Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
Status:
"I don't understand. But I don't care, so it works out."
(set 6 days ago)
35,627 posts, read 17,953,728 times
Reputation: 50650
Advertisements
Quote:
Originally Posted by Frostnip
It's only 18.2 miles from the dot on google maps that says Ketchikan. It's about 4 miles from the edge of the built-up town. It's also really, really not backcountry hiking, being that there's a marked, maintained trail adjacent to a paved highway. I mean, the site has bathrooms. You're exaggerating.
Yes, I think you're right. Either this boy was very big and tall for his age, or the height and weight given are wrong. BUT, his mom is 6 feet tall so maybe he was also a really tall child.
The problem is that this was not a nature walk. It's a hard to traverse trail with blown down trees and mud. It's sounds like it's an unmaintained trail.
It is NOT unmaintained! How many of you who are arguing over the details of this story have actually set foot in Ketchikan or better yet, on this trail? Ketchikan is surrounded by aging coniferous rainforest (where it hasn't been logged off of course). In SE AK it is normal for trails to be blocked by winter ice damaged trees and blowdown. Once the snowpack melts enough in spring, work crews hired by whichever agency manages the area that includes a particular trail spends days to weeks clearing debris for foot traffic, then patrols them after windstorms throughout the summer. There are often signs at trailheads explaining how far routine maintenance extends and warn of rougher conditions past a particular mile marker. Most trails, including this one, have more heavily timbered trouble spots that need chainsaw work every year. Some parks have coop agreements with local volunteer groups or ngos for it. It would make no sense and be hazardous to try keeping them clear all winter. Savvy residents soon learn which trails are even accessible this early in the year and which are not. Clearly this woman was the opposite of savvy. Highly-maintained path or not, a reasonable person who encounters windthrow and deep snow on a trail in late afternoon has the sense to turn around and retrace their steps before they lose daylight.
I don't know if I've ever heard anyone call Antarctica a popular cruise ship destination... It seems more of a place you would go on a small luxury ship, and not a floating hotel with thousands of other people. More of an expedition then a family vacation... But sure.
It is NOT unmaintained! How many of you who are arguing over the details of this story have actually set foot in Ketchikan or better yet, on this trail? Ketchikan is surrounded by aging coniferous rainforest (where it hasn't been logged off of course). In SE AK it is normal for trails to be blocked by winter ice damaged trees and blowdown. Once the snowpack melts enough in spring, work crews hired by whichever agency manages the area that includes a particular trail spends days to weeks clearing debris for foot traffic, then patrols them after windstorms throughout the summer. There are often signs at trailheads explaining how far routine maintenance extends and warn of rougher conditions past a particular mile marker. Most trails, including this one, have more heavily timbered trouble spots that need chainsaw work every year. Some parks have coop agreements with local volunteer groups or ngos for it. It would make no sense and be hazardous to try keeping them clear all winter. Savvy residents soon learn which trails are even accessible this early in the year and which are not. Clearly this woman was the opposite of savvy. Highly-maintained path or not, a reasonable person who encounters windthrow and deep snow on a trail in late afternoon has the sense to turn around and retrace their steps before they lose daylight.
I've enjoyed your posts throughout this thread. They're very enlightening.
And the question remains: what mom would take a 5- year -old on a long-ish trail 3 hrs. before nightfall? What were they doing earlier in the day, that she couldn't leave at a more normal hour for a day hike? It seems like a spontaneous, spur-the-moment decision. According to another poster, they knew the trail, having been on it before, so that makes the decision even more cryptic. She knew how long it took to walk it. She knew there would still be winter conditions along part of it, at what I assume was a higher elevation or more heavily wooded area.
Considering what Clara C added about her personal history, we can only conclude, that she suffers from a personality disorder or other mental health condition, that affects her ability to exercise sound judgment.
That's what I was wondering about. The link to the article said the trail was between 4 and 5 miles long. Seems like...not the longest trail in the world. And some of it is boardwalk.
.
I've never been on this trail, not aware of current conditions, though would imagine quite a bit of snow higher up and perhaps some ice too.
