Universalism - all aspects - pro and con (hell, doctrine, Revelation)

[Rose2Luv]

For decades, a well-documented phenomenon has been occurring in the Muslim world—men and women who, without knowledge of the gospel, or contact among Christians in their community, have experienced dreams and visions of Jesus Christ. The reports of these supernatural occurrences often come from “closed countries” where there is no preaching of the good news and where converting to Christianity can invoke the death sentence. But these are more than just dreams. Setting them apart is the intense reality of the experience and the surrender of one’s heart and mind to Christ in the wake of the dream. A common denominator appears to be that the dreams come to those who are seeking—as best they can—to know and please God.

Beginning in 2002, a group of people interested in this phenomenon took initial steps in bringing it to the attention of a worldwide audience through a series of video programs. Numerous on-site interviews were conducted with former Muslims who had experienced a dream or vision of Jesus resulting in their conversion to Christianity. From the outset, the producers endeavored to represent a global cross-section of Islam in the series, and for that reason, stories were sought in Arabic-speaking countries, Muslim areas throughout Africa and Asia and the secular Muslim nation of Turkey.

https://lausanneworldpulse.com/persp...hp/595/01-2007

[Brightfame52]

Originally Posted by Rose2Luv

The royal road of our Father is one of becoming like Him, transformed by His love and grace and glory. This is not a one step program, but one of gradually dying to yourself, and your faith, and entering into the faith of the Son of God. When you crash into the living God, the encounter is certain to renovate every square inch of your life's boat.

You can care less how you jumble up scripture.

[Brightfame52]

Originally Posted by jjGuru

It is the same. The "judgment" spoken of in Jude 1:15 (Gk. κρίσις, derived from κρίνω), and "having judged" in 1Co 5:3 (Gk κρίνω), are "judgments" against the flesh and it's "deeds" (Gk ἔργον, translated as "deeds" in Jude 1:15 and 1Co 5:2). And the reason the judgments are against the "flesh" and it's deeds is so the spirit may be saved "in the day of the Lord" (1Co 5:5), when "the Lord comes with ten thousands of his saints" (Jude 1:14).

That's the point I'm establishing and that you're ignoring.

As for the distinction between a "professing brother in the fellowship of the saints" and an unbeliever:

1. It's mere speculation on your part if the person in 1Co 5:5 was an actual believer (that is: Christ in him).
2. And even if so, God has concluded all in unbelief, that he might have mercy upon all (Rom 11:32).

You cant discern the difference either. Very careless and flippant with scripture.

[Brightfame52]

Originally Posted by Rose2Luv

The royal road of our Father is one of becoming like Him, transformed by His love and grace and glory. This is not a one step program, but one of gradually dying to yourself, and your faith, and entering into the faith of the Son of God. When you crash into the living God, the encounter is certain to renovate every square inch of your life's boat.

So God has predestinated the devil and his children/seed to become like Christ, gotcha.

[jjGuru]

Originally Posted by Brightfame52

....1 Cor 5 is speaking of a professing brother in the fellowship of the saints...

Is it speaking of a believer? Where is it said that it's "speaking of a professing brother in the fellowship of the saints".? Nothing in the text indicates that to be the case.

Here is how Paul, under divine inspiration, characterized this particular person charged with fornication:

1Co 5:7 Purge out therefore the old leaven, that ye may be a new lump, as ye are unleavened. For even Christ our passover is sacrificed for us:
1Co 5:8 Therefore let us keep the feast, not with old leaven, neither with the leaven of malice and wickedness; but with the unleavened bread of sincerity and truth.
1Co 5:9 I wrote unto you in an epistle not to company with fornicators:
1Co 5:10 Yet not altogether with the fornicators of this world, or with the covetous, or extortioners, or with idolaters; for then must ye needs go out of the world.
1Co 5:11 But now I have written unto you not to keep company, if any man that is called a brother be a fornicator, or covetous, or an idolater, or a railer, or a drunkard, or an extortioner; with such an one no not to eat.
1Co 5:12 For what have I to do to judge them also that are without? do not ye judge them that are within?
1Co 5:13 But them that are without God judgeth. Therefore put away from among yourselves that wicked person.

