HEB Grocery & "Bring your own bags" (sale, school)

[TexasHorseLady]

A wise and frugal government, which shall restrain men from injuring one another, which shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government, and this is necessary to close the circle of our felicity. Thomas Jefferson, First Inaugural Address.

[scm53]

Originally Posted by Austinite101

I believe in a strong role for the government to regulate the market appropriately. What is appropriate for me is not always appropriate for you. I don't see this ordinance as intrusive at all.

First, why is what is appropriate for you forced upon me by the rule of law? Where do you get the right, absent a threat to public health, to inject your values into a transaction between me and a merchant? Sorry - "unsightliness" doesn't qualify.

Second, the level of intrusiveness isn't the issue either. Allowing government to expand its control of our lives isn't dependent upon how much it is going to hurt. It is dependent upon the ill being cured. I am hard pressed to see how the difference between a paper grocery sack and a paper grocery sack with handles is a ill begging for a government cure.

[austinrebel]

Originally Posted by scm53

I am hard pressed to see how the difference between a paper grocery sack and a paper grocery sack with handles is a ill begging for a government cure.

It sounds like some Control Freak came up with that one.

An unintended consequence of this is higher prices for consumers since retailers will pass the increased cost of bags on to their customers.

[mimimomx3]

Originally Posted by Austinite101

So then we will disagree and that's that.

Yep, and it's a good thing.

[atxcio]

Originally Posted by mimimomx3

But won't those just end up in the trash, too???

I suppose the 4 mil bags could end up in the trash, but I suspect fewer of them will. I've never thrown out an IKEA bag that I paid for -- they make great storage, among other things.

[atxcio]

Originally Posted by scm53

First, why is what is appropriate for you forced upon me by the rule of law? Where do you get the right, absent a threat to public health, to inject your values into a transaction between me and a merchant? Sorry - "unsightliness" doesn't qualify.

Unsightliness does qualify. See business sign ordinances, tree protection ordinances, laws against parking in your front yard, etc. That's the difference between living in a city and out in rural areas. When you live in a city, sometimes they make rules to prevent a large group of people living in close proximity from looking like a refugee camp.

There are plenty of laws governing your transaction with a merchant, too. Thousands, actually. But since you mentioned values, I can't help but think of the Texas Blue Laws. Many of those are still around and they were purely, 100%, values-based laws injected into your business transactions with a merchant.

[10scoachrick]

Originally Posted by TexasHorseLady

A wise and frugal government, which shall restrain men from injuring one another, which shall leave them otherwise free to regulate their own pursuits of industry and improvement, and shall not take from the mouth of labor the bread it has earned. This is the sum of good government, and this is necessary to close the circle of our felicity. Thomas Jefferson, First Inaugural Address.

Sorry, you lost me at 'wise and frugal government'

[BigDGeek]

Originally Posted by llkltk

Ba ba bacteria!

Wa wa wa wash them.

Originally Posted by capcat

Yes, and Americans weren't a throw-away lot in previous generations. It would have been frowned upon, especially the "greatest generation" who knew how precious resources are. Anyone have a mom, grandmother or great grandmother who washed aluminum foil, to save for reuse?

This. Both of my grandmothers used cloth shopping bags because they hated the waste associated with paper/plastic bags. I lived in Europe for many years where bringing your own shopping bags was de rigueur and I continued the habit when I returned to the US several years ago.

And yes, my grandmothers and mother save(d) aluminum foil. I do too. When it's worn out from the constant folding and re-folding, I wad it up and recycle it. I also re-use plastic ziploc bags until they start to tear. Waste not, want not.

I applaud Austin's plastic bag ban and I hope cities in DFW do the same sooner rather than later.

[scm53]

Originally Posted by atxcio

There are plenty of laws governing your transaction with a merchant, too. Thousands, actually. But since you mentioned values, I can't help but think of the Texas Blue Laws. Many of those are still around and they were purely, 100%, values-based laws injected into your business transactions with a merchant.

Old bad laws don't justify new bad ones. Besides - you said "many". I won't insist on many. Name three.

[Komeht]

I'm not sure why the city didn't just take away the option of paper or plastic - the ban in place is very confusing and unnecessarily divisive. The handle thing is nonsensical. What - a bag with a handles suddenly is eco and green?

They could have just limited the ban to plastic bags - allowed all paper bags and achieved 90% of what the active bag nuts wanted.