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I grew up in Hyde Park, right behind the high school. In the 1970's it was mostly working class but safety and quality of life went out the window in the 1980's when more and more homes were turned into rentals. The street I grew up on was quiet and wonderful (other than the pedofile across the street) and kids roamed everywhere with no fear. Then the drug dealers moved in and my car got broken into 3 times in a month.
I did a drive by of my family's home (that we owned for 30+ years) and it was the most uncomfortable feeling. I was the only white person in the area (it was 99.9% white when I was growing up) and everyone was staring at me. A guy was dealing drugs outside of "my" house.
If you're looking for a bargain - stay close to Milton, Readville or Roslindale. The area up the hill on West Street still seems nice, as does Fairmount Hill, which has some really huge Victorians. Not much to do in Hyde Park except leave, which is what I did 18 years ago and I'm not moving back.
I haven't seen yet what viva's reason for starting this thread was. Is s/he house-hunting, or being a tourist looking to take the "true pulse" of Beantown?
As in every other city, the neighborhood boundary lines on a map of Boston and what people define as those boundaries are often two different things. If the demographics shift between one street and the next, folks will say one side is in one area and the other is in another. The "official" border between Hyde Park and Mattapan is down the middle of Rector Rd from River St to the railroad tracks, then the middle of Greenfield along its entire length to where it merges with Cummins Hwy, then out Cummins Hwy to where Roslindale begins. When Mattapan's "complexion" changed, the first reaction of people residing beyond Cummins Hwy toward Hyde Park was to assert to all who asked that they, too, lived in Hyde Park. Now that that area is almost entirely AA, the "popular" borderline is undefined.
A book entitled "The Death of an American Jewish Community/A Tragedy of Good Intentions" outlines in detail what occurred in Mattapan during the 1960's. Some Boston banks caught civil-rights fever and decided to "do good" by making home loans more readily available to people of color. But one look at many Boston neighborhoods such as Dorchester and Hyde Park, that were heavily Catholic and "ethnic," was all it took for the bankers to decide that their loan program would have to focus strictly on Mattapan and its bordering precincts. For that's where Boston's Jewish population was concentrated, a population known both for a philosophy of egalitarianism and for its tendency to relocate its people and institutions quietly when circumstances dictated. So "blockbusting" (feeding on people's racist prejudices, and legitimate fears of crime, to force quick and underpriced home sales) got underway. The consequence was a radical transition of the city's southern neighborhoods divided by Blue Hill Ave, from heavily Jewish to a Black majority within five years.
Just down the road in Hyde Park, transition also happened and continues to. But the changeover didn't occur smoothly or quietly. "Pioneer" AA households were subjected to muggings, verbal harassment, and window-smashing sprees by the "good Catholic boys" of that neighborhood, with of course little police intervention until noise was made in the news media. The identical scenario unfolded in other parts of town, notably around Codman Square and Wainwright Park in Dorchester, since unlike the Jews the Irish- and Italian- and Polish-Americans of Boston weren't going to cede their turf without a fight. But, eventually, cede they did. However, the "White flight" from HP wasn't nearly as fast or complete as it'd been in Mattapan. There continue to be diversely-populated blocks throughout much of the community, though the outermost sections such as Readville are still monochromatic on the pale end of the spectrum. What has changed even more in Hyde Park is that it's now much like Dorchester. You can walk down one street and see carefree children at play amid happily chatting neighbors, then literally turn the corner and get the urge to "beat feet" past glowering teenagers blasting hiphop music and giving the strong impression of waiting for a chance to stir up or intensify trouble. One by one, streets such as Westminster and Blake and Wood Ave that for a while were being touted as "models of peaceful 'integration'" are DISintegrating - both in the sense of having remaining White residents die (of natural causes) or move away, and in the sense of security. The supposed glamor of "gangsta" lifestyles has led to the establishment of neighborhood "crews" that deal drugs and are happy to pull guns at the slightest provocation. I once walked freely and comfortably, at any hour, between Mattapan Square and the home of friends on Greenfield Rd despite being Caucasian and therefore in a decided minority. The community could've been any suburban area: immaculately maintained Colonial, ranch-style, and Cape Cod houses on one side of the tracks, tidy bungalows and three-deckas on the other side toward River St. Only once did anything happen: some Black kids and I acknowledged each other cordially as I strolled past, then rocks were thrown so as to come close without hitting me as they stage-whispered, "What's that White sucka doing on 'our' street?" Message received, street avoided thereafter. Nowadays there's no way I'd go into that neighborhood. The family I was close with, Jamaican immigrants and their crazy fun kids if it matters, has long since departed for the 'burbs and Whites who venture around there are "suckas" indeed.