1Co 5:4 In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ, when ye are gathered together, and my spirit, with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ,
1Co 5:5 To deliver such an one unto Satan for the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

Do these characterizations describe such a person as already "saved" and having "eternal life"? Questions:

1. Why is this person called "old leaven" and the others within the body of Christ called "unleavened"?

2. Why is this person called a "leaven of wickedness"?

3. Why is this person referred to as "any man that is called a brother" (ie: a so-called brother) rather than simply called a "brother", if in-fact he was one?

4. Why does Paul refer to the judgment against this person as "also" being against those "that are without" (ie: outside the body of Christ)? Paul states that those "without" will be judged by God. And, Paul expressly judges this person "In the name of our Lord Jesus Christ" and "with the power of our Lord Jesus Christ". This person is being judged by God in name and power.

5. Why is the person called "that wicked person" if, according to your doctrines, he is elect and already sealed with the Spirit. That is: Christ in him.

6. Why does Paul say "may be saved" (Gk. subjunctive mood, denoting possibility) if this person is in-fact already "saved"?

Note: These questions are not about whether a "saved" person can commit fornication and be excommunicated from an assembly. They can, and they often are.

The questions are about this particular person being judged and whether this person was an actual "believer" in Christ at the time of "judgment".

In 2Co chapter 2, this particular person appears to have been forgiven, and reconciled back into the fellowship of the Church, or at least it seems that way.

I believe that this person was actually "unsaved/unregenerate" at the time of judgment and that the judgment of God caused this person to repent and receive Christ to the saving of his soul, according to the spirit.

I also believe that 1Co 5:5 teaches that the "unsaved" in the judgments of God are subjectively reconciled to Christ, by the destruction of the flesh, that the spirit may be saved in the day of the Lord Jesus.

[jjGuru]

Originally Posted by Brightfame52

You cant discern the difference either. Very careless and flippant with scripture.

Please read my post (above).

[EscAlaMike]

God loves all of His creatures. By "love", it is meant that He desires the best for each person.

The best for each person is to forsake sin and submit one's own will completely to God's will. This requires humility and forsaking of self.

Unfortunately, many people would gladly choose an eternity in hell rather than die to self and submit their own will to God's.

Embracing the cross is necessary for salvation.

How many of us are truly willing to pay that price?

[jjGuru]

Originally Posted by Brightfame52

You cant discern the difference either. Very careless and flippant with scripture.

I've given you more scripture than I can count. And you simply have had no response to any of it, other than giving one line quips. Your doctrines are dead and have nowhere to go. Like I recommended in a previous post: You should have listened to your mum:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JxEwmLbrUjA

And, I think you know this as well as I do...lol

[Rose2Luv]

Originally Posted by EscAlaMike

God loves all of His creatures. By "love", it is meant that He desires the best for each person.

The best for each person is to forsake sin and submit one's own will completely to God's will. This requires humility and forsaking of self.

Unfortunately, many people would gladly choose an eternity in hell rather than die to self and submit their own will to God's.

Embracing the cross is necessary for salvation.

How many of us are truly willing to pay that price?

Fear not Mike: the way back into the Tree of Life is via angelic beings with flaming swords swirling in every direction. The natural man cannot enter!

All four hells are consumed by the Lord of glory as He makes all things new.

Death and hell have a final destination: the Lake of theion!

[Rose2Luv]

Originally Posted by jjGuru

I've given you more scripture than I can count. And you simply have had no response to any of it, other than giving one line quips. Your doctrines are dead and have nowhere to go. Like I recommended in a previous post: You should have listened to your mum:


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JxEwmLbrUjA

And, I think you know this as well as I do...lol

JJ: Bright guy listens to no one, and as a parrot simply repeats the same old folly.

"Jesus came to raise the dead. He did not come to teach the teachable; He did not come to improve the improvable; He did not come to reform the reformable. None of those things works. ~Robert F. Capon