What's up with people in Chicago (live, to move, train)

[55degrees]

Originally Posted by oddstray

I am a older white woman. If the only other person in the parking lot is a young man, especially if he has that "tough" body language and clothing that young men tend to have, I *am* going to be nervous and therefore hyper-aware. I don't care if that young man is black or white or brown or green or purple. It's called being street smart. There is safety in numbers. In that respect, I think the OP's experience wasn't necessarily subtle racism.

I am not racist. I'm sexist!! I will be aware of any guy that crosses my path if it's not light outside and crowded. I lock my doors immediately every time I get into my car, etc.

Originally Posted by emathias

I would wonder what the O.P. dressed like.

Some preppy guy with well-groomed hair, wearing tasseled loafers, khakis and an oxford blue shirt with a navy blazer doesn't usually attract a second glance in the wealthy north side neighborhoods regardless of race.

This is true, but it kinda sucks that one would have to dress like Carlton Banks in order to appear nonthreatening.

[quote=DipGrant;24821455

My date who was a transplant from Michigan was clutching her purse throughout our meeting!! Should have called her out. /quote]

Why would she have agreed to go out with you if she's afraid of black guys? Maybe she was worried about other people instead.

I don't doubt your stories. I hope your experiences that did not involve strangers were better. It's annoying when strangers act ridiculous, but it's more important to have normal work colleagues, etc.

[j_cat]

Originally Posted by DipGrant

You're telling me. Some of the posters are claiming its all in my head, and people are being guarded. I say that is complete baloney. I have visited Philly, and they have been having problems with flash mobs and muggings in Center City. I don't think I came across a white women who walked to the others side or clutched there purse during my time there. They were actually pretty cordial. Businesses were friendly and did not even ask for my ID. I'm dressing the same way as I did while I was in Philly. Rarely, if ever did I get any sense any cues of subtle racism. Not even in NYC. Heck why don't they act like this in Salt Lake City or the racist city of them all "Boston". At least the residents who live in Boston make it obvious rather than so subtle. Subtle racists are the worst.


Different story in Chicago. I can not think of the times I counted where I saw white people crossing the street while I was approaching them. On a packed CTA red line train during rush hour you can see all the white folks either choosing to stand rather than take a clear open seat with a black man. Not just me. I just found it so amazing, I was telling myself. " did all the closet covert racists decide to move to the north side of Chicago"? My date who was a transplant from Michigan was clutching her purse throughout our meeting!! Should have called her out. It's a great gorgeous city, but people need to get their priorities straight. Not only from white people, but at times I received it from Asians and Latinos as well in the north side.

To the extent that it's not just all in your head (always worth considering), there is an additional factor here: it seems to me that Chicagoans have an unusually high level of self-respect. They will do what is necessary to protect their personal safety, personal space, personal comfort, etc. and they don't particularly care how this is perceived. I can see how this would rub people the wrong way, if they're accustomed to more passive, guilt-based attitudes.

I'll also reiterate my earlier point about being feared: that's not really your problem. If you're a safe person and they're scared anyway, then you just get more personal space out of the deal! You're really the "winner" in that situation, so why the angst?

[j_cat]

Originally Posted by 55degrees

I am not racist. I'm sexist!! I will be aware of any guy that crosses my path if it's not light outside and crowded. I lock my doors immediately every time I get into my car, etc.

As a white guy, I've noticed this with some women before. It doesn't offend me in the slightest; in fact, I'm glad they are vigilant about their own protection. It's kind of funny, actually, since I prefer men and thus have no real motivation to violate a woman's safety, but once again, it's not my problem.

[DoneWithDallas]

Originally Posted by DipGrant

You're telling me. Some of the posters are claiming its all in my head, and people are being guarded. I say that is complete baloney. I have visited Philly, and they have been having problems with flash mobs and muggings in Center City. I don't think I came across a white women who walked to the others side or clutched there purse during my time there. They were actually pretty cordial. Businesses were friendly and did not even ask for my ID. I'm dressing the same way as I did while I was in Philly. Rarely, if ever did I get any sense any cues of subtle racism. Not even in NYC. Heck why don't they act like this in Salt Lake City or the racist city of them all "Boston". At least the residents who live in Boston make it obvious rather than so subtle. Subtle racists are the worst.


Different story in Chicago. I can not think of the times I counted where I saw white people crossing the street while I was approaching them. On a packed CTA red line train during rush hour you can see all the white folks either choosing to stand rather than take a clear open seat with a black man. Not just me. I just found it so amazing, I was telling myself. " did all the closet covert racists decide to move to the north side of Chicago"? My date who was a transplant from Michigan was clutching her purse throughout our meeting!! Should have called her out. It's a great gorgeous city, but people need to get their priorities straight. Not only from white people, but at times I received it from Asians and Latinos as well in the north side.

