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Show me a 400 sq ft house on a 2500 sq ft piece of land - that's not in a remote location.
Best I can do is 592 square feet on a 2500 square foot lot in the heart of the SF Bay Area in Oakland CA... it was my first purchase and I still have it today.
Wow. Some real snobs in this thread and some real whiners.
1) Not everyone who rents is a low life scum bag who doesn't work hard. Some of us LIKE renting for many of the reasons that have been listed: a) no out of pocket expenses for repairs b) not all of the responsibility c) can up and move whenever d) far less manual labor e) it's actually cheaper than owning a home and since we cannot rely on homes to be a "path to wealth", homeowners do not always come out on top. By the way, you CAN paint your walls whatever color you want in a rental, just as long as you paint them back before you leave. I know, I've done it. Several times. In one instance, they liked the colors so much, they asked me NOT to paint them back to boring white.
2) You CAN afford a home in many areas of this country, but you're not going to own a home for $75,000 in places like NY, LA, San Fran, Miami, Seattle, etc...unless you live in a really bad part of town, and even then it's almost impossible. What you "want" and what you can "get" are often two totally different things - and that happens everywhere in life. I "want" a Mercedes 560 SL convertible, I'm probably never going to actually get one. Do I blame the big banks? Do I blame government? Do I blame those who DID or CAN get one? Whose fault is it that I can't get one? Is it the OP's fault? Is it the fault of the poster above me? You just aren't going to get everything that you want in life. And no, no one OWES it to you.
3) The fact of the matter is, there are times when the economy sucks and it IS harder for people to accomplish things despite how hard they work. Let's drop the bs pretending that people just aren't working hard enough, or don't have skills, or spend their money frivolously. Sometimes companies get bought out, and get rid of everyone who was working there by replacing them with all new people. Sometimes the wages don't move for 15 years despite prices going up. Sometimes you have to realize that you are now no longer just competing with those in your community, you are competing with people from around the world. There are not enough jobs right now. Plain and simple. Stop pretending that there are.
4) While #3 is realized, also realize that it's not forever. You may not get everything that you were promised after you got out of college. Neither did I. I did everything right, too. Guess what? When they say, "go to school, earn good grades, go to college, earn good grades, get out and get a job", what they FAIL to mention is that the little plan doesn't mean that it will happen THE day that you graduate.
It doesn't include that it could take you a few years to find that perfect job. It doesn't mention, "depending on the economy at the time" how well you will do despite your good GPA, your honors, your work ethic, etc. None of that is mentioned when people say, "go to school, do well, now go get a good job". NONE of that is ever mentioned.
Sometimes you get out at the right time...the perfect time. Sometimes, it doesn't matter that you worked 10 times harder than anyone on these forums, (40 hours a week....LOL, c'mon, that would be a luxury), and you still have a hard time getting ahead. Relax. It is not forever. It may be a decade. It's not forever. It always fluctuates. We have really good times, we have bad times.
If you get out during the bad times, that doesn't mean that everyone before you "had it easy" and "doesn't understand" NOR does it mean that those who are getting out and getting smacked around by it are "lazy and excuse making". Stop bashing on those who came before you, stop bashing on those who came after you and are reeling. Stop assuming so much about each side. Help each other understand. "Well I did it, so can you" does not explain the 10 years you struggled to get there. That's what some of you are missing. You simply say, "Well I did it, so can you, I worked hard and saved and scrimped", blah blah, really tell them what you went through. I explain it every time I talk about going through college. I explain how much it SUCKED and how much I despise Top Ramen to this day...because people who are going through it want to know that they are not the only ones. Just saying, "I worked hard, that's how" implies that other people are not. So why don't you explain the gory details. And those of you just getting started, you aren't going to get everything handed to you on a silver platter. It doesn't work that way. It hasn't worked that way. Sometimes, it is just going to suck for awhile. It will turn around eventually. The market will always correct itself no matter how much fiddling we do.
5) Stop comparing yourself to others. If you aren't willing to go the same route that they did, don't assume that you are entitled to the same thing. If you don't want to live in the south, you want to live smack dab in NYC, don't complain about your housing costs. Some people move to places that are not their first choices. You have to decide which you want more - it has always been that way. Don't be envious of what others have. I've done a LOT in my life and nothing ticks me off more than when someone says how "jealous" they are of the things I have done. I made a lot of sacrifices to be able to do the things I've done, how DARE anyone be "jealous" of what I gave up to do those things. It's actually rude.
6) There is more to life than what you own or don't own.
If you want something bad enough, you put money aside. If it takes you 20 years, oh well. If someone else inherited theirs, oh well. Life is not equal, it has never been equal, it will never be equal no matter how many laws, policies, regulations, etc that you vote to pass. It will never, ever be equal. Get that through your head.
Just because someone else has something doesn't mean you "deserve" to have the same thing. And just because someone doesn't have something doesn't make them less than you. For some people, a home is not a "luxury" item, for others, it is. For some people a car is not a luxury item, for others it is. Never forget that compared to most of the people in this world, we are doing a *lot* better than 99% of them. Even our poor are doing better than 99% of the other people in this world. Some people are doing even better than that, but that doesn't make them bad greedy people. And some do work their tails off, have skills, are educated - but you know what? Life isn't black and white. It's not always going to end up how yours did. It doesn't mean that those people haven't tried, aren't intelligent, are lazy, or any other such nonsense that some people say. It's life. That's all it is: Life. Some have good ones, some don't. No one is better than anyone else, no one deserves what others have just because they don't have it but want it. It's called "Life". Get used to it.
