not to
2. Struggle occurred
3. Z shot and killed MThe biggest fact of all: Trayvon would have been alive if Zimmerman was not stalking him
Facts NOT in evidence with ANY withnesses.
Don't forget that while on the phone to 911 Zimmerman said Trayvon ran off and that he would go back to the car to meet the police.
(Of course YOU ALWAYS ask the police to come if you intent to do a crime).
On the way back Trayvon appeared again, managed to break Zimmerman's nose, have witnesses say trayvon was swinging on Zimmerman on his back, and lastly Trayvon was shot dead when Z had no where to withdraw and felt his life was at risk.
There is no evidence supporting anything else.
Yes, but even if what "John" the anonymous witness says is true, that he saw the struggle and said "Stop, I'm calling 911" why isn't there a 911 call saying "I was outside and saw a man on top of another man and he's banging his head into the sidewalk" or something of that nature? People are assuming that one of the several 911 calls that were available on the Sanford Police web site (I listed to all of them) was from this person. Maybe, maybe not. However, not one of them said anything close to "I was just outside and..." The call that everyone says is John only says that there are 2 men fighting and then he hears a shot. He said "I'm not going outside." Where does he say that he was already outside?
So many people defending Zimmerman say this "new witness" said Trayvon Martin was on top. Okay, he did tell that to a reporter the next day. In fact, he said he passed by them fighting and went inside, locked the door, and then called 911. I saw this on a local news channel. What was surprising is that the reporter who talked to "John" was walking on the grass and there was no crime scene tape or anything to indicate a boy had been shot.
I listened to the calls, not edited calls, but the original 911 calls, and NOBODY called the police and said he was outside and saw a fight and ran inside to make a call or describe clothing colors, etc.
Well, the next hearing is scheduled for August 8th at 8:30 am, unless discovery documents are uploaded via the Seminole|Brevard County 18th Circuit Court website all discussions regarding this case will remain speculative, so I guess it's round and round we go...
I guess that it never occur to you that zimmerman could have thrown the first punch. Just because someone who loses a fight does not mean that they did not start it
So, Z's testimony doesn't matter? TM is dead and the ony thing we have to go by is Z's account and witnesses accounts, so what do we do?
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