Oh, shut up already. If you have such a problem with it don't frequent those neighborhoods where you feel people are being racist towards you. People are a-holes everywhere. Chicago is the third largest city in the country and if you really think there isn't one single racist person there you're seriously mistaken. Crying about it isn't going to do anything but turn into reverse racism. You think the white women grab their purses when you're around because you're black is going to make you dislike white women in the same way you feel that people are discriminating against you.

Us white people don't need to get our priorities straight because we dont worry about someone discriminating, maybe you should do the same. This isn't the Civil War era anymore.

[Plzeň]

Originally Posted by DoneWithDallas

Oh, shut up already.

Don't like being confronted with reality, do you? Does it threaten your belief that racism is made up by the victims of it? That's when you're supposed to rethink your belief system, not shoot the messenger.

[Chi-town Native]

Originally Posted by Chicago South Sider

This is an excellent point. It's all about simple math. There are going to be a certain percentage of bad apples in any bunch. Most people aren't socially developed enough to judge people based on the content of their character. Americans are lazy and it's much easier to lump people into large, manageable groups. Personally, I try to give people the benefit of the doubt until they prove me wrong. In other words, you are innocent until proven guilty, not the other way around.

[DoneWithDallas]

Originally Posted by Plzeň

Don't like being confronted with reality, do you? Does it threaten your belief that racism is made up by the victims of it? That's when you're supposed to rethink your belief system, not shoot the messenger.

I know the reality of the situation, completely. And I think its truly sad that it's still at the point that it is. Who knows maybe I'm oblivious but I've hardly recognized a situation of racism in my entire life. People like to play the victim. This man feels he is the victim and of course he might be, he might not be, we don't know we wern't there but rather than sitting there complaining about it on an internet forum (which will do nothing) accept that there is nothing he can do except maybe change HIS attitude and HIS belief system that the world is not out to get him. Because clearly he believes that every white woman he crosses paths with profiles him that hes nothing more than a gang banging thug.

[marothisu]

Originally Posted by DoneWithDallas

I know the reality of the situation, completely. And I think its truly sad that it's still at the point that it is. Who knows maybe I'm oblivious but I've hardly recognized a situation of racism in my entire life. People like to play the victim. This man feels he is the victim and of course he might be, he might not be, we don't know we wern't there but rather than sitting there complaining about it on an internet forum (which will do nothing) accept that there is nothing he can do except maybe change HIS attitude and HIS belief system that the world is not out to get him. Because clearly he believes that every white woman he crosses paths with profiles him that hes nothing more than a gang banging thug.

It goes both ways really. Something can be done about it, but yes I have learned that complaining about it even if it is real does not help. What helps is action, especially when you put people of multiple races together to accomplish a common task. That is the best way to end racism IMO.

I don't doubt the OP has had racist attitudes against them. It's a fact of life, and it happens in mostly all races (go to Asia if you want to see just as bad racism in some areas). People all have pre conceived notions about people of particular races either because of one thing that happened to them, what someone told them, or something they saw/read.

The best way in the end is for the person with those feeling to be immersed in the other culture or work with people of the other culture and realize that most people in the world have usually the same basic needs/wants no matter where in the world they're from and their notions aren't really true.

[Plzeň]

Originally Posted by marothisu

It goes both ways really. Something can be done about it, but yes I have learned that complaining about it even if it is real does not help. What helps is action, especially when you put people of multiple races together to accomplish a common task. That is the best way to end racism IMO.

I don't doubt the OP has had racist attitudes against them. It's a fact of life, and it happens in mostly all races (go to Asia if you want to see just as bad racism in some areas). People all have pre conceived notions about people of particular races either because of one thing that happened to them, what someone told them, or something they saw/read.

The best way in the end is for the person with those feeling to be immersed in the other culture or work with people of the other culture and realize that most people in the world have usually the same basic needs/wants no matter where in the world they're from and their notions aren't really true.

Very well said and true on all points. The corollary to your last statement is that people who have chosen to stay immersed only in their own culture without exposure to diversity, particularly when that culture is the majority one, are more likely to hold bigoted views. Hence the OP experiencing this more in some neighborhoods than others.

[Plzeň]

Originally Posted by DoneWithDallas

Who knows maybe I'm oblivious but I've hardly recognized a situation of racism in my entire life.

If you're white, that obliviousness comes from the fact that privilege is invisible to those who have it. I'm a white person who used to be in the same boat until I started truly listening and learning about racism. I would recommend reading some of Derald Wing Sue's work on microaggressions if you're interested in learning more. These are small incidents of discrimination that are generally invisible to us in the majority, but can have a very negative impact on those who experience them over and over, repeatedly, for long periods of time.