Why do people say Chicago is segregated? (Orland Park, Lincoln: how much, hotel)

[MoItaly]

I read many many times I this forums and other magazines how Chicago is very segregated between whites and blacks. If I never went there I would think the two races don't even talk to each other.

However, 2 years ago my wife and I were the only white couple at M-Bar, in Printer'Row and not only we had no issue and a great time, but because we left late in the night and were walking, a big black guy we met there and his buddies offered us to walk with us to the Blackstone Hotel as there were a few group of kids fooling around in the street.

This time, at Blues on Halstead, we basically spent the entire time with 2 black couples and had a great time.

At Miller's Pub, I went to the restroom, and when I came back there were 3 black guys drinking and one was trying to get into conversation you know what I mean..) with my wife. When I got to my seat he apologized, I said no problem, as he really thought she was by herself and we ended up having drinks and talking about football.

So, I thought: is it that maybe I don't have a problem and black people don't have it with me because of my accent, or this segregation thing is exaggerated?

[MoItaly]

Oh, and I'm not trying to stir an issue here, I'm really asking to learn. You are never too old for that.

[Tex?Il?]

There's nowhere in modern day (post civil rights) urban America (anywhere not backwoods) where people of mixed backgrounds can't enjoy company together. The enjoyable interaction you had can happen in Chicago and it can happen in many other towns and cities across the country.

When I think of Chicago as being "segregated", what I think of personally myself, is that despite Chicago's thriving world class status, is its residential patterns seem more similar to the troubled cities of the industrial midwest within a days drive (Detroit, Cleveland, and St. Louis) than either with some of the sunbelt cities (where a "reverse great migration" has occurred where many AAs have moved to Atlanta, etc. to be successful) or coastal cities to an extent, where defining economy, includes a lot of wealthy AAs. (IE: Wash DC, etc.)

Heres what to know:

Although certainly not all "white south siders" are like this, if you spend time in neighborhoods such as Bridgeport, anything in the city limits west of Pulaski (Clear-ridge, Beverly-Mt. Greenwood), most of the SW suburbs between I-55 and I-57 (especially newer "white flight burbs of Tinley and Orland Park, Palos area), you will eventually have conversations with people, that will confide to you their true feelings about their "changing" neighborhood and the people moving into them.

There has been a history of poor race relations between working class white catholics (Polish, Irish, Lithuanian, etc.) and Blacks on the south side. Partly because they competed for the same jobs in meetpacking, steel mills historically.

Other than that, also, you might want to be aware of Lincoln Park and Lakeview. While these are mostly young professionals who value progressive ideas, many young people are straight from whitebread suburbs and small towns, and may have had little interaction with Blacks, and may, just may have a bit of a "ghetto until proven otherwise" sizing up.

While these are by no means limited to Chicago (land) they area a stronger pattern in midwest urban culture (and yes there is a collective urban culture that transcends changes that have happened in the last generation or so).

But if you stay out of the swath of Chicagoland between I-55 and I -57, as well as some of the Big Ten fratty areas of Lincoln Park and Lakeview, you may never come across anything that could be construed as racist but who knows.

[marothisu]

There are definitely segregated areas of town where it's heavily white or heavily black and not a ton of areas where there's a great mix of them together, though there are some. Historically, and this goes for other older northern cities, they've been segregated since the great migration. Some of the newer cities out west are a lot better than this but in part I'd like to think that it's because they boomed later than cities such as St. Louis, Chicago, Cleveland, Baltimore, Philadelphia, etc.

However, really...if you give people respect, they give it back to you pretty much anywhere in the world. To many people in town it's pretty much a non issue and they look past what race someone is luckily. Others, not so much, but nothing is saying that blacks and whites hardly ever get along in Chicago. There definitely is racism if you keep your eyes and ears open here, but there's also many other people who really don't give a **** what color, religion, etc you are.

[jman07]

Chicago is a city of neighborhoods. Not just racial, but everything. You have areas for hipsters, 30'somerhings, people straight out of college, 20 something's, young families, etc.

[iNviNciBL3]

I don't know why but a lot of people forget that Blacks Whites Hispanics and Asians have legs, cars, bicycles, bus and train tickets...

You can live in a 90 percent Black neighborhood and travel to a Mexican neighborhood because the Mexican neighborhood has good food.

[glass_of_merlot]

I think it is not as bad as people say it is. Nobody is forcing anybody to live anywhere. There is a mom in my son's class who travels all the way from the south side on the train and bus, to Ravenswood to take her son to school every morning. I asked her why she just didn't move to the area instead and she said because she liked the area she lived in but the schools were horrible. So she wasn't trapped or forced to live there, she just chose not to.

[Manigault]

Originally Posted by MoItaly

So, I thought: is it that maybe I don't have a problem and black people don't have it with me because of my accent, or this segregation thing is exaggerated?

You foreshorten what is said: They called Chicago highly residentially segregated. It was and much of it remains so to this day.

[MoItaly]

Okay, then it's more like I thought. I just saw so many threads in this forum about segregation and Chicago being one of the most segregated cities in the USA that I was wondering.
Funny thing is for me, living in West Palm Bch, Fla., it seems more segregated down here, meaning that you don't see the mixed crowds you see in Chicago. I went to a lot of sport bars here and you rarely see black guys watching, especially one guy by himself. Then you go north of town toward the city called Riviera Beach and you rarely see a white guy.

In Chicago it seems more of a mixed crowd.

[Swandaddy]

In some areas it's not just white/black segregation. I'm thinking of North Lawndale being predominately African American and South Lawndale Hispanic; separated by the tracks.

I think there is to some degree a generational thing going on with it too -- each passing generation is somewhat different from the generation before, but the generation before is the generation that dealt the starting hand. And it's just a matter of time before neighborhoods and generations churn the demographics.

Also, and I'm not sure how the statistics on this work, but I remember (**insert late night drunken conversation disclaimer**) having a conversation with one of my friends sometime about statistics/demographics and population trends. It basically went as this: assume everybody in a city truly wanted diversity. But assume just for a sake of some comfort they ]wanted 25% of their neighborhood to be like them. Mathematically if you were to extrapolate that out to a population the statistics would by default force segregation. And this is assuming no discrimination/red-lighting/etc which of course has happened in this city.

I'm working through the book "The Third Coast: When Chicago Built the American Dream" and it's just amazing how much race played into the housing policy in the early to middle parts of the 20th century.

Even though there's still quite a ways to go, I think it is also helpful to look at the positive side of the coin at some of the diversity that truly does exist here, and the opportunity for improvement here, especially given the context of being in the Midwest. There are some truly diverse neighborhoods such as Rogers Park, Edgewater, Albany Park, etc. And this city is an opportunity. As someone who grew up in the middle of nowhere in the Midwest in a household and place where African Americans were referred to as "n******" and "p**** m******" I'm truly thankful for the wisdom and awareness I've been able to successfully gain here in this regard.

Yeah as far as LP/Lakeview, other than Boystown (for obvs reasons), I try to avoid the Midwest Americana thing primarily because I've already had more than enough years of that and if that's all I wanted in my life I could have just stayed in Midwest Americana.