The gang problem in HP is mainly around the area I once frequented, with the community's social similarity to Dorchester being more the norm as one approaches and passes Cleary Square or travels up Hyde Park Ave. AA families are no longer greeted with vandalism and taunts when they move in, nor do "for sale" signs pop up in yards around them overnight. Even in 2008, some White households are putting down roots in HP too. The sprawling Georgetowne apartment complex, on the Dedham line, was built to serve the unofficial purpose of keeping Jews and other "European Americans" within the city limits after they fled "changing" areas. Of late it's become very "mixed," but few are panicking. Hyde Park's main problems are the abysmal public schools, and the kind of houses that few are jumping at the chance to call their own: cheaply built '50s-vintage "ranches" and Capes. Living rooms set off by big picture windows, and single-car garages, are not where it's at for today's home buyers.
Someone asked, and I'll tell to the best of my knowledge: Asians and Hispanics would not feel out of place in Hyde Park. A "charter school" called the Pacific Rim Academy is in HP. There's a multicultural vibe, courtesy of the fact that many Blacks in the community hail from "the islands" and have established churches and small businesses to cater to their needs. Social tolerance is the order of the day, but the number of Hispanics and Asians dwelling within Hyde Park's "on the map" boundaries is small. It's largely due to the thriving communities already in place elsewhere: Uphams Corner, North Quincy, Jamaica Plain, etc.
Truman Highway-and Brush Hill Rd hyde Park, and Milton is ok-however there is not
very much to see. Franklin Park is near JP and Dorchester. Roxbury? it is near the good
and not so good follow Centre Street! as a poster did state Fairmount Hill, which is near truman hiwhway-and brush hill rd which is into Milton.
Once all this was real nice. and Badger Road, cross the road Milton!
I grew up in Hyde Park, right behind the high school. In the 1970's it was mostly working class but safety and quality of life went out the window in the 1980's when more and more homes were turned into rentals. The street I grew up on was quiet and wonderful (other than the pedofile across the street) and kids roamed everywhere with no fear. Then the drug dealers moved in and my car got broken into 3 times in a month.
I did a drive by of my family's home (that we owned for 30+ years) and it was the most uncomfortable feeling. I was the only white person in the area (it was 99.9% white when I was growing up) and everyone was staring at me. A guy was dealing drugs outside of "my" house.
If you're looking for a bargain - stay close to Milton, Readville or Roslindale. The area up the hill on West Street still seems nice, as does Fairmount Hill, which has some really huge Victorians. Not much to do in Hyde Park except leave, which is what I did 18 years ago and I'm not moving back.
What's the predominant race in the area you grew up in these days?
I haven't seen yet what viva's reason for starting this thread was. Is s/he house-hunting, or being a tourist looking to take the "true pulse" of Beantown?
As in every other city, the neighborhood boundary lines on a map of Boston and what people define as those boundaries are often two different things. If the demographics shift between one street and the next, folks will say one side is in one area and the other is in another. The "official" border between Hyde Park and Mattapan is down the middle of Rector Rd from River St to the railroad tracks, then the middle of Greenfield along its entire length to where it merges with Cummins Hwy, then out Cummins Hwy to where Roslindale begins. When Mattapan's "complexion" changed, the first reaction of people residing beyond Cummins Hwy toward Hyde Park was to assert to all who asked that they, too, lived in Hyde Park. Now that that area is almost entirely AA, the "popular" borderline is undefined.
A book entitled "The Death of an American Jewish Community/A Tragedy of Good Intentions" outlines in detail what occurred in Mattapan during the 1960's. Some Boston banks caught civil-rights fever and decided to "do good" by making home loans more readily available to people of color. But one look at many Boston neighborhoods such as Dorchester and Hyde Park, that were heavily Catholic and "ethnic," was all it took for the bankers to decide that their loan program would have to focus strictly on Mattapan and its bordering precincts. For that's where Boston's Jewish population was concentrated, a population known both for a philosophy of egalitarianism and for its tendency to relocate its people and institutions quietly when circumstances dictated. So "blockbusting" (feeding on people's racist prejudices, and legitimate fears of crime, to force quick and underpriced home sales) got underway. The consequence was a radical transition of the city's southern neighborhoods divided by Blue Hill Ave, from heavily Jewish to a Black majority within five years.
