Going back to school on Aug 5.....WHY? (Atlanta, Sandy Springs: daycare, home)

[RainyRainyDay]

I'm sure I've written this before, on this forum, but since Neil has missed all the rationale for the early start, I'll put forward my somewhat digressive take on it again.

When we moved here from BC, Canada, where school ends at the very end of June - no sissy mid-June stuff there - and starts again after Labour Day (Canadian spelling) we were very surprised at the idea of school in August. However, I quickly realized that the Georgia school calendar had the advantage of placing the traditional winter break over Christmas and New Year at the exact mid-point of the school year. I thought this was brilliant.

I attended high school in BC in the early 1970s when the semester system was the big new thing. (It's called the block system down here, and from what I've read since, Canada was a pioneer in this area). We always had first semester exams, followed by the semester change, in late January. I always disliked how the winter holiday didn't really feel so much like a holiday because typically one had a lot of course-end projects on the go, and studying for exams was coming right up. (Indeed, the day after Christmas, last year, a high-school senior niece in Canada was on Facebook asking "does anybody have the rubric for the Bio lab?", since she'd misplaced hers. Evidently, things haven't changed).

I realized that on the Georgia calendar, the first half-year ended neatly before the winter holiday, with all courses wrapped up, and then the new courses would start when school resumed in January. Much nicer. And seeing as it's so hot down here, it made little difference (I naively thought) whether kids were out May-August or June-September. It's darned hot here for a good 4 months, anyway.

Our daughter has gone to Canada to visit family for a month every summer that we've lived here. Yes, her school vacation schedule is different from her cousins'. We send her up there in July, when school is out everywhere on the continent, I think. That's a whole month. Those who complain that the Georgia school calendar makes vacationing with northern family and friends impossible, might care to consider the possibility of getting together in July. Just a thought.

I'm fairly neutral on the more "balanced" calendar that Cobb implemented this year. Cherokee County schools have been on this same calendar for quite a few years now, and people seem to like it. So I'm willing to give it a try.

The earlier school start is helpful to students who have to write AP exams, as those take place on a fixed date in May, nation-wide. Yes, northern students start school later and manage to be prepared, so it can be done, but having more time to get ready seems like a good thing to me. Also, what's the use in having school go well into June after the AP exam? The course is done.

I really don't think the timing of school vacations is a be-all and end-all, so long as we have some. But the hissy fit that a lot of people seem to be having over the school calendar just leaves me incredulous and thinking back to my initial response, eight years ago, of "what a good idea". It's still amazing to me, even after all this time, what a truly conservative country the USA is. If once upon a time school used to start after Labor Day, heaven forfend that it ever start any other time, apparently. (And using graphing calculators in high school math classes? We know they're unnecessary and harmful, because we parents didn't have 'em when we went to school. It's a wonder y'all use electric light.)

Middle-class Georgia taxpayers seem to constantly be demanding the schools produce better test scores with less funding. So the schools try to innovate within the small scope of things they can control, like the calendar, but apparently it's not acceptable for them to do that either. Give them a chance, I say.

[neil0311]

Originally Posted by RainyRainyDay

I'm sure I've written this before, on this forum, but since Neil has missed all the rationale for the early start, I'll put forward my somewhat digressive take on it again.

OK..thanks. That at least does provide a reasonable argument based on facts for why to start early. I wasn't aware of the AP testing, but as you say, other districts do fine starting later, so I'd be curious to see any empirical evidence exists that links an earlier start date to better achievement. The folks on the school board seem convinced that it does.

[RainyRainyDay]

My daughter scored 5 (the highest score) on both AP exams she wrote as a sophomore, this past spring. Mentioning this is kind of a shameless exhibition of parental pride, I guess. However, my kid's good school experience and results are making me impatient with all the online complaints I read, to the effect that all Georgia public schools are dreadful, all the time. I'm sure there are problem systems and schools out there. But I am personally quite a happy parent, and I don't like to see the system that's serving my child quite well being drubbed in the court of popular opinion.

[kaday]

Originally Posted by RainyRainyDay

My daughter scored 5 (the highest score) on both AP exams she wrote as a sophomore, this past spring. Mentioning this is kind of a shameless exhibition of parental pride, I guess. However, my kid's good school experience and results are making me impatient with all the online complaints I read, to the effect that all Georgia public schools are dreadful, all the time. I'm sure there are problem systems and schools out there. But I am personally quite a happy parent, and I don't like to see the system that's serving my child quite well being drubbed in the court of popular opinion.

Rainy with all due respect I think this thread is about people being frustrated with the calendar not the academics of the Cobb schools which are for the most part highly touted on this forum. It's fantastic that the new schedule works for you and your family. Consider the fact that it does not work for many people. And congrats on your daughters scores. Which just goes to show people that good parental influence and involvement will produce excellent students.......I think the jury is still out on the balanced calendar.

