clifton corridor plans announced— it's going to be light rail =[ (Atlanta: buy, schools)

[gtcorndog]

Originally Posted by cqholt

WTF are you talking about? Maintenance for rail-based transit is lower than buses. Buses only last 5-10 years, while rail-based transit lasts decades. Look at MARTA, there are some cars that are original to the system.

Do some research son.

You can get about 30-35 years out of a rail car. A rail car costs between about $2.0-4.0 million each. You can get about 10 years out of a bus for between $350,000-$400,000. How much maintenance must be performed on the track? Run those numbers and get back to me.

Hell, MARTA is asking for somewhere north of $500 million from the TSPLOST on their rail maintenance alone. (I don't want to look up the exact number right now.) You have to factor that in to the long term operating costs. Spread that cost out and let me know if you think rail is cheaper to operate and maintain.

"Proper consideration of the cost of one system compared to another must include not only the burden of initial construction, but the ongoing costs of operation, as well. The operating costs of these two systems clearly demonstrate a vast difference. The GAO used three measures to evaluate operating cost, and in every case the majority of cities have lower operating costs for their BRT systems than for their light rail systems. Figure two shows that the operating costs per vehicle mile are lower for BRT systems than for light rail. The GAO’s estimate for Denver’s BRT system is that BRT costs 80.8 percent less per mile to operate than light rail"

[gtcorndog]

Originally Posted by JPD

You're still wilfully ignoring the economic development aspect of transit projects. Why is that?

Because it is part of a transportation initiative being sold to the region as a tax to help regional transit, not an initiative to spur growth along highly overpriced rail routes.

This is not a Economic Development Tax. If that is the purpose of this route, and it must be, because the transportation benefits are minuscule for such a large investment, then at least sell it to the voters as such and let them decide. Don't sell transportation fix and give them $900+ million spent for 5,300 new riders.

[MathmanMathman]

Originally Posted by JPD

You're still wilfully ignoring the economic development aspect of transit projects. Why is that?

I don't think they have it unless it orchestrated and subsidized by the government.

[johnatl]

Originally Posted by gtcorndog

Because it is part of a transportation initiative being sold to the region as a tax to help regional transit, not an initiative to spur growth along highly overpriced rail routes.

This is not a Economic Development Tax. If that is the purpose of this route, and it must be, because the transportation benefits are minuscule for such a large investment, then at least sell it to the voters as such and let them decide. Don't sell transportation fix and give them $900+ million spent for 5,300 new riders.

We have been paying a penny sales tax for decades in DeKalb. The Clifton Corridor is THE largest single employment center not accessable by rail or freeway in the metro. It's time to connect Emory to the rail system, period.

[arjay57]

Light rail is absolutely perfect for this route. The trains should basically go the speed limit for streets through this area -- 35-45 mph. The stops are less than a mile apart, so at that speed you're only looking at a minute or two between stations. The key will be keeping the headway times short.

Cheshire Bridge is an excellent location for a stop as well. I hope they will be simple platforms where passengers can easily access them. We don't need any more gargantuan MARTA style stations.

To be honest I don't get the complaints about transfers. For Pete's sake, if you're a rail fan and you want to buzz around in an urban environment, that's part of it.

This line will be utterly transformative.

[JoeP]

Light rail makes sense for this corridor. I don't understand the bashing. This is appropriate, if it ever happens that is.

[gtcorndog]

Originally Posted by johnatl

We have been paying a penny sales tax for decades in DeKalb. The Clifton Corridor is THE largest single employment center not accessable by rail or freeway in the metro. It's time to connect Emory to the rail system, period.

I'm fine if that Dekalb/Fulton MARTA sales tax goes to that project. Heck, it should go to fund the system's operation and expansion within Dekalb County. However, I am opposed to a huge chunk of the regional TSPLOST funds going to a project that has a noticeable effect on 0.0008 of the regional population.

[cqholt]

However, I am opposed to a huge chunk of the regional TSPLOST funds going to a project that has a noticeable effect on 0.0008 of the regional population.

I am opposed to the reconstruction of 400/285, 285/85, and 285/20 but I refuse to stand in the way of helping other citizens of the metro area. Its a sales tax that everyone shares and it will help out the entire metro area. The CDC will be served by this line. What's better than helping those people that save us from diseases have a less stressful commute, maybe free time can be spent to cure AIDS?

[gtcorndog]

Originally Posted by cqholt

I am opposed to the reconstruction of 400/285, 285/85, and 285/20 but I refuse to stand in the way of helping other citizens of the metro area. Its a sales tax that everyone shares and it will help out the entire metro area. The CDC will be served by this line. What's better than helping those people that save us from diseases have a less stressful commute, maybe free time can be spent to cure AIDS?

The difference is that those intersections serve hundreds of thousands of drivers a day.

I think the Clifton line will be great for those 5,300 new riders and 17,000 total riders that MARTA projects. My beef is that this project which effects 0.00088 of the region does not warrant 16% of the TSPLOST budget on top of the nearly 16% MARTA needs for deferred maintenance and station improvements.


Comment removed - DO NOT be confrontational and/or insult other members.

[JPD]

Originally Posted by gtcorndog

Is your latest argument for the line that the workers at the CDC deserve it more than other taxpayers do to the nature of their work?

Depends what your job is. In many cases, I'd say yes.