Just down the road in Hyde Park, transition also happened and continues to. But the changeover didn't occur smoothly or quietly. "Pioneer" AA households were subjected to muggings, verbal harassment, and window-smashing sprees by the "good Catholic boys" of that neighborhood, with of course little police intervention until noise was made in the news media. The identical scenario unfolded in other parts of town, notably around Codman Square and Wainwright Park in Dorchester, since unlike the Jews the Irish- and Italian- and Polish-Americans of Boston weren't going to cede their turf without a fight. But, eventually, cede they did. However, the "White flight" from HP wasn't nearly as fast or complete as it'd been in Mattapan. There continue to be diversely-populated blocks throughout much of the community, though the outermost sections such as Readville are still monochromatic on the pale end of the spectrum. What has changed even more in Hyde Park is that it's now much like Dorchester. You can walk down one street and see carefree children at play amid happily chatting neighbors, then literally turn the corner and get the urge to "beat feet" past glowering teenagers blasting hiphop music and giving the strong impression of waiting for a chance to stir up or intensify trouble. One by one, streets such as Westminster and Blake and Wood Ave that for a while were being touted as "models of peaceful 'integration'" are DISintegrating - both in the sense of having remaining White residents die (of natural causes) or move away, and in the sense of security. The supposed glamor of "gangsta" lifestyles has led to the establishment of neighborhood "crews" that deal drugs and are happy to pull guns at the slightest provocation. I once walked freely and comfortably, at any hour, between Mattapan Square and the home of friends on Greenfield Rd despite being Caucasian and therefore in a decided minority. The community could've been any suburban area: immaculately maintained Colonial, ranch-style, and Cape Cod houses on one side of the tracks, tidy bungalows and three-deckas on the other side toward River St. Only once did anything happen: some Black kids and I acknowledged each other cordially as I strolled past, then rocks were thrown so as to come close without hitting me as they stage-whispered, "What's that White sucka doing on 'our' street?" Message received, street avoided thereafter. Nowadays there's no way I'd go into that neighborhood. The family I was close with, Jamaican immigrants and their crazy fun kids if it matters, has long since departed for the 'burbs and Whites who venture around there are "suckas" indeed.
The gang problem in HP is mainly around the area I once frequented, with the community's social similarity to Dorchester being more the norm as one approaches and passes Cleary Square or travels up Hyde Park Ave. AA families are no longer greeted with vandalism and taunts when they move in, nor do "for sale" signs pop up in yards around them overnight. Even in 2008, some White households are putting down roots in HP too. The sprawling Georgetowne apartment complex, on the Dedham line, was built to serve the unofficial purpose of keeping Jews and other "European Americans" within the city limits after they fled "changing" areas. Of late it's become very "mixed," but few are panicking. Hyde Park's main problems are the abysmal public schools, and the kind of houses that few are jumping at the chance to call their own: cheaply built '50s-vintage "ranches" and Capes. Living rooms set off by big picture windows, and single-car garages, are not where it's at for today's home buyers.
Someone asked, and I'll tell to the best of my knowledge: Asians and Hispanics would not feel out of place in Hyde Park. A "charter school" called the Pacific Rim Academy is in HP. There's a multicultural vibe, courtesy of the fact that many Blacks in the community hail from "the islands" and have established churches and small businesses to cater to their needs. Social tolerance is the order of the day, but the number of Hispanics and Asians dwelling within Hyde Park's "on the map" boundaries is small. It's largely due to the thriving communities already in place elsewhere: Uphams Corner, North Quincy, Jamaica Plain, etc.
So let me guess. The parts near Cummins Highway and Mattapan, are the predominantly black areas of Hyde Park. I'm just wanting to know if I should add Hyde Park to my list of neighborhoods not to visit when I go to Boston this summer. So far on my list I have Roxbury, Dorchester, and Mattapan. I remember when I went there in 2005, I got stuck in Dorchester in the middle of the night, not sure which section of it, but I think it was one of the black sections, I saw a bunch of black guys giving me weird looks. I later told that story to a cab driver and he was telling me I was lucky I lived.
This is ridiculously racist. I very much doubt that any black guys were focused on you and giving you "weird looks".
This is ridiculously racist. I very much doubt that any black guys were focused on you and giving you "weird looks".
You're right, that was racist of me to say, and I'm sorry. I'm especially ashamed of myself for saying that, because I am far from racist. I love racial diversity, I love the fact that the Red Sox have a very racially diverse fan base in Boston, MA.
LOL at this thread! What the heck is DOT? Dorchester starts with a DOR. Thanks for the interesting info and the laughs.
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I haven't seen yet what viva's reason for starting this thread was. Is s/he house-hunting, or being a tourist looking to take the "true pulse" of Beantown?