[RainyRainyDay]

Originally Posted by kaday

Rainy with all due respect I think this thread is about people being frustrated with the calendar not the academics of the Cobb schools which are for the most part highly touted on this forum. It's fantastic that the new schedule works for you and your family. Consider the fact that it does not work for many people. And congrats on your daughters scores. Which just goes to show people that good parental influence and involvement will produce excellent students.......I think the jury is still out on the balanced calendar.

Thanks, kaday. I agree that the jury is still out on the balanced calendar. I also agree that this thread is about the calendar, not the academics.

My last post was intended as kind of an aside explaining why I'm inclined to rise to the defense of the previous Cobb calendar, at least. I've been affected by reading too many complaints on the AJC (Atlanta Journal-Constitution) education blog, I fear. It seems that the controversy over the balanced calendar has to some extent segued into a controversy over whether or not it's OK to start any time in August. In fact, that has been the clear position of the OP, Neil, on this thread. On the AJC blog (but not here), it's also tended to bring out all the people who take every opportunity to express their opinion that Georgia schools never do a single thing right. But that's not true of this thread here. Mea culpa for conflating the two.

[RainyRainyDay]

Originally Posted by neil0311

OK..thanks. That at least does provide a reasonable argument based on facts for why to start early. I wasn't aware of the AP testing, but as you say, other districts do fine starting later, so I'd be curious to see any empirical evidence exists that links an earlier start date to better achievement. The folks on the school board seem convinced that it does.

From the course calendar of an expensive Canadian private school that offers AP courses:

IMPORTANT NOTE FOR AP COURSES FOR 2010-2011
If a student chooses one or more of: AP Biology, AP Chemistry, AP Physics B, AP Physics C, AP Calculus BC then the student can take a maximum of seven courses inside the timetable as these courses will have extra periods for 2010-2011.

... So that reads like the school resorts to scheduling extra class sessions of those demanding AP courses, in order to fit in all the content before the May AP exams, given a September start. I wonder if US schools that start in September do anything like this. Those courses are offered on the regular full-year schedule in Cobb County high schools.

[roxyrn]

My daughters took many AP classes at their Connecticut high school, and despite the fact that they started after Labor Day, had two spring vacation weeks (February and April) as well as Jewish holidays, Columbus Day and Election Day off, managed to do quite well as did their classmates. After AP exams were done, they had a month-six weeks (depending on snow days) of extra coursework that went above and beyond the AP course requirements. That said, I think they were at a disadvantage when applying to colleges with rolling early admissions because kids in the South were able to finish, have transcripts ready to send out early in the summer whereas our kids had to wait until the following September.

[Craziaskowboi]

Originally Posted by matt8325

They've been out of school longer than 2 months. Most schools had their last day around May 21st. So, basically 2 1/2 months. About the same as students everywhere around the country. The reason why students go to school so late elsewhere is because they're in school until the end of June. It can be just as hot in June as it is in August, so I guess people who want students to start back after Labor day want kids to be in school well into June ?

Average high temperatures are higher in September than they are in June. This goes for virtually everywhere in the U.S. outside California and the desert Southwest.

[matt8325]

Originally Posted by Gnutella

Average high temperatures are higher in September than they are in June. This goes for virtually everywhere in the U.S. outside California and the desert Southwest.

This is a joke right ? Average high in June in Atlanta is 87. Average high in September is 82. Not to mention the fact that humidity is usually much lower in September. On average, September is just slightly warmer than May. It's not just Atlanta either. In Minneapolis the avg high in June is 79 and 71 in September. In Pittsburgh average high is 80 in June and 76 in September. In NYC, it's 77 in June and 74 in September. The 3 hottest months of the year in most places are June, July, and August. That's just common sense. And in Atlanta, the average high in June is only 1 degree lower than in August. Average high in June is 87, 89 in July, and 88 in August. So really not much of a difference at all in those 3 months.

[RainyRainyDay]

Interestingly, according to the charts of Averages on weather.com, while June/Sep average highs are indeed 87/82 in Atlanta, they're 84/81 respectively in Sandy Springs, Marietta, Roswell, Cumming, et al. However, for Kennesaw this source gives 86/83.

Therefore, June and September temps are more similar in the northern suburbs, generally, than they are in the City of Atlanta, where temperatures apparently zoom up more in spring. It's probably a heat island due to all the paving, etc. matt8325 is correct, but the difference in the suburbs is not so great.

Why, however, is Kennesaw hotter than Marietta, and in September, even hotter than Atlanta? That seems odd.