You forgot the treadmill effect.
If you calculate the required down payment on a home, and it takes you 20 years, forget it because the down payment has necessarily skyrocketed and it is still out of reach.
If you calculate the required down payment on a home, and it takes you 20 years, forget it because the down payment has necessarily skyrocketed and it is still out of reach.
California has Prop 13 and since the Grandmother left the home to her Daughter the property tax is based on what the Grandmother paid back in the mid 1970's making the property tax about $2000.
Had the daughter then given or sold the home to her daughter the property would have been exempt from reassessment under the parent/child exemption statute.
So it is conceivable the property tax, had it stayed in the family, would be about $2500 and based on 600k the current property tax would be in excess of $10,000
People say all the time Prop 13 is an incentive to hold property... the reality is many simply don't want the bother or would even consider keeping the family home where they were raised...
I see this all the time with property owned by Parents/Grandparents in Oakland... the kids simply want to cash out because they live elsewhere.
Florida has something similar. It was just called the Homestead Act I believe. In this case, your taxes could only go up a certain percentage each year no matter what happened to the value of your home. What happened was When I bought my house many years ago, I found out that I was paying 5 times the tax amount than my neighbors. How is this fair considering We use the same resources?
Imagine if sales tax was like this? Oh, you are 65? Since you've been on this earth longer. you only have a pay 2 percent tax. Oh, you are 18? You have to pay 10 percent tax.
Who created the existing neighborhoods? Not the poor, obviously. The built environment was created by and for the prevailing economic class without regard for economic classes below it.
You are accepting a premise of dubious moral legitimacy.
You seem to be saying that your desire to live in an environment you want to live in supercedes the desires of others to live in environments they want to live in, and that poor people should either suck it up or move to BFE.
That's exactly what I'm saying. I've worked hard to live in that environment, and to have the lazy poor come in and demand that MY environment change because THEY feel entitled to have the same things I do, without having to earn them, is wrong.
Basically, you're saying that your desire to live in an environment that you want to live in supercedes the desires of others to live in environments that they want to live in, and that homeowners should either suck it up or move to another neighborhood. Do I have that about right? How are the arguments different, exactly? Except for the fact that I have WORKED for what I have, but you haven't, yet still expect it.
I don't really give a hoot that my neighborhood was created without regard to the economic classes below it. They want what I have, they can WORK FOR IT. Not demand it, as if it's a birthright.
Best I can do is 592 square feet on a 2500 square foot lot in the heart of the SF Bay Area in Oakland CA... it was my first purchase and I still have it today.
Several years ago I found an existing 2700-sq ft lot in Portland. (Irregularly shaped due to an odd intersection.) The owners had acquired it the previous year and aren't selling. Only lot I've found under 5K,
If you calculate the required down payment on a home, and it takes you 20 years, forget it because the down payment has necessarily skyrocketed and it is still out of reach.
When all you have is excuses, you are absolutely correct - you will never own a home.
Florida has something similar. It was just called the Homestead Act I believe. In this case, your taxes could only go up a certain percentage each year no matter what happened to the value of your home. What happened was When I bought my house many years ago, I found out that I was paying 5 times the tax amount than my neighbors. How is this fair considering We use the same resources?
Imagine if sales tax was like this? Oh, you are 65? Since you've been on this earth longer. you only have a pay 2 percent tax. Oh, you are 18? You have to pay 10 percent tax.
You're using an unfair analogy. It's more like the sales tax on an item that costs $1 might only be 8 cents, but the sales tax on another item that costs $10 would be 80 cents. Your taxes are being calculated on the purchase price today. In 20 years, your taxes will be lower than your new neighbor.
Also forgetting that he's paid for years in to those resources, yet you are now using them without having paid a penny yet.
That's exactly what I'm saying. I've worked hard to live in that environment, and to have the lazy poor come in and demand that MY environment change because THEY feel entitled to have the same things I do, without having to earn them, is wrong.
Basically, you're saying that your desire to live in an environment that you want to live in supercedes the desires of others to live in environments that they want to live in, and that homeowners should either suck it up or move to another neighborhood. Do I have that about right? How are the arguments different, exactly? Except for the fact that I have WORKED for what I have, but you haven't, yet still expect it.
I don't really give a hoot that my neighborhood was created without regard to the economic classes below it. They want what I have, they can WORK FOR IT. Not demand it, as if it's a birthright.
Some of the poor work hard. I've even worked with some of them. What makes your hard work more worthy than theirs?
I'm saying people should be able to purchase what they can afford, no more and no less. You are the one who demands exclusivity and exclusion.
Florida has something similar. It was just called the Homestead Act I believe. In this case, your taxes could only go up a certain percentage each year no matter what happened to the value of your home. What happened was When I bought my house many years ago, I found out that I was paying 5 times the tax amount than my neighbors. How is this fair considering We use the same resources?
Imagine if sales tax was like this? Oh, you are 65? Since you've been on this earth longer. you only have a pay 2 percent tax. Oh, you are 18? You have to pay 10 percent tax.
It is like sales tax... tax is determined on the purchase price with annual inflation factor plus voter approved assessments.
It is much more fair in that no one pays a tax based on someone's guess of value...
Also... long term home owners seldom use the public schools which can be up to 60% of of the tax bill.
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