Without snowshoes and/or strap on cleats I can tell you that hiking around SE Alaska currently at elevation is tedious and hazardous. Very unfortunate they didn't turn around early on.
It's only 18.2 miles from the dot on google maps that says Ketchikan. It's about 4 miles from the edge of the built-up town. It's also really, really not backcountry hiking, being that there's a marked, maintained trail adjacent to a paved highway. I mean, the site has bathrooms. You're exaggerating.
Frostnip, you are correct. Low use trails don't rate bathrooms or even pit toilets. Even if all the area gets some parts of the year are cars, restrooms are a good clue that lots of people make the trip.
It is NOT unmaintained! How many of you who are arguing over the details of this story have actually set foot in Ketchikan or better yet, on this trail? Ketchikan is surrounded by aging coniferous rainforest (where it hasn't been logged off of course).
Yep. If it were unmaintained it'd be eaten by the forest pretty quickly. The SE isn't like my region where it takes five trillion years for a shrub to grow. This time of year any trail is going to be rugged, of course.
It is NOT unmaintained! How many of you who are arguing over the details of this story have actually set foot in Ketchikan or better yet, on this trail? Ketchikan is surrounded by aging coniferous rainforest (where it hasn't been logged off of course). In SE AK it is normal for trails to be blocked by winter ice damaged trees and blowdown. Once the snowpack melts enough in spring, work crews hired by whichever agency manages the area that includes a particular trail spends days to weeks clearing debris for foot traffic, then patrols them after windstorms throughout the summer. There are often signs at trailheads explaining how far routine maintenance extends and warn of rougher conditions past a particular mile marker. Most trails, including this one, have more heavily timbered trouble spots that need chainsaw work every year. Some parks have coop agreements with local volunteer groups or ngos for it. It would make no sense and be hazardous to try keeping them clear all winter. Savvy residents soon learn which trails are even accessible this early in the year and which are not. Clearly this woman was the opposite of savvy. Highly-maintained path or not, a reasonable person who encounters windthrow and deep snow on a trail in late afternoon has the sense to turn around and retrace their steps before they lose daylight.
Well yeah...I was kind of wondering about THAT too. If the trail was covered in mud and fallen trees, why didn't they turn around?
She knew how long it took to walk it. She knew there would still be winter conditions along part of it, at what I assume was a higher elevation or more heavily wooded area.
Not necessarily. People often have very poor judgement about their walking speed and how long it takes to cover distances. During years working in parks/forests/refuges I'd meet people all the time who underestimated the time it takes them to walk any distance even under the best of circumstances. Then of course conditions are key. Walking speed on a nice summer day would be completely different on the same trail in March. A fairly level trail, no matter how "maintained" it is, can easily become an exhausting postholing nightmare. Especially now when the snow is rotten: partially thawed, saturated with rainwater, and collapsing under its own weight. I haven't been on this trail in winter but the conditions described suggest it is bad enough hardly anyone bothers to ski it either. Simply too slow and too much work.
Last edited by Parnassia; 04-03-2020 at 02:17 PM..
Status:
"I don't understand. But I don't care, so it works out."
(set 6 days ago)
35,627 posts, read 17,953,728 times
Reputation: 50650
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sassybluesy
Well yeah...I was kind of wondering about THAT too. If the trail was covered in mud and fallen trees, why didn't they turn around?
It all just seems suspicious to me.
From the searcher's perspective, who observed this (I think) the area WOULD be covered with mud and fallen trees, but that doesn't mean where these two travelled was that way. The searchers had to search for hours on Friday to find Jennifer, and then another full day to find Jaxson, so THEY would have seen a lot of impassable areas, but did Jennifer and Jaxson travel on those parts of the trail?
I don't know.
But I'm really so curious to hear more details.
Please register to post and access all features of our very popular forum. It is free and quick. Over $68,000 in prizes has already been given out to active posters on our forum. Additional giveaways are planned.
Detailed information about all U.S. cities, counties, and zip codes on our site: City-data.com.
Please register to participate in our discussions with 2 million other members - it's free and quick! Some forums can only be seen by registered members. After you create your account, you'll be able to customize options and access all our 15,000 new posts/day with fewer ads.
