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Stupid question? My eternal well being is on the line. Sorry you find my questions hard hitting.
So to be clear, I had no free will before I was forced to exist/born and since I can't opt out to just not exist at judgment day, it safe to conclude there is no free will after I die, right mike?
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Originally Posted by Mike555
You don't even believe in the God of which the Bible speaks. In my opinion, you ask these questions just to be a pest.
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Originally Posted by Mike555
In fact, I did answer the question in post #31. As I said, it was the last stupid question I was going to answer. I then answered it.
If you want to know why I believe, then ask me why I believe what I believe.
Yes mike you did answer my first question but you keep shying away from my follow up question.
Can you please answer?
Quote:
So to be clear, I had no free will before I was forced to exist/born and since I can't opt out to just not exist at judgment day, it safe to conclude there is no free will after I die, right mike?
So what do you say mike? Do I have the free will after death and at judgment day to opt out of Heaven or hell and to just not exist like it was before I was born?
I do! But it wasn't always this way. In my youth, I was more about creedalism and "correct doctrine" which is how I interpret the OPs reference to concepts. I was utterly miserable then, but now I'm about relationship with God. Going to church, serving others, singing in worship, reading the Bible...are simply to facilitate a relationship with God and others, Jesus' two commandments.
Christianity doesn't do well as a religion of concepts and doctrine. Anyone who wants to argue otherwise would have to explain a long and bloody history (by their fruits you will know them...very bad fruit...). Making "doctrine" out of parables told to peasants, and letters written to fledgling groups of converts is a losing game that distracts from relationship (which was the point of the parables and letters). Christianity does best as simple practice of love and worship.
Christianity doesn't do well as a religion of concepts and doctrine. Anyone who wants to argue otherwise would have to explain a long and bloody history (by their fruits you will know them...very bad fruit...). Making "doctrine" out of parables told to peasants, and letters written to fledgling groups of converts is a losing game that distracts from relationship (which was the point of the parables and letters).
Christianity does best as simple practice of love and worship.
Yes mike you did answer my first question but you keep shying away from my follow up question.
Can you please answer?
So what do you say mike? Do I have the free will after death and at judgment day to opt out of Heaven or hell and to just not exist like it was before I was born?
Oh for crying out loud. Nothing in the Bible states that you get to choose your fate after death. You will not be able to opt out of heaven or hell and choose to just not exist. Everyone exists forever. The only issue is where you will spend eternity. . .with God or separated from God forever. And that issue is decided during your time on this earth and concerns whether or not you receive Jesus Christ as Savior. That is the Biblical teaching.
The error is yours. The phrase 'the (W)word of God is not used of Jesus only. It refers to the teaching of the apostles as well. And the Old Testament is just as much the word of God as is the New Testament.
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Originally Posted by Miss Hepburn
How could that be? Since the Word was in the beginning.
There was no paper, no pens and no people (!) in the beginning.
So, what did John mean, guys?
John called Jesus the Word. As the Word, the pre-incarnate Jesus has eternally existed. But the written scriptures, both Old and New Testaments are also God's revealed word. The Old Testament prophets wrote as they were carried along by the Holy Spirit.
The New Testament apostles as well were in the Spirit when they wrote. I don't mean that they were in a trance, nor was automatic writing involved. But they were superintended by the Holy Spirit as they wrote in their own words, within their own frame of reference.
The 'word' does not refer to Jesus only. Jesus himself called the Mosaic law the word of God. See Mark 7:13.
The Gospel is referred to as the word of God, and the word of the Lord in the book of Acts, such as in Acts 13:46, 15:35; 16:32, 17:11.
Paul said that what the apostles taught was the word of God. See 1 Thessalonians 2:13.
Oh for crying out loud. Nothing in the Bible states that you get to choose your fate after death. You will not be able to opt out of heaven or hell and choose to just not exist. Everyone exists forever. The only issue is where you will spend eternity. . .with God or separated from God forever. And that issue is decided during your time on this earth and concerns whether or not you receive Jesus Christ as Savior. That is the Biblical teaching.
Bet you treat young minds the same way. Really sorry for the really hard questions. Don’t mean to stress you out.
So what you are admitting is true is...
You have no choice to be born or not.
You gain frees will at birth. You are now tested by god.
You die and instantly lose free will for all eternity and there are only two places to go.
And god knows everyone’s final outcome before creating Adam.
I have no problem with Mike's verses showing me the way in, but once in, I'm in. The writer of Hebrews says this:
Let us therefore come boldly to the throne of grace, that we may obtain mercy and find grace to help in time of need.
The way has been made thru Christ. But to paint the picture that you only talk to Jesus and then he passes it on to the Father isn't a good picture. This is leaning a little to heavy on the aspect of the three over the one in the three in one....
Neither do I mind the picture of Christ ever interceding for me. There's a lot of time I am heavily involved in my own "ish" to boldly go in. Glad he's there interceding for me. I DO need it.
If you haven't figured it out Miss H, I can be a mess and ain't ashamed to admit it.
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Originally Posted by Mike555
I never meant to imply that prayer isn't to be addressed to the Father, though even prayer to the Father is to be done in the name of Jesus. As for intercession, Jesus is always interceding on our behalf.
To be clear to all reading this, no relationship with the Father can be established without coming to Jesus Christ for salvation. No one can receive the gift of eternal life without placing their faith in Jesus. No one is adopted into the family of God apart from faith in Christ Jesus. Anyone who thinks that they don't need Jesus to establish an eternal relationship with the Father is in for a very rude awakening in the day of judgment.
Grace is the empowering Presence and Power of God which enables us to be who He created us to be; and to do what He has called us to do. It has nothing to do with his mercy (unmerited favor) or that of a Penal Substitution theory. Rather, it is that which enables us to overcome, any and all obstacles that might be hindering our Spiritual growth and maturity. Unmerited favor, would be that of having or showing mercy to an enemy through that of love. Especially, one who spitefully persecutes you, "father, forgive them, for they know not what they do."
Bet you treat young minds the same way. Really sorry for the really hard questions. Don’t mean to stress you out.
So what you are admitting is true is...
You have no choice to be born or not.
You gain frees will at birth. You are now tested by god.
You die and instantly lose free will for all eternity and there are only two places to go.
And god knows everyone’s final outcome before creating Adam.
Thanks Mike
Mike doesn't speak for the New Testament, he is always speaking about Judaism and the idioms of hell, but he doesn't know Judaism or what the idioms mean.
How is somebody always speaking of what happens on Jewish holy days when they don't know anything about Jewish holy days or the meaning of Jewish idioms?
It's just bizarre, those first Christians were converts to Judaism, and you just can't fit modern Christianity into Judaism.
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in the beginning.
