Georgians own more than 22,000 machine guns (sales, violent crime, employment)

[AcidSnake]

Originally Posted by southgeorgia

i would agree with you on that one.




i disagree on all of those for two reasons: invasion of privacy, and the broad range of symptoms that can classify someone as mentally ill.


edit to add:

if you do own a fully automatic weapon, you are required to account for that weapon whenever asked to do so. you also have to register with the sheriff of your county and have their permission to own the weapon; if they say no, you're not bringing it home.

There is no constitutional right to privacy. None what-so-ever. But you may have a point with the mentally ill part, not that it would change my mind on a database.

Also, I am not quite so comfortable with the idea of some country bumpkin sheriff as the regulator of weapons of war. Looking at the history of the type of Sheriffs that governed in the south, I am much more comfortable with a state database with an equal partnership from the feds.

Originally Posted by southgeorgia

AR-15 shoots faster, is lighter, easier to handle, etc. . . etc. . . . .


Read the first line of my post again, where i said they're simply fun to shoot. I like having it.



Its my constitutional right to have it.



Cars kill people, cigarettes kill people, bears kill people, hands and feet kill people; do any of these things belong in a civilized society?

This part I find funny.

You mentioned cars as an excuse I would imagine, for why it wouldn't be fair to malign the assault rifle. Cars are insured by law, as you and I both know.

But you have a problem with buying insurance for assault weapons? And you say that it's an invasion of privacy?

I'm sorry dude, but that logic just don't fly with me.

There comes a point when the freedom and safety of the individual should and must be weighed against the freedom and safety of society. If a person is so gung-ho on buying a weapon that can kill numerous amounts of people in an instant, fine let him.

But he should be made to go out and purchase insurance on his weapon in case that weapon just happens to be "accidentally" used to commit a murderous crime spree. Society should not be made to pay the debts for the actions of a loony bird and the idiot who didn't take care to safeguard and secure his weapon.

That's my opinion, and I am holding fast to it.

[MattCW]

Actually, the Constitution has this thing called "non-enumerated rights" under the 9th amendment. Meaning that just because it doesn't explicitly protect it, doesn't mean that it isn't protected. Were it to come under a court challenge, I have no doubt that the right to medical and psychological privacy would be upheld if not by other legislation, then by the 9th amendment.

[southgeorgia]

You understand everyone is calling it an assault rifle, right? In the media, in congress, etc...etc...; so rather than add to the confusion that already exists, you can simply say the ar-15 is not a fully automatic weapon.

It was designed as a select fire weapon, and commonly referred to as an assault rifle.



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[AcidSnake]

Not if the U.S. Supreme Court were dominated by a bunch of "originalists" who will only enforce laws as they are literally spelled out to the letter in the U.S. Constitution and Bill of Rights.

There is no true right to privacy; point-blank, end of story. And "non-enumerated rights" leaves way too much to interpretation.

It's wishful thinking to even assume that a couple of flesh & blood human beings would even hold this non-existing privacy rights in high regard, especially in light of how the "Patriot Act" was never really challenged.

Originally Posted by MattCW

Actually, the Constitution has this thing called "non-enumerated rights" under the 9th amendment. Meaning that just because it doesn't explicitly protect it, doesn't mean that it isn't protected. Were it to come under a court challenge, I have no doubt that the right to medical and psychological privacy would be upheld if not by other legislation, then by the 9th amendment.

[DentalFloss]

Originally Posted by southgeorgia

You understand everyone is calling it an assault rifle, right? In the media, in congress, etc...etc...; so rather than add to the confusion that already exists, you can simply say the ar-15 is not a fully automatic weapon.

Actually, they're using the phrase "assault weapon", which is an inflammatory made up phrase that has no definition, and they're doing so intentionally in order to scare people who know nothing about firearms. And as you can see on dozens of threads here, it works.

It was designed as a select fire weapon, and commonly referred to as an assault rifle.

The M16 is a select fire weapon. Ergo, it is, by definition, an assault RIFLE.

The AR-15 is not. Ergo, it's not.

Words have meanings.

[AcidSnake]

Yep, you are correct.

The AR-15 is not a fully automatic weapon...until you perform a "Drop in Auto Sear" or "lightning-link" conversion.

Then the AR-15 becomes an all-out automatic death machine.

Originally Posted by southgeorgia

You understand everyone is calling it an assault rifle, right? In the media, in congress, etc...etc...; so rather than add to the confusion that already exists, you can simply say the ar-15 is not a fully automatic weapon.

It was designed as a select fire weapon, and commonly referred to as an assault rifle.



Sent from my BlackBerry 9370 using Tapatalk

[DentalFloss]

Originally Posted by AcidSnake

The AR-15 is not a fully automatic weapon...until you perform a "Drop in Auto Sear" or "lightning-link" conversion.

Then the AR-15 becomes an all-out automatic death machine.

And yet, I am aware of only one crime, EVER, committed with an auto-converted AR. Just DOING the conversion will cost you a decade in prison, and a $250,000 fine, and that's if you don't actually do anything with it.

One police officer said that over the course of his career, he'd been involved in the confiscation of 50,000 weapons of one kind or another. The number of illegally converted auto? Zero. Out of 50,000.

It's not a large problem.

[cy_flembeck]

Originally Posted by flamadiddle

I see both sides of the argument, but this is clearly a problem with no real solution other than to hope for the best going forward...

Simple yet actually pretty true.

The one potential safeguard that does not get enough attention is to push for citizens to have a heightened awareness of any friends, neighbors, co-workers, family members, KIDS who are acting suspiciously and making threats. Drop a dime on them and let the cops sort it out. HIPPA laws and confidentiality are not protected when someone is rambling to a neighbor.

Recently I read that many of these mass murderers at one point told someone of their intentions and were not taken seriously.

It was a big part of the strategy in the War on Terror after 9/11, it should also be a big part of trying to uncover and report these kinds of potential threats as well.

[AcidSnake]

You are right.

But it won't detract me from my strong belief that there should be restrictions on straw purchases, a Federal closure to the gun show background check loophole, a mental health database that a gun seller should be made by law to access for background checks, and that there should be insurance for weapons like the AR-15 and XM-15 that are capable of going fully automatic.

Your great point on this one little issue does not detract from the overall message.

Originally Posted by DentalFloss

And yet, I am aware of only one crime, EVER, committed with an auto-converted AR. Just DOING the conversion will cost you a decade in prison, and a $250,000 fine, and that's if you don't actually do anything with it.

One police officer said that over the course of his career, he'd been involved in the confiscation of 50,000 weapons of one kind or another. The number of illegally converted auto? Zero. Out of 50,000.

It's not a large problem.

[DentalFloss]

Originally Posted by AcidSnake

But it won't detract me from my strong belief that there should be restrictions on straw purchases,

It's already a felony. What more would you suggest?

a Federal closure to the gun show background check loophole,

You realize that licensed dealers have to do a background check, gun show or not, right? As for requiring it on private sales, I have no objection in principal, but there is no system in place currently to even allow it to happen. I couldn't do a background check on someone who wanted to buy a weapon from me if I wanted to.

a mental health database that a gun seller should be made by law to access for background checks,

Please outline what conditions are disqualifying. Anxiety? Depression? Or just people who hear voices in their head.

and that there should be insurance for weapons like the AR-15 and XM-15 that are capable of going fully automatic.

That would be every single semi-auto weapon on the planet, including pistols. May not be easy, may not be cheap, in fact it may require an almost complete retooling of the weapon, but it's at least hypothetically possible.